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Platonides | 1 Oct 2011 01:32
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Re: Google's cached pages are much faster than wiki*edia's

jidanni <at> jidanni.org wrote:
> Fellows,
>
>    This is Google's cache of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Devo. It is a
>    snapshot of the page as it appeared on 28 Sep 2011 09:22:50 GMT. The
>    current page could have changed in the meantime. Learn more ...
>
> Like why is it so much faster than the real thing? Even when not logged in.
>
> Nope, you may be one of the top ranked websites, but no by speed.
>
> So if you can't beat 'em join 'em. Somehow use Google's caches instead
> of your own. Something, anything, for a little more speed.

You mean, sending arbitrarily old cached versions of the page?
Yeah, that would speed things up.
But I don't think that's what our editors expect from us :)
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Platonides | 1 Oct 2011 01:35
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Re: pages jerk up and down every 10 seconds

jidanni <at> jidanni.org wrote:
> On some of the Wikipedia sites, there are some messages near the top of
> each page. These messages change every 10 or so seconds.
> The problem is the number of lines in each of the changing messages is
> not the same.
>
> This causes the entire page to jerk up and down the screen every 10 or
> so seconds. One might be reading many screenfulls below, but still the
> page jerks up and down. I've never seen anything like that in the
> history of WWW.
>
> You might want to have a look at it, or forward my message to those who
> are to blame.

Do they change in the same page view, or when changing pages?
(I have seen the later, when several campaigns are enabled, but the 
former shouldn't happen)
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Steve Summit | 1 Oct 2011 02:13
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Re: pages jerk up and down every 10 seconds

Platonides wrote:
> jidanni <at> jidanni.org wrote:
>> On some of the Wikipedia sites, there are some messages near the top of
>> each page. [...]  This causes the entire page to jerk up and down the screen...
>
> Do they change in the same page view, or when changing pages?
> (I have seen the later, when several campaigns are enabled, but the 
> former shouldn't happen)

I noticed something similar a few weeks ago.  It didn't quite
match jidanni's description, but it was certainly annoying.
The top-of-page message -- it might have been one about the image
tagging campaign -- was JavaScript-enabled, with a show/hide
button.  And, for me at least, it rendered initially in one
state, and then, after the entire rest of the page had loaded and
rendered, some last bit of JavaScript seemed to run, and flip the
show/collapse state.  By now, typically, I already had my mouse
over some regular link or edit button I intended to click, but
just as I did so, the page jumped by a few lines, and I'd miss.
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jidanni | 1 Oct 2011 05:15
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Re: pages jerk up and down every 10 seconds

Login to http://zh.wikipedia.org/ and stare at the screen for a few seconds.
Wait, it is probably due to me User:Jidanni being a member of some club.
Anyway, there is no way for a normal user to file a proper bug report
about it, as it is all hidden in javascript that he does not see.
I'll contact some of those club members about this problem.

Note that maybe their browsers have a wide enough screen so the line
counts of the messages are the same so they don't notice the problem.
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K. Peachey | 1 Oct 2011 05:19
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Re: pages jerk up and down every 10 seconds

On Sat, Oct 1, 2011 at 1:15 PM,  <jidanni <at> jidanni.org> wrote:
> Anyway, there is no way for a normal user to file a proper bug report
> about it, as it is all hidden in javascript that he does not see.

All users are welcome to file bugs at bugzilla, and this method is
frequently pushed/mentioned to users of all communities (although
there might be some language difficulties for users of the non English
language). Also most communities have a central noticeboard (For
example: [[Wikipedia:Village Pump]]  on the English Wikipedia) where
they can raise these issues.
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Jon Davis | 1 Oct 2011 07:27

Re: pages jerk up and down every 10 seconds

I see what he's talking about.  The page loads, then the site notice
javascript loads (pushing the page down) then the central notice loads.

It is rather obnoxious that the central notice loads a noticeable amount
_after_ everything else.  The div (or what ever container it is) could at
least be pre-load to the objects size when it loads.

-Jon

On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 20:15, <jidanni <at> jidanni.org> wrote:

> Login to http://zh.wikipedia.org/ and stare at the screen for a few
> seconds.
> Wait, it is probably due to me User:Jidanni being a member of some club.
> Anyway, there is no way for a normal user to file a proper bug report
> about it, as it is all hidden in javascript that he does not see.
> I'll contact some of those club members about this problem.
>
> Note that maybe their browsers have a wide enough screen so the line
> counts of the messages are the same so they don't notice the problem.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> Wikitech-l <at> lists.wikimedia.org
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>

--

-- 
Jon
[[User:ShakataGaNai]] / KJ6FNQ
(Continue reading)

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Daniel Friesen | 1 Oct 2011 08:03

Re: pages jerk up and down every 10 seconds

The central notice banner is only shown to logged in users. Why are we
even loading the notice in a separate out of band http request. And not
bothering to cache it at that.

