Chuck Hursch | 1 Jun 01:34 2010
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Re: Sell that Country Girl a Conversion.

EVDL Administrator wrote:
> On 29 May 2010 at 15:33, Chuck Hursch wrote:
> 
>> What about the badderies, er, I mean batteries? .. you're probably
>> looking at 20 * US125  <at>  $105, so what?, $2100 every three to five
>> years?  Minimum. 
> 
> This is why I'm still convinced that battery leasing is the way to go, 
> despite Nissan's defection.
> 
> In an EV, the battery is the major consumable; its amortization is the 
> primary cost of operating the vehicle.  Technically of course it isn't, but 
> as Bob Batson says, your batteries are essentially your fuel.  We don't 
> expect ICEV buyers to pay for 5 years' worth of gasoline when they buy the 
> vehicle, why ask EV buyers to spend a couple grand more for what amounts to 
> the same thing?
> 
> I've also seen many years of "Electric car for sale, needs batteries" ads, 
> and I know that's why many EVs haven't worked for their owners in the past - 
> a combination of lousy onboard battery management, nonexistent owner 
> education, poor dealer support, and unrealistic user expectations.   I sure 
> hope that Nissan and Mitsubishi figure out how to get at least 3 out of the 
> 4 right.  Otherwise we'll see some pretty bad PR for EVs.
> 
> Leasing the battery would replace the sticker shock every 3-5 years with a 
> monthly payment about equal to what most folks spend on gasoline.  That 
> seems like a sensible approach to me.   It would be much more likely to keep 
> drivers in their EV if when the battery failed they could just call the 
> dealer and get a new one, "free."

(Continue reading)

Michael Bonard | 1 Jun 02:34 2010
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Looking for recommendations to test a battery pack

I finished building my Electric Neon last year, and until recently, I 
have been quite happy with its operation. I had great public relations 
coverage through a Washington Post interview 
(http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/08/24/AR2009082403100.html), 
and I took my Neon to several official exhibitions such as the 
inauguration of the Washington DC first charging station with Washington 
Mayor Adrian Fenty, the January 2010 Washington DC Auto Show,  various 
educational events with high schools and I gave an EV presentation for a 
senior citizens educational program in Virginia.

My battery system consists of 12, twelve volts batteries, 120 Ah, made 
by TEMPEST. This was the only Group 31 AGM battery I could find that 
would be reasonably priced. I knew about the sensitivity of the AGM 
batteries to overcharging. Under the recommendations of the TEMPEST 
supplier, I purchased 12 individual microprocessor-controlled chargers, 
which precisely charge each battery. I thought that I had taken all the 
precautions I could. However, I had one of my 12 batteries die last year 
after barely 7 months of operation. Now another battery is showing signs 
of considerably reduced performances. Over the last few months I have 
seen my range steadily decreasing and I have come up with the conclusion 
that my batteries performance could be on a decline. It is very 
difficult to make an accurate assessment or measurement of the battery 
capacity just by driving, since the area around my house is quite hilly 
and since I need to keep up with the notoriously heavy and aggressive 
traffic of the Washington DC area.

My original plan was to manufacture a high power load resistor using Lee 
Hart's suggestion: place steel wire in a bucket of water and adjust the 
length of the wire to get the resistance needed to get a 50 A constant 
load. I intended to build insulating separators to keep the wire loops 
(Continue reading)

Rodney Cook | 1 Jun 02:46 2010

Re: Looking for recommendations to test a battery pack

The PakTrakr will help you see your batteries individual conditions as you
drive. 

-----Original Message-----
From: ev-bounces@...
[mailto:ev-bounces@...] On Behalf
Of Michael Bonard
Sent: Monday, May 31, 2010 5:34 PM
To: ev@...
Subject: [EVDL] Looking for recommendations to test a battery pack

I finished building my Electric Neon last year, and until recently, I 
have been quite happy with its operation. I had great public relations 
coverage through a Washington Post interview 
(http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/08/24/AR200908240
3100.html), 
and I took my Neon to several official exhibitions such as the 
inauguration of the Washington DC first charging station with Washington 
Mayor Adrian Fenty, the January 2010 Washington DC Auto Show,  various 
educational events with high schools and I gave an EV presentation for a 
senior citizens educational program in Virginia.

My battery system consists of 12, twelve volts batteries, 120 Ah, made 
by TEMPEST. This was the only Group 31 AGM battery I could find that 
would be reasonably priced. I knew about the sensitivity of the AGM 
batteries to overcharging. Under the recommendations of the TEMPEST 
supplier, I purchased 12 individual microprocessor-controlled chargers, 
which precisely charge each battery. I thought that I had taken all the 
precautions I could. However, I had one of my 12 batteries die last year 
after barely 7 months of operation. Now another battery is showing signs 
(Continue reading)

Jeff Major | 1 Jun 03:30 2010
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Re: Looking for recommendations to test a battery pack

Hi Michael,

Yeah, I've done a lot of battery testing.  From single cell to 168 volt packs.  Up to 500 amps.  I have built a
number of resistor racks.  I never liked the hot wire in water method.  Not saying it does not work.  But I
prefer repeatable fan cooled resistors.

