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Aleksandr Kravets | 2 Mar 2009 17:39
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Re: carriage return in attribute

Thanks Michael,

I understand about XML rules for processing of carriage returns. I am dealing with an XML document that in being imported into my application. I am not sure if it has been serialized correctly or not, but if I read through this document byte-by-byte I see carriage return (13) and newline (10) as termination characters in an attribute that is a String. I know it's probably wrong to put these characters in an attribute and this should have been a value of the element inside a CDATA, but this is the document that I need to work with.
So once I parse this document all CRLFs are converted to LFs and I am left with a line with newlines which changes how this attribute is displayed - string is displayed in line instead of having newlines visible.
Now, I guess I can read through the document before it is imported (without parser) and replace all CRLFs with 
 to make it correct. However, this would be ugly and I was wondering if there is an easier way to deal with this.

Hope I am being clear in what I am trying to achieve.

thanks,
Alex

On Sat, Feb 28, 2009 at 10:53 AM, Michael Glavassevich <mrglavas <at> ca.ibm.com> wrote:

I'm not sure what you're asking for. Attribute value normalization [1] is part of the parsing process. It occurs before the data is presented to an application through any of the standard APIs.

[1] http://www.w3.org/TR/2006/REC-xml-20060816/#AVNormalize

Michael Glavassevich
XML Parser Development
IBM Toronto Lab
E-mail: mrglavas <at> ca.ibm.com
E-mail: mrglavas <at> apache.org

Aleksandr Kravets <akravets.work <at> gmail.com> wrote on 02/27/2009 10:07:08 AM:



> Thanks.
> Are there utilities in Xerces that allow carriage returns
> normalization easier than let's say parsing the whole document and
> doing it manually?


> On Thu, Feb 26, 2009 at 6:39 PM, <keshlam <at> us.ibm.com> wrote:
> Carriage return is ASCII 13, so &#13; or &xD; will represent that character.
>
> However, be sure you understand XML's rules for whitespace
> normalization in attribute values. Depending on what you're trying
> to do, you may want to replace that attribute with a child
> element... or replace the offending character with some notation
> that your application, rather than XML, will process appropriately.
>
> ______________________________________
> "... Three things see no end: A loop with exit code done wrong,
> A semaphore untested, And the change that comes along. ..."
>  -- "Threes" Rev 1.1 - Duane Elms / Leslie Fish (http://www.ovff.
> org/pegasus/songs/threes-rev-11.html)

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keshlam | 2 Mar 2009 18:21
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Re: carriage return in attribute

The purpose of an XML parser is to read correct XML. Get whoever's 
generating that file to produce XML that expresses their intent correctly, 
or throw in a filtering stage that corrects their error.  Personally, I 
would apply a clue-by-four to the author of whatever's generating that 
document rather than trying to tolerate it, since they're just going to 
get themselves in deeper trouble later... but I understand that this isn't 
always possible.

"The customer isn't always right. Unfortunately, the customer is always 
the one with the money."

______________________________________
"... Three things see no end: A loop with exit code done wrong,
A semaphore untested, And the change that comes along. ..."
  -- "Threes" Rev 1.1 - Duane Elms / Leslie Fish (
http://www.ovff.org/pegasus/songs/threes-rev-11.html)
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Aleksandr Kravets | 2 Mar 2009 18:26
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Re: carriage return in attribute

Totally agree, but even if originating XML is corrected, there are clients with wrong style XML that will use my application to import XML and in such a case there is little I can do. So, is there a way to correct this problem during the import?

Thanks for your help,
Alex

On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:21 PM, <keshlam <at> us.ibm.com> wrote:
The purpose of an XML parser is to read correct XML. Get whoever's
generating that file to produce XML that expresses their intent correctly,
or throw in a filtering stage that corrects their error.  Personally, I
would apply a clue-by-four to the author of whatever's generating that
document rather than trying to tolerate it, since they're just going to
get themselves in deeper trouble later... but I understand that this isn't
always possible.

"The customer isn't always right. Unfortunately, the customer is always
the one with the money."

______________________________________
"... Three things see no end: A loop with exit code done wrong,
A semaphore untested, And the change that comes along. ..."
 -- "Threes" Rev 1.1 - Duane Elms / Leslie Fish (
http://www.ovff.org/pegasus/songs/threes-rev-11.html)

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Aleksandr Kravets | 2 Mar 2009 19:20
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Re: carriage return in attribute

Ok, I think I found an issue similar to mine, it is in this thread: http://www.stylusstudio.com/xsllist/200404/post40600.html

Particular line of interest to me is this:

"BTW, if you want your attribute to have a carriage return, you can use an entity to express the carriage return, then it doesn't get normalized."

