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Lee Hart | 1 May 2009 02:38
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Re: Ok, time to put 50 fuses in the pack

Christopher Zach wrote:
> 94 Geo Prizm... 50 26ah batteries, 2 strings of 25, 300v pack...
> install a pair of 30 pin connectors in the back of the pack and
> run a wire from each battery to the connector...
> how do I fuse these wires so if there is a short on the 
> outside the fuses will *blow* instead of doing something like melting 
> the insulation and causing a massive short-out?

I can think of several options:

1. If you need to run high current in these wires (to do individual
    battery charging or discharge testing), and want a single connector
    with 300v between some of the pins, then I think you have to bite
    the bullet, and use high current fuses with a high enough DC
    voltage rating (KLKD or equivalent). They are indeed expensive,
    but a box of 50 will give you a quantity discount.

2. Or, you can use several connectors and cables, such that no more
    than 125v or 250v appears between pins in this connector. This
    allows you to use cheaper 125vdc or 250vdc rated fuses. The ceramic
    ABC or 3AB 1.25"x0.25" dia. fuses are rated at 250vdc for up to 15a
    sizes, or 125vdc for the 20-30 amps sizes.

3. If all you need to do is sense voltages, then you can use resistor
    in place of fuses. A short won't blow a fuse; it will just make a
    resistor warm up a bit. Use a resistor type that is rated to be safe
    when used this way (either a fuse resistor, or a high enough voltage
    rating and resistance so it won't dissipate excessive power if a
    sort occurs).
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Lee Hart | 1 May 2009 02:52
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Re: Individual 12 volt chargers

Michael Bonard wrote:
> my just-completed electric car (Neon 2000, 144V) is currently using
> 12 individual chargers. Each charger is microprocessor-controlled and
> provides up to 8 amps... $40 per charger. The AC input (115 VAC) is
> connected to the main AC entry point in the car through two 6-outlet
> power strips, each equipped with a switch.
> 
> Although Lee Hart offered a not-so-favorable assessment for this 
> configuration, so far I have had a good experience with it:

The key might be "just completed". Time will tell!

My estimate was based on past experiences with cheap chargers. They tend 
to promise more than they deliver, and not be very reliable. Unless you 
have some kind of monitoring system, when one fails, it leaves some 
battery uncharged with no warning. You drive off unaware, and destroy 
one or more batteries.

One thing that caught my eye: If each charger delivers 12v at 8a, that's 
  about 100w output. It won't be over 80% efficient, so that's 120w 
input.  They probably have a power factor around 0.7, so each one draws 
about 1.4 amps at 120vac. Twelve such chargers draw 17 amps, which would 
overload a 15-amp circuit. Do they deliver less than 8a, or do you have 
more than a 15a circuit?

> Again I do not pretend that this IS the solution, and all kinds of 
> problems could surface anytime, but so far I am very happy with this
>  configuration (minimum care, almost guaranteed equalization, and 
> visual indication of the status of each battery).
>
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Jorg Brown | 1 May 2009 09:04

Re: [sfeva] Maytag should manufacture electric cars.

Yeah, that's why dealerships for unreliable brands like Fiat and Yugo are
doing so well, and so many Toyota and Honda dealerships have had to close
their doors.

On Sat, Apr 25, 2009 at 9:02 AM, Lawrence Rhodes <primobassoon@...
> wrote:

>
> We all should be reminded where car companies make their money.  Or lets
> say the dealers.  The car companies produce vehicles for a song.  Mark them
> up very high & the dealers,,, well deal with it,,, making much profit from
> service.  The car companies make a bunch in parts sales to the dealers.
>  They engineer it that way.  Things break on purpose.  It should be a crime
> but I digress. The car dealers don't think they are Sears & don't want to
> sell washing machines.  However a washing machine is much like an electric
> car.  Electric motor, controls.  Motor controller.  Yep instead of spinning
> wheels the washing machine spins clothes.  When an electric car comes in for
> service at a typical dealer they put air in the tires & some fluid in the
> window washer and say bye bye.  They also say bye bye to their service
> profit.  They can only hope some bearings go bad or a battery connection
> comes lose and destroys a battery.  Oh Joy.  A wreck.  That's the only way
>  you will service an electric vehicle.  Also some owners don't charge
> enough or do something silly like reverse the 12v system battery and take
> out the controller in some models.  I know.  I've serviced electric vehicles
> in San Francisco for many years and once going they rarely come back for
> service.  (I know what the Maytag repairman feels like) This includes
> conversions.  Once EVery thing is right they go like the energizer bunny.
>  Once in a while a wire breaks or a battery connection fails but it is rare.
>  IF the owners does a minimum of checking the connections monthly nothing
> bad happens for years.  So maybe Maytag should manufacture evs.  Sears
(Continue reading)