Most of the higher voltage systems used locomotive braking resistors, like about 1 to 1.2 kW each.  These,
when above 24 volt, required switching regulators as opposed to simple contactors.

The lab happens to have several of these resistor racks available for sale.  Large steel cabinets with fans
and 12 resistors each.  You can configure them up to about 4 or 5 ohms, I think.  These are heavy at about 300
pounds.  I'm in Ohio.  Contact me if interested.

Regards,

Jeff M

--- On Mon, 5/31/10, Michael Bonard <mbonard@...> wrote:
> However I do not need to re-invent the wheel and I am
> asking if  there 
> is anyone in the group having built such a load resistor
> system? > Thanks for your inputs!
> 
> Michael Bonard

Mike Willmon | 1 Jun 04:17 2010
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Re: Randy from Alaska

Sounds good, you oughtta get him to have you convert his kids Junior ;-)
Maybe talk him into the scene.  Wonder if he has any extra chassis laying around?

Mike

> -----Original Message-----
> From: ev-bounces@...
[mailto:ev-bounces@...] On Behalf Of KilowattA798@...
> Sent: Monday, May 31, 2010 12:02 PM
> To: ev@...
> Subject: [EVDL] Randy from Alaska
> 
> Hi Mike,
> Your friend Randy with the alki dragster from Alaska now resides in the Pho
> area. He talked about your pinto and jr.His son was racing the jr at
> speedworld.
> He also checked out my truck and from a real racers prespective its a stock
> S10 with a cage and ford 9 inch.NOT AN ALL OUT RACE TRUCK.Call and ask him
> 
> Dennis
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(Continue reading)

KilowattA798 | 1 Jun 04:25 2010

Re: Randy from Alaska

In a message dated 5/31/2010 7:19:10 PM US Mountain Standard Time, 
electrabishi@... writes: 
> Subj: Re: [EVDL] Randy from Alaska 
> Date:5/31/2010 7:19:10 PM US Mountain Standard Time
> From:electrabishi@...
> Reply-to:ev@...
> To:ev@...
> Received from Internet: 
> 
> 
> 
> Sounds good, you oughtta get him to have you convert his kids Junior ;-)
> Maybe talk him into the scene.  Wonder if he has any extra chassis laying 
> around?
> 
> Mike
I was actually talking to him about it when he said he knew this guy in 
Alaska with and I said Pinto and he said yes,and the jr from the track owner?So 
as I always do I try to talk to the new racers at the events I attend.
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kevin lubot | 1 Jun 05:22 2010

Re: Looking for recommendations to test a battery pack


It seems to me you dont really want to know how good/bad your pack is. You
want to know how good/bad the batteries are (or perhaps im not correct in
this.) For instance are 3 bad or worse than others or the other way around
etc. I would test each battery seperatly the same way for the same load and
time. Then you could perhaps "get away" with replacing the weak ones when
needed. To that end there are several cheap load testers for 12 volt
batteries.  

http://www.harborfreight.com/catalogsearch/result/?category=&q=12+volt+tester

I dont know how long they will do 100 (or 50) amps for but a fan should
help.

Has 2 on that page for around 15-17 bucks that are 50 amp and 100 amp 12volt
testers. For some reason the 100 amp is a little cheaper than the 50 amp. 

I suppose you could get 2 and test 2 at a time of time is an issue but new
140 amp hour batteries shouldnt last much longer than 45 minutes at 100
amps. 

Hope this helps. By they way I had quite good luck with costco's deep cycle
100ah cell (they may have one that 140ah as well) they were about $75 each
with core when I was still using LA on my pack. 
kevin
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(Continue reading)

Rush | 1 Jun 05:59 2010

Insight battery pack

Hi all,

This is a little OT...

Does anybody have access to an Insight Battery Pack or know where I can get
one?

Thanks
Rush

Mike Willmon | 1 Jun 07:21 2010
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Re: Insight battery pack

Both Otmar and Wayland have Insights.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: ev-bounces@...
[mailto:ev-bounces@...] On Behalf Of Rush
> Sent: Monday, May 31, 2010 9:00 PM
> To: EVDL
> Subject: [EVDL] Insight battery pack
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> This is a little OT...
> 
> Does anybody have access to an Insight Battery Pack or know where I can get
> one?
> 
> Thanks
> Rush
> 
> _______________________________________________
> | REPLYING: address your message to ev@... only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
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David Nelson | 1 Jun 07:30 2010
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Re: Insight battery pack

Don't know if this will help but you could try
http://www.hybrid-battery-repair.com/insight/index.html.

On Mon, May 31, 2010 at 8:59 PM, Rush <Rush@...> wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> This is a little OT...
>
> Does anybody have access to an Insight Battery Pack or know where I can get
> one?
>
> Thanks
> Rush
>
> _______________________________________________
> | REPLYING: address your message to ev@... only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
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> | OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>

--

-- 
David D. Nelson
http://evalbum.com/1328


Gmane