So can someone explain what this means and how do I describe these entities? May be I can insert them into XML before importing and letting parser do its work?

thanks,
Alex



On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:26 PM, Aleksandr Kravets <akravets.work <at> gmail.com> wrote:
Totally agree, but even if originating XML is corrected, there are clients with wrong style XML that will use my application to import XML and in such a case there is little I can do. So, is there a way to correct this problem during the import?

Thanks for your help,
Alex


On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:21 PM, <keshlam <at> us.ibm.com> wrote:
The purpose of an XML parser is to read correct XML. Get whoever's
generating that file to produce XML that expresses their intent correctly,
or throw in a filtering stage that corrects their error.  Personally, I
would apply a clue-by-four to the author of whatever's generating that
document rather than trying to tolerate it, since they're just going to
get themselves in deeper trouble later... but I understand that this isn't
always possible.

"The customer isn't always right. Unfortunately, the customer is always
the one with the money."

______________________________________
"... Three things see no end: A loop with exit code done wrong,
A semaphore untested, And the change that comes along. ..."
 -- "Threes" Rev 1.1 - Duane Elms / Leslie Fish (
http://www.ovff.org/pegasus/songs/threes-rev-11.html)

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Paul Gearon | 2 Mar 2009 19:36
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Re: carriage return in attribute

I'm not saying that this is the answer to your problem, but the entity
referred to here is:
  &#x0D;

Paul

On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:20 PM, Aleksandr Kravets
<akravets.work <at> gmail.com> wrote:
> Ok, I think I found an issue similar to mine, it is in this thread:
> http://www.stylusstudio.com/xsllist/200404/post40600.html
>
> Particular line of interest to me is this:
>
> "BTW, if you want your attribute to have a carriage return, you can use an
> entity to express the carriage return, then it doesn't get normalized."
>
> So can someone explain what this means and how do I describe these entities?
> May be I can insert them into XML before importing and letting parser do its
> work?
>
> thanks,
> Alex
>
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:26 PM, Aleksandr Kravets <akravets.work <at> gmail.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> Totally agree, but even if originating XML is corrected, there are clients
>> with wrong style XML that will use my application to import XML and in such
>> a case there is little I can do. So, is there a way to correct this problem
>> during the import?
>>
>> Thanks for your help,
>> Alex
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:21 PM, <keshlam <at> us.ibm.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> The purpose of an XML parser is to read correct XML. Get whoever's
>>> generating that file to produce XML that expresses their intent
>>> correctly,
>>> or throw in a filtering stage that corrects their error.  Personally, I
>>> would apply a clue-by-four to the author of whatever's generating that
>>> document rather than trying to tolerate it, since they're just going to
>>> get themselves in deeper trouble later... but I understand that this
>>> isn't
>>> always possible.
>>>
>>> "The customer isn't always right. Unfortunately, the customer is always
>>> the one with the money."
>>>
>>> ______________________________________
>>> "... Three things see no end: A loop with exit code done wrong,
>>> A semaphore untested, And the change that comes along. ..."
>>>  -- "Threes" Rev 1.1 - Duane Elms / Leslie Fish (
>>> http://www.ovff.org/pegasus/songs/threes-rev-11.html)
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: j-users-unsubscribe <at> xerces.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: j-users-help <at> xerces.apache.org
>>>
>>
>
>
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Aleksandr Kravets | 2 Mar 2009 19:39
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Re: carriage return in attribute

So it would need to be replaced in place of carriage return manually?

On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 1:36 PM, Paul Gearon <gearon <at> ieee.org> wrote:
I'm not saying that this is the answer to your problem, but the entity
referred to here is:
 &#x0D;

