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Tom Box | 1 Dec 2011 01:03
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Re: Ocean consists

Grant out in Victoria wrote:
> Does anyone have the consists for #14/15 for when the Budd
> consist is operating?  Specifically, do you know which diner
> Chateaus are working the train?

Message #65594 had the Budd consist for #14 on Nov 16, as
observed by Bernard Babin.  It had dining car Acadian and
Châteaux Dollier, Closse, LaSalle and Laval.

Typically, Budd Ocean consists don't remain intact for a long
time, but they usually change only slowly, as a few cars are
swapped into or out of the consist between arrival and departure
in Montreal.  More up-to-date observations would certainly be
welcome.  It will be interesting to see how much longer the
consist grows as Xmas approaches.

Tom Box  <tbox@...>  Port Hope, ON, Canada

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Will | 1 Dec 2011 01:42
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Re: Jasper to Prince Rupert


On 2011-11-30, at 12:10 PM, Tom Box wrote:

> Fred Gebbie wrote:
>> In the early planning stage for a trip in 2012. Have question
>> about the best direction to travel from Jasper to Prince
>> Rupert.
> 
> I don't think it matters very much.  Either is good.

The only consideration is the train arrives into Jasper at 18:15 MT. Depending on the season there won't be
much light left, especially if the train was delayed. If your planning on going in the middle of the summer
it shouldn't be a big deal though. 

Will 

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Derek | 1 Dec 2011 04:13
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Re: Thirty Years Ago This Month


I don't know if it has been mentioned, but for those who might want to know, the 14-4s and the 6 dbrm-lnge cars
on the train were from New Haven's fleet.

Derek Thompson
Toronto, Ontario

--- In Canadian-Passenger-Rail@..., "Don Thomas"
<thomasd <at> ...> wrote:
>
> In summer 1963, the year the cars were allegedly sold to CN, the CN time
> table shows that the Montrealer had two 6-6-4s (one to Washington) and a 6
> bedroom lounge to New York. In winter 63-64 it had a 14-4 to Washington, a
> 6-6-4 and 6-lng plus another 6-6-4 starting in mid December. The summer of
> 1964, winter 64-65 and summer 1965 again showed a 14-4 to Washington plus
> 6-6-4 and 6-lng to New York. After that the CN timetable doesn't show types
> of sleepers. This doesn't establish whether CN leased these cars from 1963
> until it bought them in 1965, but it shows that the same type were still
> being operated on the Montrealer/Washingtonian up to the time CN actually
> bought these cars. Unless they were sitting idle at Bangor, somebody other
> than BAR was using them during these years, and it wasn't the Pullman
> Company.
> 
>  
> 
> Don
> 
>  
> 
>   _____
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Lyman | 1 Dec 2011 04:25
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CN 6-6-4 Sleepers (was Thirty Years Ago This Month)

--- In Canadian-Passenger-Rail@..., <thomasd <at> ...> wrote:
>
> It is possible that the cars were leased to CN for use on the
> Montrealer/Washington which included Montreal-New York and
> Montreal-Washington cars, before actually being bought by CN. CN, New Haven
> and Boston & Maine all owned 6-6-4 cars built in 1954, which comprised the
> majority of sleepers on these trains, so the BAR cars would be most useful
> there. 

Did CN (or VIA later on) assign any 6-6-4 sleepers to the Super Continental at any time?  I don't believe that
CN did but I am not sure about VIA.

The June 1968 Official Guide shows a 6-6-4 sleeper operating in the Panorama between Montreal and
Winnipeg.  

At that time, the majority of 6-6-4 assignments were in the Maritimes.  The Soctian and Ocean each had two,
the Chaleur had one (Montreal - Moncton in the off season and Montreal - Campbellton in the peak season),
the Cabot had one (Montreal - Campbellton).  The Cavalier had one which continued on to Port Huron on the
Maple Leaf.
I didn't notice any others in the equipment list. 

I recall seeing the ex-BAR sleepers several times at Truro in 1979.

