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private musings | 1 Aug 2008 02:35
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an interesting article

Here's an interesting article;
http://www.smh.com.au/news/web/by-the-people/2008/07/29/1217097249794.html?page=fullpage#contentSwap2

interesting that the author notes "Wikipedia came into its own on July 7,
2005, at 8.50am, when four synchronised bombs exploded in London's
transportation system." - I'd be interested to hear thoughts in general
about this article - but on this point specifically... should the en-wiki be
encouraging the 'news' type items over to Wikinews, or embracing them as a
core strength of the project....

cheers,

Peter
PM.
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Todd Allen | 1 Aug 2008 04:34
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Re: an interesting article

On Thu, Jul 31, 2008 at 6:35 PM, private musings
<thepmaccount@...> wrote:
> Here's an interesting article;
> http://www.smh.com.au/news/web/by-the-people/2008/07/29/1217097249794.html?page=fullpage#contentSwap2
>
> interesting that the author notes "Wikipedia came into its own on July 7,
> 2005, at 8.50am, when four synchronised bombs exploded in London's
> transportation system." - I'd be interested to hear thoughts in general
> about this article - but on this point specifically... should the en-wiki be
> encouraging the 'news' type items over to Wikinews, or embracing them as a
> core strength of the project....
>
> cheers,
>
> Peter
> PM.
> _______________________________________________
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> WikiEN-l@...
> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit:
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
>

I don't see any issue in Wikipedia working with "news" type events
when they clearly will be of encyclopedic notability, and of course
Wikinews should do so as well, each one in its own style. The London
bombings were of this nature. It's the more "passing" items that are
of unclear notability that should be initially on Wikinews only, and
covered on Wikipedia only later on if a body of coverage really does
become established over time.
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David Gerard | 1 Aug 2008 13:24
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Re: [Commons-l] Please test Theora in Firefox Minefield nightlies

2008/8/1 Magnus Manske <magnusmanske@...>:
> On Fri, Aug 1, 2008 at 11:52 AM, David Gerard <dgerard@...> wrote:
>> 2008/8/1 Magnus Manske <magnusmanske@...>:

>>> I go to http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Central_Reclamation_Phase_3_-_2008-01-12_2.ogg
>>> and click on the play button. I get
>>>    * Download file
>>> Use player:
>>>    * Cortado (Java) (selected)
>>>    * Still image only
>>> Using Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.9.1a1pre)
>>> Gecko/2008072303 Minefield/3.1a1pre

>> That would be because you need 3.1a2pre, not 3.1a1pre.

> Ah, damn, I didn't see they put a1 and a2 in the same directory.

Yes, it is annoying ...

> Works nicely under a2 so far. Needs a seek bar, eventually...

File a bug. Perhaps it can become a most-duplicated ;-)

- d.

[adding wikien-l back to cc:]

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Charlotte Webb | 2 Aug 2008 04:36
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talk page banner-cruft

There is a discussion on WP:AN about this [1] which has incidentally
spilled over onto my talk page. No I'm not canvassing or asking
anybody to comment there, but I'd just like some personal feedback, so
I can at least figure out whether I've gone completely nuts or if the
concerns I've raised have some degree of merit.

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:AN#Talkpage_deletion_question

—C.W.

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Nathan | 2 Aug 2008 05:27
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Re: talk page banner-cruft

Your concerns are that you might click on a blue link to a talkpage with no
discussion, right? I don't see a whole lot of merit to that, frankly, and I
think sometimes MZMcbride likes to bump up his deletion stats and find a use
for his scripts. I can't see any other good reason for deleting these pages
- it doesn't save any space, they're stored anyway. I'd rather have a
talkpage with some instructions and some format than nothing at all, through
my unscientific belief that a new editor is more likely to add to a page
that already exists than create one that doesn't.

Nathan

On Fri, Aug 1, 2008 at 10:36 PM, Charlotte Webb <charlottethewebb <at> gmail.com>
wrote:

> There is a discussion on WP:AN about this [1] which has incidentally
> spilled over onto my talk page. No I'm not canvassing or asking
> anybody to comment there, but I'd just like some personal feedback, so
> I can at least figure out whether I've gone completely nuts or if the
> concerns I've raised have some degree of merit.
>
> [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:AN#Talkpage_deletion_question
>
> —C.W.
>
> _______________________________________________
> WikiEN-l mailing list
> WikiEN-l <at> lists.wikimedia.org
> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit:
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
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Steve Summit | 2 Aug 2008 05:43
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a portrait of the troll as a real person (NYT)

The New York Times Magazine has an article on, of all things,
trolls.  Long, but worth reading for those who are interested
in the phenomenon.  (Encyclopedia Dramatica is mentioned.)
"The Trolls Among Us", by Mattathias Schwartz, published August 3.
Here's a direct link, though I'm not sure it'll work for everyone:
<http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/03/magazine/03trolls-t.html>.