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robert winfield | 1 May 2009 12:43
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Re: Thundersky Bulk Order Going Next Week


$$$$$$  ? for BMS (rough amt?)

--- On Thu, 4/30/09, Powered By DC <dkois@...> wrote:

From: Powered By DC <dkois@...>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Thundersky Bulk Order Going Next Week
To: ev@...
Date: Thursday, April 30, 2009, 5:28 PM

We are offering the BMS from Elithion to our customers, and offer a 2 year
warranty on the batteries if this system is purchased from us.

Dave Kois
Powered By DC, LLC
EV Components, LLC

it's the battery management system that has me really hesitant.
i would love some of them but am afraid I would end up killing them

-----
http://www.nabble.com/file/u1293913/Poweredbydc10.jpg 
--

-- 
View this message in context:
http://www.nabble.com/Thundersky-Bulk--Order-Going-Next-Week-tp23117217p23324666.html
Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
Nabble.com.

_______________________________________________
General EVDL support: http://evdl.org/help/
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gottdi | 1 May 2009 16:04
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Re: Fiberglass problem

John,

I used West Epoxy for my old boat and know about that heat. It melted  
my stir stick and that was just a small cup of stuff mixed up. If you  
are getting your mix to set too fast then you need a different  
hardener to slow the process. They do sell different hardeners so you  
can better taylor your mix for the temp and humidity you happen to be  
working in. There is fast medium and slow and they do work. I have  
fast and medium speed hardener. Works like a charm. For sure use less  
per batch unless you have a couple folks to help spread it out so you  
can do it real fast and take the advice of putting it in a low flat  
pan to help keep it longer. It does work. West Epoxy recommends that  
technique.

Pete :  )

On Apr 30, 2009, at 2:34 PM, John G. Lussmyer wrote:

> Cory Cross wrote:
>> Right, but I was saying if he wants to add more of a properly mixed
>> batch overtop, he sure wash off any existing amine blush (if it's
>> partially-cured, there will be some). However, the experts disagree  
>> with
>> the first part of my suggestion:
>> http://www.westsystem.com/ss/problem-solving
>> and say not to add more overtop. If it was properly mixed, it appears
>> you can just bring it inside and wait. Otherwise, read the  
>> instructions!
>>
>
(Continue reading)

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Andrew Wood | 1 May 2009 16:06

120v versus 144v with FB1-4001A motor

Hi,

Im contemplating my first conversion using the FB1-4001A motor and was  
wondering if you thought the extra cost & weight of the batteries to  
get 144v as opposed to 120v was worth it?

Maximum speed & cost are my primary objectives rather than range or  
accelleration.

Im not too bothered about the extra weight but I am trying to minimise  
cost, and the batteries Im looking at are £100+ each.

I'd be interested in your opinions on this,

Regards
Andrew
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stub | 1 May 2009 16:22

Re: Fiberglass problem

Just an idea, never tried it myself.

What about mixing in a cup, then put it in an ice bucket to cool the mix while you work? 

Stub
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

-----Original Message-----
From: gottdi@...

Date: Fri, 1 May 2009 07:04:53 
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List<ev@...>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Fiberglass problem

John,

I used West Epoxy for my old boat and know about that heat. It melted  
my stir stick and that was just a small cup of stuff mixed up. If you  
are getting your mix to set too fast then you need a different  
hardener to slow the process. They do sell different hardeners so you  
can better taylor your mix for the temp and humidity you happen to be  
working in. There is fast medium and slow and they do work. I have  
fast and medium speed hardener. Works like a charm. For sure use less  
per batch unless you have a couple folks to help spread it out so you  
can do it real fast and take the advice of putting it in a low flat  
pan to help keep it longer. It does work. West Epoxy recommends that  
technique.