Lyman Holmes 

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Tom Box | 1 Dec 2011 05:14
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Re: CN 6-6-4 Sleepers

Lyman Holmes wrote:
> Did CN (or VIA later on) assign any 6-6-4 sleepers to the Super
> Continental at any time? I don't believe that CN did but I am
> not sure about VIA.

The October 1966 timetable shows a 6-6-4 being used as a set-out
car, from Winnipeg to Edmonton on the Super Continental, from
Edmonton to Vancouver and back to Saskatoon on the Panorama, and
Saskatoon to Winnipeg on the Super Continental.

No 6-6-4 on the western trains in the April 1967 timetable, but
October 1967 has one on the Panorama from Toronto to Winnipeg
and back.

None in 1968 or '69, but the January 1970 timetable (which
covered a full year) has a Montreal - Vancouver and a Toronto -
Vancouver (and return) 6-6-4 from mid-June to early September,
when the Montreal and Toronto Super Continentals ran separately
west of Capreol.  None in off-season that year.

The February 1971 timetable has a Montreal - Vancouver 6-6-4
year round, but none out of Toronto.  Unfortunately, CN stopped
printing equipment details in the timetable as of October 1971.

I can't swear to it, but I think there were one or more 6-6-4
(Green series) sleepers on the Super Continental when I rode
it in May 1980.  I was brand-new to long-distance train travel.
I was in a 4-8-4 E-series car (Ernestown) myself, but I have a
memory of walking through Green-series cars and remarking on
their similarity to my car.  It's possible that memory is from
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DON THOMAS | 1 Dec 2011 07:11
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Re: CN 6-6-4 Sleepers (was Thirty Years Ago This Month)

The CN timetables showed few 6-6-4 assignments in the 1963-65 period I was concerned with. It can't have
been for lack of demand for sleeper service since a number of heavyweight assignments were listed,
including 8 section & 4 bedroom cars which the 6-6-4s could have filled in for. Perhaps one reason for
keeping them unassigned was to serve as extra cars as needed. Their range of accommodation would have made
them versatile in this role. A comparison of actual consists with the timetable listing could be enlightening.

Don Thomas

----- Original Message -----
From: Lyman <llholmes1948@...>
Date: Wednesday, November 30, 2011 8:25 pm
Subject: [CanPassRail] CN 6-6-4 Sleepers (was Thirty Years Ago This Month)
To: Canadian-Passenger-Rail@...

> --- In Canadian-Passenger-Rail@..., <thomasd <at> ...> 
> wrote:>
> > It is possible that the cars were leased to CN for use on the
> > Montrealer/Washington which included Montreal-New York and
> > Montreal-Washington cars, before actually being bought by CN. 
> CN, New Haven
> > and Boston & Maine all owned 6-6-4 cars built in 1954, which 
> comprised the
> > majority of sleepers on these trains, so the BAR cars would be 
> most useful
> > there. 
> 
> Did CN (or VIA later on) assign any 6-6-4 sleepers to the Super 
> Continental at any time?  I don't believe that CN did but I 
> am not sure about VIA.
>
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DON THOMAS | 1 Dec 2011 07:13
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Re: Re: Thirty Years Ago This Month

I have seen photos in the New Haven "Shoreliner" of CN 6-6-4 sleepers on the Washingtonian at Bridgeport Conn.

Don

----- Original Message -----
From: Derek <torbeaches@...>
Date: Wednesday, November 30, 2011 8:13 pm
Subject: [CanPassRail] Re: Thirty Years Ago This Month
To: Canadian-Passenger-Rail@...