Paul

On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:20 PM, Aleksandr Kravets
<akravets.work <at> gmail.com> wrote:
> Ok, I think I found an issue similar to mine, it is in this thread:
> http://www.stylusstudio.com/xsllist/200404/post40600.html
>
> Particular line of interest to me is this:
>
> "BTW, if you want your attribute to have a carriage return, you can use an
> entity to express the carriage return, then it doesn't get normalized."
>
> So can someone explain what this means and how do I describe these entities?
> May be I can insert them into XML before importing and letting parser do its
> work?
>
> thanks,
> Alex
>
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:26 PM, Aleksandr Kravets <akravets.work <at> gmail.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> Totally agree, but even if originating XML is corrected, there are clients
>> with wrong style XML that will use my application to import XML and in such
>> a case there is little I can do. So, is there a way to correct this problem
>> during the import?
>>
>> Thanks for your help,
>> Alex
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:21 PM, <keshlam <at> us.ibm.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> The purpose of an XML parser is to read correct XML. Get whoever's
>>> generating that file to produce XML that expresses their intent
>>> correctly,
>>> or throw in a filtering stage that corrects their error.  Personally, I
>>> would apply a clue-by-four to the author of whatever's generating that
>>> document rather than trying to tolerate it, since they're just going to
>>> get themselves in deeper trouble later... but I understand that this
>>> isn't
>>> always possible.
>>>
>>> "The customer isn't always right. Unfortunately, the customer is always
>>> the one with the money."
>>>
>>> ______________________________________
>>> "... Three things see no end: A loop with exit code done wrong,
>>> A semaphore untested, And the change that comes along. ..."
>>>  -- "Threes" Rev 1.1 - Duane Elms / Leslie Fish (
>>> http://www.ovff.org/pegasus/songs/threes-rev-11.html)
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: j-users-unsubscribe <at> xerces.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: j-users-help <at> xerces.apache.org
>>>
>>
>
>

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Paul Gearon | 2 Mar 2009 19:45
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Re: carriage return in attribute

Well, it's legal to have these entities in your attributes, and it's
not legal to have a carriage return in an attribute, so if you can
replace one with the other, then great.

The problem with doing a pre-filter like this is ONLY replacing
carriage returns that are inside attributes. You'll need some sort of
parser for that, and the parser will need to know a fair amount of
XML. Do you see where this is going?  :-)

Really, anyone generating faulty XML like this needs to be instructed
in the error of their ways. I mean, what are they creating the XML
for? Is there some parser out there that is currently handling these
faulty documents for them?

Paul

On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:39 PM, Aleksandr Kravets
<akravets.work <at> gmail.com> wrote:
> So it would need to be replaced in place of carriage return manually?
>
> On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 1:36 PM, Paul Gearon <gearon <at> ieee.org> wrote:
>>
>> I'm not saying that this is the answer to your problem, but the entity
>> referred to here is:
>>  &#x0D;
>>
>> Paul
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:20 PM, Aleksandr Kravets
>> <akravets.work <at> gmail.com> wrote:
>> > Ok, I think I found an issue similar to mine, it is in this thread:
>> > http://www.stylusstudio.com/xsllist/200404/post40600.html
>> >
>> > Particular line of interest to me is this:
>> >
>> > "BTW, if you want your attribute to have a carriage return, you can use
>> > an
>> > entity to express the carriage return, then it doesn't get normalized."
>> >
>> > So can someone explain what this means and how do I describe these
>> > entities?
>> > May be I can insert them into XML before importing and letting parser do
>> > its
>> > work?
>> >
>> > thanks,
>> > Alex
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:26 PM, Aleksandr Kravets
>> > <akravets.work <at> gmail.com>
>> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Totally agree, but even if originating XML is corrected, there are
>> >> clients
>> >> with wrong style XML that will use my application to import XML and in
>> >> such
>> >> a case there is little I can do. So, is there a way to correct this
>> >> problem
>> >> during the import?
>> >>
>> >> Thanks for your help,
>> >> Alex
>> >>
>> >> On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:21 PM, <keshlam <at> us.ibm.com> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> The purpose of an XML parser is to read correct XML. Get whoever's
>> >>> generating that file to produce XML that expresses their intent
>> >>> correctly,
>> >>> or throw in a filtering stage that corrects their error.  Personally,
>> >>> I
>> >>> would apply a clue-by-four to the author of whatever's generating that
>> >>> document rather than trying to tolerate it, since they're just going
>> >>> to
>> >>> get themselves in deeper trouble later... but I understand that this
>> >>> isn't
>> >>> always possible.
>> >>>
>> >>> "The customer isn't always right. Unfortunately, the customer is
>> >>> always
>> >>> the one with the money."
>> >>>
>> >>> ______________________________________
>> >>> "... Three things see no end: A loop with exit code done wrong,
>> >>> A semaphore untested, And the change that comes along. ..."
>> >>>  -- "Threes" Rev 1.1 - Duane Elms / Leslie Fish (
>> >>> http://www.ovff.org/pegasus/songs/threes-rev-11.html)
>> >>>
>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: j-users-unsubscribe <at> xerces.apache.org
>> >>> For additional commands, e-mail: j-users-help <at> xerces.apache.org
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: j-users-unsubscribe <at> xerces.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: j-users-help <at> xerces.apache.org
>>
>
>
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Michael Glavassevich | 2 Mar 2009 19:46
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Re: carriage return in attribute

It should have been written by the producer/serializer of the XML document if the carriage return is actually part of the document's content.