Pete :  )
(Continue reading)

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Steve Peterson | 1 May 2009 16:31
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Re: Fiberglass problem

On Fri, 2009-05-01 at 14:22 +0000, stub@... wrote:
> Just an idea, never tried it myself.
> 
> What about mixing in a cup, then put it in an ice bucket to cool the mix while you work? 
> 

That'd make it too viscous to spread. Normally you want the stuff
between 70-80F while applying it, then crank up the heat to cure.

--Steve

> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gottdi@...
> 
> Date: Fri, 1 May 2009 07:04:53 
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List<ev@...>
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Fiberglass problem
> 
> 
> John,
> 
> I used West Epoxy for my old boat and know about that heat. It melted  
> my stir stick and that was just a small cup of stuff mixed up. If you  
> are getting your mix to set too fast then you need a different  
> hardener to slow the process. They do sell different hardeners so you  
> can better taylor your mix for the temp and humidity you happen to be  
> working in. There is fast medium and slow and they do work. I have  
> fast and medium speed hardener. Works like a charm. For sure use less  
> per batch unless you have a couple folks to help spread it out so you
(Continue reading)

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Bob Rice | 1 May 2009 16:48

Re: 120v versus 144v with FB1-4001A motor

   Hi Andrew;

   The TRAIN guy, right? So ya wanna do an Electric car, too? Great! The 
FBI-4001 is a AVANCE Electric Motor, popular for us converters. It's the 
same as the WARP , Warfield motor that I JUST happen to sell, Dealer, 
here.have one in stock at my place in KW. Hey If yur interested come on over 
on the 9th a Sat. This is our Regular EAA Meeting. We start off at 2pm or 
so, IF ya wanna dribble in at noonish, OK. Why I bring this up as we will 
have several EV's show up in the yard, lottsa hardware kicking around to do 
show and tell? We'll probably do a cookout(pic nik) if the weather's nice or 
a BIG tub of Chilli of it's chilli out. So come hungry if ya like? The nore 
the merrior?

   Depending on WHAT ya want to convert dictates the speed thing? Were doing 
an S-10 Chevy pick up in the yard, now. It's afairly streightforward 
conversion, you can stuff 24 batteries aboard. My Jetta is a sorta 
compromise, has enough juice to get to New Haven and back, I'm running 20 
golf cart batteries, a bit overweight/ Jettas work OK on 90 volts worth, top 
speed about 60-65. If yur racing and have deep pockets; pop for the new crop 
of lithiums, do the quarter at an Acela beating 115 mph. Check out "Plasma 
Boy Racing.com, read abouyt the famous "White Zombie" He's off the deep end! 
Or "nedra.com"

   Seeya on the 9th?

   Bob, also into Trains!
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Andrew Wood" <ajwood@...>
To: <ev@...>
Sent: Friday, May 01, 2009 10:06 AM
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Jon Glauser | 1 May 2009 16:55
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Re: 120v versus 144v with FB1-4001A motor

I have 96V on that same motor. I'm not very happy with the acceleration I
get. I will be going with a higher voltage next time it comes up. I've done
one at 120V and it was acceptable. But if you want acceleration at high
speed, I'd go for 144V.

However to get that voltage in a caryable weight (for a 'typical'
conversion, not a lead sled), you have to use 12V batteries. And they are
not known to last very long, so in the long run cost more than a lower
voltage with 6V batteries.

-Jon Glauser
http://jonglauser.blogspot.com
http://www.evalbum.com/555

On Fri, May 1, 2009 at 8:06 AM, Andrew Wood <ajwood@...> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Im contemplating my first conversion using the FB1-4001A motor and was
> wondering if you thought the extra cost & weight of the batteries to
> get 144v as opposed to 120v was worth it?
>
> Maximum speed & cost are my primary objectives rather than range or
> accelleration.
>
> Im not too bothered about the extra weight but I am trying to minimise
> cost, and the batteries Im looking at are £100+ each.
>
> I'd be interested in your opinions on this,
>
(Continue reading)

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Gmane