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Nathan | 2 Aug 2008 05:50
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Re: a portrait of the troll as a real person (NYT)

Some follow up is found here:
http://themedium.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/08/01/guest-post-mattathias-schwartz-responds/

The article also mentions someone giving the ED founder the serious troll
treatment - and that he called another troll, featured in the article, for
help. Its an interesting pathology that makes these people do what they do,
and intriguing to see how they rationalize it to themselves. Another
individual featured in the article supposedly posted a long comment to the
first blog post by Heffernan - but it'd be ironic if it wasn't actually him.

Nathan

On Fri, Aug 1, 2008 at 11:43 PM, Steve Summit <scs@...> wrote:

> The New York Times Magazine has an article on, of all things,
> trolls.  Long, but worth reading for those who are interested
> in the phenomenon.  (Encyclopedia Dramatica is mentioned.)
> "The Trolls Among Us", by Mattathias Schwartz, published August 3.
> Here's a direct link, though I'm not sure it'll work for everyone:
> <http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/03/magazine/03trolls-t.html>.
>
> _______________________________________________
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> WikiEN-l@...
> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, visit:
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikien-l
>
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Ray Saintonge | 2 Aug 2008 09:38

Re: talk page banner-cruft

Nathan wrote:
> Your concerns are that you might click on a blue link to a talkpage with no
> discussion, right? I don't see a whole lot of merit to that, frankly, and I
> think sometimes MZMcbride likes to bump up his deletion stats and find a use
> for his scripts. I can't see any other good reason for deleting these pages
> - it doesn't save any space, they're stored anyway. I'd rather have a
> talkpage with some instructions and some format than nothing at all, through
> my unscientific belief that a new editor is more likely to add to a page
> that already exists than create one that doesn't.
>   
It is indeed annoying to click on a blue link only to find that the only 
thing on that page is a totally pointless and condescending template.  I 
would be much happier if there were a red link, or at least if the talk 
page contained only templates instead of meaningful discussion the link 
could remain red.  Space is not a relevant factor for either side in 
this discussion.  You have been around long enough that you should not 
need instructions about how to use a talk page. Talk pages have been 
around since the beginning of Wikipedia.  There is no reason to believe 
that newbies have become stupider than ever, or that we need to talk 
down at them in the manner of this template.

Ec
> On Fri, Aug 1, 2008 at 10:36 PM, Charlotte Webb wrote:
>   
>> There is a discussion on WP:AN about this [1] which has incidentally
>> spilled over onto my talk page. No I'm not canvassing or asking
>> anybody to comment there, but I'd just like some personal feedback, so
>> I can at least figure out whether I've gone completely nuts or if the
>> concerns I've raised have some degree of merit.
>>
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James Farrar | 2 Aug 2008 10:59
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Re: talk page banner-cruft

2008/8/2 Ray Saintonge <saintonge@...>:
> Nathan wrote:
>> Your concerns are that you might click on a blue link to a talkpage with no
>> discussion, right? I don't see a whole lot of merit to that, frankly, and I
>> think sometimes MZMcbride likes to bump up his deletion stats and find a use
>> for his scripts. I can't see any other good reason for deleting these pages
>> - it doesn't save any space, they're stored anyway. I'd rather have a
>> talkpage with some instructions and some format than nothing at all, through
>> my unscientific belief that a new editor is more likely to add to a page
>> that already exists than create one that doesn't.
>>
> It is indeed annoying to click on a blue link only to find that the only
> thing on that page is a totally pointless and condescending template.  I
> would be much happier if there were a red link, or at least if the talk
> page contained only templates instead of meaningful discussion the link
> could remain red.  Space is not a relevant factor for either side in
> this discussion.  You have been around long enough that you should not
> need instructions about how to use a talk page. Talk pages have been
> around since the beginning of Wikipedia.  There is no reason to believe
> that newbies have become stupider than ever, or that we need to talk
> down at them in the manner of this template.

It was suggested a while back that a third colour could be used for
talk pages with only templates. I don't think the discussion came to
any meaningful conclusions, though.

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David Gerard | 2 Aug 2008 16:21
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And I thought it'd be real ale

http://frostfirezoo.com/wikipedia-juice

- d.

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Gmane