Michael Glavassevich
XML Parser Development
IBM Toronto Lab
E-mail: mrglavas <at> ca.ibm.com
E-mail: mrglavas <at> apache.org

Aleksandr Kravets <akravets.work <at> gmail.com> wrote on 03/02/2009 01:39:35 PM:

> So it would need to be replaced in place of carriage return manually?

> On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 1:36 PM, Paul Gearon <gearon <at> ieee.org> wrote:
> I'm not saying that this is the answer to your problem, but the entity
> referred to here is:
>  &#x0D;
>
> Paul
>
> On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:20 PM, Aleksandr Kravets
> <akravets.work <at> gmail.com> wrote:
> > Ok, I think I found an issue similar to mine, it is in this thread:
> > http://www.stylusstudio.com/xsllist/200404/post40600.html
> >
> > Particular line of interest to me is this:
> >
> > "BTW, if you want your attribute to have a carriage return, you can use an
> > entity to express the carriage return, then it doesn't get normalized."
> >
> > So can someone explain what this means and how do I describe theseentities?
> > May be I can insert them into XML before importing and letting parser do its
> > work?
> >
> > thanks,
> > Alex
> >
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:26 PM, Aleksandr Kravets <akravets.work <at> gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >>
> >> Totally agree, but even if originating XML is corrected, there are clients
> >> with wrong style XML that will use my application to import XML and in such
> >> a case there is little I can do. So, is there a way to correct this problem
> >> during the import?
> >>
> >> Thanks for your help,
> >> Alex
> >>
> >> On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:21 PM, <keshlam <at> us.ibm.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> The purpose of an XML parser is to read correct XML. Get whoever's
> >>> generating that file to produce XML that expresses their intent
> >>> correctly,
> >>> or throw in a filtering stage that corrects their error.  Personally, I
> >>> would apply a clue-by-four to the author of whatever's generating that
> >>> document rather than trying to tolerate it, since they're just going to
> >>> get themselves in deeper trouble later... but I understand that this
> >>> isn't
> >>> always possible.
> >>>
> >>> "The customer isn't always right. Unfortunately, the customer is always
> >>> the one with the money."
> >>>
> >>> ______________________________________
> >>> "... Three things see no end: A loop with exit code done wrong,
> >>> A semaphore untested, And the change that comes along. ..."
> >>>  -- "Threes" Rev 1.1 - Duane Elms / Leslie Fish (
> >>> http://www.ovff.org/pegasus/songs/threes-rev-11.html)
> >>>
> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: j-users-unsubscribe <at> xerces.apache.org
> >>> For additional commands, e-mail: j-users-help <at> xerces.apache.org
> >>>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: j-users-unsubscribe <at> xerces.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: j-users-help <at> xerces.apache.org

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keshlam | 2 Mar 2009 19:49
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Favicon

Re: carriage return in attribute

Actually, &#xD; or &#13; are technically "numeric character references", not entity references. Check the spec, but if I'm remembering the whitespace rules correctly, these may get converted early enough not to help in this case. You may need an actual &CR; entity defined in the DTD.

______________________________________
"... Three things see no end: A loop with exit code done wrong,
A semaphore untested, And the change that comes along. ..."
 -- "Threes" Rev 1.1 - Duane Elms / Leslie Fish (http://www.ovff.org/pegasus/songs/threes-rev-11.html)


Paul Gearon <gearon <at> ieee.org>
Sent by: gearon <at> gmail.com

03/02/2009 01:36 PM

Please respond to
j-users <at> xerces.apache.org
To
 j-users <at> xerces.apache.org
cc
Subject
 Re: carriage return in attribute





I'm not saying that this is the answer to your problem, but the entity
referred to here is:
 &#x0D;