~Daniel Friesen (Dantman, Nadir-Seen-Fire) [http://daniel.friesen.name]

On 11-09-30 10:27 PM, Jon Davis wrote:
> I see what he's talking about.  The page loads, then the site notice
> javascript loads (pushing the page down) then the central notice loads.
>
> It is rather obnoxious that the central notice loads a noticeable amount
> _after_ everything else.  The div (or what ever container it is) could at
> least be pre-load to the objects size when it loads.
>
> -Jon
>
> On Fri, Sep 30, 2011 at 20:15, <jidanni <at> jidanni.org> wrote:
>
>> Login to http://zh.wikipedia.org/ and stare at the screen for a few
>> seconds.
>> Wait, it is probably due to me User:Jidanni being a member of some club.
>> Anyway, there is no way for a normal user to file a proper bug report
>> about it, as it is all hidden in javascript that he does not see.
>> I'll contact some of those club members about this problem.
>>
>> Note that maybe their browsers have a wide enough screen so the line
>> counts of the messages are the same so they don't notice the problem.
>>
>> _____
(Continue reading)

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Roan Kattouw | 1 Oct 2011 10:07
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Re: pages jerk up and down every 10 seconds

On Sat, Oct 1, 2011 at 8:03 AM, Daniel Friesen
<lists <at> nadir-seen-fire.com> wrote:
> The central notice banner is only shown to logged in users. Why are we
> even loading the notice in a separate out of band http request. And not
> bothering to cache it at that.
>
It is cacheable (public, max-age=300, s-maxage=300) but for some
reason my browser (FF 6.0.1) isn't caching it. There are all sorts of
reasons CN needs to load the notice using JS, at least for anons. For
logged-in users, I guess it might be possible to move the logic
server-side, but that would be kind of stupid if you can't also do
that for logged-out users. A height reservation would probably be
best.

Roan
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Daniel Friesen | 1 Oct 2011 11:05

Re: pages jerk up and down every 10 seconds

On 11-10-01 01:07 AM, Roan Kattouw wrote:
> On Sat, Oct 1, 2011 at 8:03 AM, Daniel Friesen
> <lists <at> nadir-seen-fire.com> wrote:
>> The central notice banner is only shown to logged in users. Why are we
>> even loading the notice in a separate out of band http request. And not
>> bothering to cache it at that.
>>
> It is cacheable (public, max-age=300, s-maxage=300) but for some
> reason my browser (FF 6.0.1) isn't caching it. There are all sorts of
> reasons CN needs to load the notice using JS, at least for anons. For
> logged-in users, I guess it might be possible to move the logic
> server-side, but that would be kind of stupid if you can't also do
> that for logged-out users. A height reservation would probably be
> best.
>
> Roan
Actually, it seams to be:

On secure I get:
Cache-Control: public, s-maxage=600, max-age=0
There is a Firefox bug: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=345181
It's marked fixed but I'm not so sure.

On normal en.wp I get:
Cache-Control: private, s-maxage=0, max-age=0, must-revalidate

There's also no ETag or Last-Modified so even if there is a max-age that
must-revalidate could have the effect of nullifying the max-age.

~Daniel Friesen (Dantman, Nadir-Seen-Fire) [http://daniel.friesen.name]
(Continue reading)

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Christian Pühringer | 1 Oct 2011 12:49
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Re: [openZIM dev-l] Phonegap and Wikimedia mobile apps

Hi Brion,

Thanks for trying this out.  Performance gain is basically as expected, but 
looks like
that we should switch to native xz support. Alternatively we could reduce the 
cluster size,
although this would impact compression ratio. Anybody has an idea whether 
cluster size reduction
is feasible? (Reduction would need to be about 1:10, so pretty significant).
Regarding image support after some more trials I believe that
the replace-imgsrc-withbase64data in javascript may work sufficiently well for first
zim support. It may be pretty slow if a lot of images need to be loaded, but on
mobile phones anyway typically zimfiles with no or few images are the main use case
(because with all images the zim files are extremely large).
In the future (=when ice cream sandwich devices available)  it makes sense to 
switch to/add support  of
the  WebViewClient.shouldInterceptRequest-approach, as this is supposed to be 
much faster. We should talk to
the phonegap team, whether they could add support for this, so that plugins can 
use it.

Best regards,
Christian

Am 28.09.2011 21:24, schrieb Brion Vibber:
> On Tue, Sep 27, 2011 at 6:01 PM, Brion Vibber<brion <at> pobox.com>  wrote:
>
>> I did a quick test on my Nexus One (running Android 2.3.6, so with JIT).
>> There are some faster processors out there on higher-end phones, but there's
>> also a lot of cheaper phones that aren't going to be any faster than this.
(Continue reading)

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Gmane