Garrett Goebel | 1 Jun 19:02 2004

RE: MS heads for H.C.

Brian Densmore wrote:
>
> >> > No one has ever accused Microsoft of failing to test the
> >> > legal limits of competitive practices.
> >>
> >> That's not the problem. The problem is the fact they seem to
> >> have a get out of jail free card. Any small business or individual
> >> that used the same tactics would be in jail now doing 10-20!
> >
> >That's a strawman argument. Small businesses aren't in a
> >position to use the same tactics.
>
> Why? Criminal behavior is criminal. This kind of attitude
> about corruption is part of the problem. If more people demanded
> real justice be carried out, then perhaps things would change.

By "position", I meant small businesses aren't usually in a "market leader" position. And can not therefore use their dominance in the market to seed new product through bundling, push new defacto standards, or create partner/volume licensing agreements which discourage competition.

When people usually grind the "corruption" and "real justice" axes... What they're usually saying is "Why can't it be the way I want/see it?" And by extension, why can't the government force everyone to adhere to my values and principles. -Personally I think the carrying out of "real justice" by the government is often an example of where the cure is worse than the disease.

I think it'd be far better to beat Microsoft by delivering better architecture, interfaces, code, service, and documentation. Where "better" is judged by actual adoption, usage, and market share. If/when Linux begins to dominate more market sectors, I hope it will be because it has out competed MS despite their "unfair" practices. -Not because people have persuaded the government that it needs to move in and regulate the computer industry.


The anti-trust findings of fact found that Microsoft did hold a monopoly position. But monopolies aren't a crime. Not unless they are found guilty in a court of law to have excluded competitors or controlled prices. Now you, I, and 99.999% of the /. community might all be in agreement here. But we've been preempted. After the most recent anti-trust action against Microsoft, the government settled. I.e., Microsoft was not found guilty. All they have to do is abide by the settlement until Nov 8, 2007. Can you guess when Longhorn will finally ship?



> >> Ummm ... yeah? And the point is? Linux desktops now
> >> outnumber Apple
> >> and that number is likely to double in the next year?
> >
> >Check out google.com/zeitgeist. Linux stands at 1%. Apple at 4%.
> >Show me a study that says Linux has displaced Apple. I'm interested.
> >I've got a running $100 bet that by 12/31/05 Linux will
> >displace Apple. I'd love to collect on it.
>
> I could show you studies that give different numbers than
> that, but that is the problem with studies, they are plagued
> by the mindset of the person who designed the study.
...
> The most recent numbers I've seen for Apple and Linux
> desktops puts the numbers at a little over 3% and 2.8% so I'd say
> you stand a good chance of winning your bet.

I hope so...


--
Garrett Goebel
IS Development Specialist

ScriptPro                   Direct: 913.403.5261
5828 Reeds Road               Main: 913.384.1008
Mission, KS 66202              Fax: 913.384.2180
www.scriptpro.com          garrett at scriptpro dot com

Brian Densmore | 1 Jun 21:47 2004

RE: MS heads for H.C.


-----Original Message-----
> From: Garrett Goebel
>
>> Why? Criminal behavior is criminal. This kind of attitude 
>> about corruption is part of the problem. If more people demanded 
>> real justice be carried out, then perhaps things would change. 
> ... When people usually grind the "corruption" and "real justice" 
> axes... What they're usually saying is "Why can't it be the way I
> want/see it?" And by extension, why can't the government force
> everyone to adhere to my values and principles. -Personally I
> think the carrying out of "real justice" by the government is
> often an example of where the cure is worse than the disease.
I'm talking about actual breaking of codified law, which M$ has been
found guilty of in the past and in numerous cases has settled out
of court prior to being convicted. M$ is a multiple offender of
copyright and trademarks and also probably guilty of extortion,
racketeering,money laundering (see SCO funding), libel, barratry,
and fraud. Not to mention violations which I have never heard of.
Albeit the case that I speak of were all civil cases. I'm talking about
theft. The strong arming of manufacturers which is essentially a 
"shakedown" or "I'm gonna make you an offer you can't refuse" or
"protection" (aka extortion and racketeering). Granted small businesses
can't usually do this without the used of "hired hands". Doesn't make
it any less legal. Ok, I'm sure there are other giant companies that 
are guilty of many of the same practices. Ok so I may be a dreamer, but I
really believe in "equal protection of the law" for everyone.
And if you think that copyright violation is no big deal, remember they are
locking people up now for software "piracy" of the level M$ has been 
found guilty of (anyone remember stacker?).