Paul

On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:20 PM, Aleksandr Kravets
<akravets.work <at> gmail.com> wrote:
> Ok, I think I found an issue similar to mine, it is in this thread:
> http://www.stylusstudio.com/xsllist/200404/post40600.html
>
> Particular line of interest to me is this:
>
> "BTW, if you want your attribute to have a carriage return, you can use an
> entity to express the carriage return, then it doesn't get normalized."
>
> So can someone explain what this means and how do I describe these entities?
> May be I can insert them into XML before importing and letting parser do its
> work?
>
> thanks,
> Alex
>
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:26 PM, Aleksandr Kravets <akravets.work <at> gmail.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> Totally agree, but even if originating XML is corrected, there are clients
>> with wrong style XML that will use my application to import XML and in such
>> a case there is little I can do. So, is there a way to correct this problem
>> during the import?
>>
>> Thanks for your help,
>> Alex
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:21 PM, <keshlam <at> us.ibm.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> The purpose of an XML parser is to read correct XML. Get whoever's
>>> generating that file to produce XML that expresses their intent
>>> correctly,
>>> or throw in a filtering stage that corrects their error.  Personally, I
>>> would apply a clue-by-four to the author of whatever's generating that
>>> document rather than trying to tolerate it, since they're just going to
>>> get themselves in deeper trouble later... but I understand that this
>>> isn't
>>> always possible.
>>>
>>> "The customer isn't always right. Unfortunately, the customer is always
>>> the one with the money."
>>>
>>> ______________________________________
>>> "... Three things see no end: A loop with exit code done wrong,
>>> A semaphore untested, And the change that comes along. ..."
>>>  -- "Threes" Rev 1.1 - Duane Elms / Leslie Fish (
>>> http://www.ovff.org/pegasus/songs/threes-rev-11.html)
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: j-users-unsubscribe <at> xerces.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: j-users-help <at> xerces.apache.org
>>>
>>
>
>

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Aleksandr Kravets | 2 Mar 2009 19:54
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Re: carriage return in attribute

Thanks guys. I guess the only thing that is left for me to do is talk to XML originator with "XML for Dummies" in one hand and a baseball bat in the other :)

On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 1:49 PM, <keshlam <at> us.ibm.com> wrote:
Actually, &#xD; or &#13; are technically "numeric character references", not entity references. Check the spec, but if I'm remembering the whitespace rules correctly, these may get converted early enough not to help in this case. You may need an actual &CR; entity defined in the DTD.

______________________________________
"... Three things see no end: A loop with exit code done wrong,
A semaphore untested, And the change that comes along. ..."
 -- "Threes" Rev 1.1 - Duane Elms / Leslie Fish (http://www.ovff.org/pegasus/songs/threes-rev-11.html)


Paul Gearon <gearon <at> ieee.org>
Sent by: gearon <at> gmail.com

03/02/2009 01:36 PM


To
 j-users <at> xerces.apache.org
cc
Subject
 Re: carriage return in attribute





I'm not saying that this is the answer to your problem, but the entity
referred to here is:
 &#x0D;

Paul

On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:20 PM, Aleksandr Kravets
<akravets.work <at> gmail.com> wrote:
> Ok, I think I found an issue similar to mine, it is in this thread:
> http://www.stylusstudio.com/xsllist/200404/post40600.html
>
> Particular line of interest to me is this:
>
> "BTW, if you want your attribute to have a carriage return, you can use an
> entity to express the carriage return, then it doesn't get normalized."
>
> So can someone explain what this means and how do I describe these entities?
> May be I can insert them into XML before importing and letting parser do its
> work?
>
> thanks,
> Alex
>
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:26 PM, Aleksandr Kravets <akravets.work <at> gmail.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> Totally agree, but even if originating XML is corrected, there are clients
>> with wrong style XML that will use my application to import XML and in such
>> a case there is little I can do. So, is there a way to correct this problem
>> during the import?
>>
>> Thanks for your help,
>> Alex
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:21 PM, <keshlam <at> us.ibm.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> The purpose of an XML parser is to read correct XML. Get whoever's
>>> generating that file to produce XML that expresses their intent
>>> correctly,
>>> or throw in a filtering stage that corrects their error.  Personally, I
>>> would apply a clue-by-four to the author of whatever's generating that
>>> document rather than trying to tolerate it, since they're just going to
>>> get themselves in deeper trouble later... but I understand that this
>>> isn't
>>> always possible.
>>>
>>> "The customer isn't always right. Unfortunately, the customer is always
>>> the one with the money."
>>>
>>> ______________________________________
>>> "... Three things see no end: A loop with exit code done wrong,
>>> A semaphore untested, And the change that comes along. ..."
>>>  -- "Threes" Rev 1.1 - Duane Elms / Leslie Fish (
>>> http://www.ovff.org/pegasus/songs/threes-rev-11.html)
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: j-users-unsubscribe <at> xerces.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: j-users-help <at> xerces.apache.org
>>>
>>
>
>

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