> 
> I don't know if it has been mentioned, but for those who might 
> want to know, the 14-4s and the 6 dbrm-lnge cars on the train 
> were from New Haven's fleet.
> 
> Derek Thompson
> Toronto, Ontario
> 
> 
> --- In Canadian-Passenger-Rail@..., "Don Thomas" 
> <thomasd <at> ...> wrote:
> >
> > In summer 1963, the year the cars were allegedly sold to CN, 
> the CN time
> > table shows that the Montrealer had two 6-6-4s (one to 
> Washington) and a 6
> > bedroom lounge to New York. In winter 63-64 it had a 14-4 to 
> Washington, a
> > 6-6-4 and 6-lng plus another 6-6-4 starting in mid December. 
> The summer of
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gopullman | 1 Dec 2011 07:29
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Re: CN 6-6-4 Sleepers (was Thirty Years Ago This Month)


In a message dated 12/1/2011 1:11:11 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,  
thomasd@... writes:

. It  can't have been for lack of demand for sleeper service since a number 
of  heavyweight assignments were listed, including 8 section & 4 bedroom 
cars  
=================================================================
I've always been fascinated by the fact that those 8/4s were kept in  
service through at least the early seventies. I believe their last stand was on  
the northern Quebec services.

Does anyone know exactly how long they ran? And what were the name  series?

Tom Hoffman
Pearisburg VA

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Hall G | 1 Dec 2011 08:56
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Jasper Prince Rupert

I have done the trip a few times on the Skeena even many years back when they ran overnight with a sleeper.
 
I highly recommend the dome service great view.
 
I think if you are going in tourist season it would be best to take the BC Ferry rather then the Alaska State ferry.
It is a day trip that runs day time, Alaska  ferry not as good for services and runs overnight for part of it
the BC coast is worth seeing in the day light.
There is a couple of connecting bus services on Vancouver Island the connect the BC Ferrry with the
mainland and Victoria where  you can get the Victoria Clipper boat to Seattle.
Or Amtrak train from Vancouver to Seattle.
 
You will want to make sure you get the scenery in Jasper depending on time of year you are traveling.
 
http://www.dot.state.ak.us/amhs/index.shtml
Alaska Ferry
 
http://www.bcferries.com/
BC Ferries
 
If you are considering exploring the Alaska coast and have the time, you might try to make the White Pass and
Yukon train in Skagway.
One of the best train rides around.
http://www.wpyr.com/
 
You can take several different parts of the train trip but I highly recommend the full experience and going
all the way to Lake Bennett in B.C. and even better keep going to Carcross Yukon, really nice trip along the lake.
 
many years back we took a charter BC Rail RDC Budd car a 1000 miles from Vancouver to Fort Nelson, Bus to
Carcross Yukon on the Alaska Highway and Steam train from here with photo runbys along the Lake back to Lake
Bennett then back to Skagway, and a few days after with photo charters great trip!
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Gordon Ross | 1 Dec 2011 14:57
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RE: Re: CN 6-6-4 Sleepers


According to the 1981 VIA Consist and Marshalling of Trains:
Beginning in June '81 trains 3 &4 (Super Continental)added a 6-6-4 sleeper (Toronto-Vancouver) until at
least Oct '81 
Also trains 9 & 10 (Skeena) Jasper - Prince Rupert had a 6-6-4 sleeper during  period Apr '81 to Oct '81 (don't
know when it started or finished).
Gordon Ross
Kitchener,ON

To: Canadian-Passenger-Rail@...
From: tbox@...
Date: Wed, 30 Nov 2011 23:14:28 -0500
Subject: [CanPassRail] Re: CN 6-6-4 Sleepers

Lyman Holmes wrote:
> Did CN (or VIA later on) assign any 6-6-4 sleepers to the Super
> Continental at any time? I don't believe that CN did but I am
> not sure about it.

Tom Box wrote;

  I can't swear to it, but I think there were one or more 6-6-4
(Green series) sleepers on the Super Continental when I rode
it in May 1980. I was brand-new to long-distance train travel.
I was in a 4-8-4 E-series car (Ernestown) myself, but I have a
memory of walking through Green-series cars and remarking on
their similarity to my car. It's possible that memory is from
a 1984 trip on the Ocean, but I think it's from 1980 on the
Super Continental. Switching took place in Sudbury and
Winnipeg, but I can't say if any 6-6-4s were switched in or out
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Gmane