> If/when Linux begins to dominate more market sectors, I hope it
> will be because it has out competed MS despite their "unfair"
> practices. Not because people have persuaded the government that
> it needs to move in and regulate the computer industry.
Me too. I'm confident that will be the case, though.

Jim Herrmann | 2 Jun 10:01 2004

Re: RoadRunner with Phone

I'd be interested to know how much Everest is, and how much TW all 
inclusive is, in different parts of the city.  A friend once told me 
that in an area that had Everest, they could get the TW everything 
(cable, internet, and phone) package for $85 per month.  Anyone else 
heard of that?  That's what I keep telling the telemarketers when they 
call about the phone service.  Get me a package deal of everything for 
$85 per month, and you got a sale.  If I can't get the same deal other 
people in the same general area are getting, then don't bother me.  I'd 
like to hear what others are hearing about the package deals around town.

Thanks,
Jim

Zscoundrel wrote:

> Do you REALLY want all contact with the outside world to come from TW???
>
> I had to laugh when I saw their commercial.  They are charging as much 
> as SBC for a service that is an add on - and I am willing to bet you 
> HAVE to have their cable service to get phone service from them.  If 
> you are in an area with Everest, they have an all in one package that 
> $4$ blows TW's doors off.
>
> Robert Kennedy wrote:
>
>> Hi All,
>>
>> I know we've skirted around this issue lately with the
>> RR vs DSL discussion and another thread or two. I've
>> just tried several searches of the archives with
>> either no matches, or a match from 1993.
>>
>> Today some flinking telemarketer got thru to my wife
>> and pitched Time Warner's phone service as an addition
>> to our RoadRunner. Now she's all excited about saving
>> a few $$$ thinking that phone service is phone
>> service.
>
>

B. Liggett | 2 Jun 14:41 2004

Re: RoadRunner with Phone

Jim,
    You've got it right.  TW will open up "special deals" for the
neighborhoods that Everest is preparing to construct in.  If the house
across the street from you is going to get Everest service, but they don't
get to your side of the street....you don't get the deal!  TW has even
pulled back deals to certain neighborhoods after originally offering them
special deals because Everest originally planned to contruct that
neighborhood and then ended up not doing so.  In Independence, where there
is no hope of competition, I pay around $175 a month for cable TV, internet
and phone service through SBC & Comcast.

Brad

> I'd be interested to know how much Everest is, and how much TW all
> inclusive is, in different parts of the city.  A friend once told me
> that in an area that had Everest, they could get the TW everything
> (cable, internet, and phone) package for $85 per month.  Anyone else
> heard of that?  That's what I keep telling the telemarketers when they
> call about the phone service.  Get me a package deal of everything for
> $85 per month, and you got a sale.  If I can't get the same deal other
> people in the same general area are getting, then don't bother me.  I'd
> like to hear what others are hearing about the package deals around town.
>
> Thanks,
> Jim
>

kurt | 2 Jun 15:09 2004

RE: RoadRunner with Phone


From what I had heard once, TW is only offering those "deals" in areas that
have Everest. Perhaps its just a way to compete. My friend ran into that
situation when he moved out of an Everest area. The price was suddently
different.

Kurt

-----Original Message-----
From: Jim Herrmann [mailto:kclug@...] 
Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2004 3:02 AM
To: kclug@...
Subject: Re: RoadRunner with Phone

I'd be interested to know how much Everest is, and how much TW all inclusive
is, in different parts of the city.  A friend once told me that in an area
that had Everest, they could get the TW everything (cable, internet, and
phone) package for $85 per month.  Anyone else heard of that?  That's what I
keep telling the telemarketers when they call about the phone service.  Get
me a package deal of everything for
$85 per month, and you got a sale.  If I can't get the same deal other
people in the same general area are getting, then don't bother me.  I'd like
to hear what others are hearing about the package deals around town.

Thanks,
Jim

---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
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Leonard, Phil | 2 Jun 15:12 2004

RE: RoadRunner with Phone

> I'd be interested to know how much Everest is, and how much TW all
> inclusive is, in different parts of the city.  A friend once told me
> that in an area that had Everest, they could get the TW everything
> (cable, internet, and phone) package for $85 per month.  Anyone else
> heard of that?  That's what I keep telling the telemarketers when they
> call about the phone service.  Get me a package deal of everything for
> $85 per month, and you got a sale.  If I can't get the same deal other
> people in the same general area are getting, then don't bother me.  I'd
> like to hear what others are hearing about the package deals around town.

I'm in Overland Park just a few blocks south of the Sprint campus and I have the full Everest package, phone
(with all the vmail stuff), cable, 4MB internet, and static IP.  That comes to $170/month.  DSL was not
available at my house because I'm too far away.  I had Speakeasy DSL at the old house and was very pleased with it.

Philip

Brian Kelsay | 2 Jun 22:17 2004

LUG meeting tonight!

The KCLUG meets tonight at Foss at 5:30p.   I will probably be late, so if someone can bring a wireless AP, that
would help out the wireless laptop users.   Bring your favorite LiveCD Linux distro.  As far as I know we were
approved to use the class room computers with a LiveCD Linux.   Just don't goof up their Winders boxes.

Here's some LiveCD goodness:
http://www.frozentech.com/content/livecd.php

Just look in the different categories for something that suits you or bring Knoppix, the everything but the
kitchen sink distro.

Brian Kelsay

Picon

Computer For Sale

Hello All,

 

Just over a month ago, I decided I needed a separate computer dedicated to a piece of software I’m developing.  Unfortunately, fate has not smiled on me in the last month, and now I need to sell it.  Here’s the specs on the computer:

 

AMD Athlon XP processor 3200+ ( 2.2 Ghz) Advanced 400 MHz front side bus

512 Megs Ram (64 MB shared with video)

80 Gb Harddrive

DVD+RW / CD-RW

Extra CD-ROM ( I can throw in a replace CD-RW a couple years older.)

Front Panel 9 in 1 memory card reader

 

ASUS A7V8Z-LA motherboard

Integrated AC97 audio

 

It also same with a 17”” CRT monitor that is also for sale.

 

Ok, As soon as I got it, I wiped the computer of Windows Home edition and installed SUSE 9.1 Professional.  I tried to take the computer back, however, and I reinstalled XP Professional.  Unfortunately it didn’t really come with recover CD’s so the original software is lost unless you want to send it in to Compaq.  I can however load any number of Linux Distros on it, including the ones I’ve paid licenses for:

 

Lindows 4.5 ( well, I got it free through OS News )

Lycoris Desktop/LX Developer Edition ( $50 value )

Suse 9.0.  I need to check the license for Suse 9.1 to see if it will allow on multiple machines, and if so, I can put that on there, but I’m using one copy on my other computer.

 

I’ve also loaded Fedora Core 1 on it and it works well.

 

Some things that don’t play nice with linux: 

3D acceleration – I might have gotten this to work, but truth is I didn’t really try.  There is an open AGP slot

DVD-RW – couldn’t ever get it to work.  It burns CD’s great though, at a blazing 16x

NIC – I had trouble with this at first, but later determined that it was actually my router giving it problems.  I can through in a National Semiconductors Network card that I know works if needed, though.

 

Other than that, it’s a great computer, and I wish I could keep it.  Unfortunately, there aren’t many businesses out there wanting to pay for a website, so I’m stuck. And my roomies moved out, so there’s rent to pay also. 

 

Anyway, if you think you might be interested in this computer, I’m willing to negotiate on prices.  I do have a buyer lined up (my parents) but I would prefer to sell to someone else, simply because in the three years I’ve been in college, I’ve not yet had to take money from them, and selling to them would be too much like that.  But I digress

 

I hope to hear from you.

 

Josh

 

 

 

 

J C | 3 Jun 12:07 2004
Picon
Picon

Netscape open port

I seem to be having an issue with netscape navigator 7.1.  I don't use
Netscape hardly but it came with the ditro I'm using, Slackware 9.1.  I
run nmap on my network quite often.  What I have found is that everytime
Netscape is running port 5180 is open.  Nmap does not give any info
regarding the port and says it's unknown. I tried to establish a
connection with port 5180 and I recived a 404 error like some sort of
web service is running on it.

Does anyone know anything regarding Netscape and that particular port?

Thanks.

Phoenician | 3 Jun 15:54 2004

RE: Netscape open port

<snip>
I seem to be having an issue with netscape navigator 7.1.  I don't use
Netscape hardly but it came with the ditro I'm using, Slackware 9.1.  I
run nmap on my network quite often.  What I have found is that everytime
Netscape is running port 5180 is open.  Nmap does not give any info
regarding the port and says it's unknown. I tried to establish a
connection with port 5180 and I recived a 404 error like some sort of
web service is running on it.
<snip>

I believe that is one of the ports that AIM uses which is integrated
with Netscape to one degree or another.

- Michienne


Gmane