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Bhaskar Sunkara | 1 Jan 01:03
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Re: GP entrails [In defense of Harrington and American Menshevism]

So a few activists make a party with a progressive policy stance and then
labor support pours in and eventually the party overtakes the Democrats as
the primary party of the left or forces a realignment?  Give me a
historically example since the 1890s of this happening?  Give me an example
of a minor party become a mass party in modern times.

Look at the development of Die Linke, The Coalition of the Radical Left in
Greece, all these parties didn't materialize out of thin air, they came from
ideological splits within established mass parties.

I would like one example of an organization (i'll refrain from saying sect)
like SPUSA going from a virtually non-existent party into a mass
organization-- any example will do.  Maybe the Socialist Party in Portugal
in the 1970s?

And no one answered my previous questions.  Would the Christian Right have
been more effective rallying their forces in the Constitution Party instead
of entering the Republican Party.

Obviously most efforts need to be done outside the electoral realm, but I
dont see why pouring time into the Green Party is more effective than
supporting the progressive wing of the Democratic Party.
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Mark Lause | 1 Jan 01:28
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Re: GP entrails [In defense of Harrington and American Menshevism]

Bhaskar Sunkara <bhaskar.sunkara <at> gmail.com> wrote:
>
> So a few activists make a party with a progressive policy stance and then
> labor support pours in and eventually the party overtakes the Democrats as
> the primary party of the left or forces a realignment?  Give me a
> historically example since the 1890s of this happening?
>

A discussion goes both ways.  I asked you for one single rational,
material basis for thinking that your and Harrington's strategy works.
 You've been pursuing this since the days of FDR and the Democrats
have just drifted further right on almost everything, starting with
their invention of the Cold War.  In response, you ignore the question
and come back with this silly "yo mamma" response.

You made the assertion.  I asked a question.  If you want to persuade
anyone, you should address the point.

If not, you're giving the impression that you don't care to bother
trying to persuade us and are just engaged in some religions
"witnessing."

ML

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sobuadhaigh | 1 Jan 02:04
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Re: In Defense of Harrington and American Menshevism

Louis Wrote:
>One bitter lesson I have learned about politics is that when an
>opportunity is squandered, it is very difficult to regain lost
>ground. In the 1970s and 80s, the radicalized youth went off into
>Maoist and Trotskyist cloud cuckooland and a great potential to
>build a radical political movement was wasted.
>
>
In thinking back to the era of the 70's and 80's I wonder if there 
was any radical alternative to "cloud cuckooland" in United States. 
As I recall the Democratic Socialists of America presented 
themselves as just such an "opportunity" via joining the Democratic 
party 
as the "left wing of the possible." I heard Harrington speak in  
Houston in the late 70's decrying the conservatism of Jimmy Carter 
and wondered just how his followers were going to counteract the 
right wing lurch of American politics. They clearly did not.

Whatever the worth of Harrington's writing, the implication that 
his political vision was akin to the Mensheviks is both inaccurate 
and insulting. E. N. Burdzhalov's work on the unity of many 
Bolshevik and Menshevik groups both in 1905 and then again 
throughout 1917 is worth looking in this regard. Leonard Shapiro 
summarized the work of historians such as Burdzhalov,  Ankiyev and 
others 
writing for the journal Voprosy Istorii as showing that,

"..in 1905 the Mensheviks had been every bit as revolutionary as 
the Bolsheviks; or that the main blow against the Provisional 
Government in February 1917, the setting up of the Petrograd
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PoliticNow | 1 Jan 02:19
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"STOP the military massacre in Gaza NOW!"


Press release: Cairo and Ramallah (West  Bank): 31st Dec 2008  
"STOP the military massacre in Gaza NOW!"  
Health groups demand Israel  immediately stop ongoing military attack 
The People's Health  Movement condemns the brutal attack on Palestinians and 
demand an immediate stop  to Israel's ongoing military attack on Gaza. 
People's Health Movement is a  global coalition of grassroot health and peace 
activists fighting injustice, ill  health and poverty, worldwide. 
"We express serious  concern at the escalation of death of civilians and call 
for an immediate stop  to the military assault" said Dr. Hani Serag, 
Co-ordinator, People's Health  Movement. 
Israeli military has been carrying  out massive air strikes against Gaza that 
has resulted in over 385 deaths and  left over a thousand injured, hundreds 
of them in critical condition. Women and  children are hit in large numbers.  
The bombing destroyed the  civilian infrastructure in Gaza with many areas 
being left without water or  electricity. All hospitals are running out of 
critical supplies. Mounting  causalities have completely overwhelmed the already 
limited health services in  Gaza.  
"The International Community must  speak with one voice to end the bloodbath 
in Gaza" said Dr. Jihad Mashal of  Palestinian Medical Relief Society, an 
associate of the People's Health  Movement. 
Gaza, the most densely populated area on  the planet, has already been 
suffering from a blockade imposed by the Israeli  military in 2007 and normal life 
has been paralyzed.  
"International community must step  in to put pressure on Israeli government 
to ensure access to medical and  humanitarian assistance to the war affected 
people in Gaza" said Dr. Mashal.  Geneva conventions stipulate protection of 
health care facilities and personnel  and their unhindered access to war victims 
to provide assistance. 
Since the beginning of this brutal  Israeli attack, three Israelis have also
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Mark Lause | 1 Jan 02:42
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Re: In Defense of Harrington and American Menshevism

"By this standard a true American Menshevism would be an improvement
on what we currently have now."

So would talking puppies.  And I'd vote for that over Mensheviks,
Bolsheviks, anarchists, and two-headed yippies.  Hmm.  No.  Maybe
two-headed yippies would be more interesting.

This kind of this crap is very entertaining but utterly meaningless in
any materialist sense.

ML

PS: Happy New Year to all!

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Mark Lause | 1 Jan 03:38
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Re: Blacks versus the New Deal

Tom's history is quite sound.  I'm currently finish a book in part
dealing with the origins of the original KKK.

That of the 1920s was strong in parts of the South but won a really
mass base in parts of the Midwest.  The story hereabouts is that the
KKK in Kentucky was so weak that it had to move its state headquarters
to opposite Cincinnati where there was a massive organization.  They
met downtown under the sponsorship of one of the larger local banking
establishments.

The KKK of the 1920s not only sought to suppress or remove unions,
communists, Jews and African Americans, but also Catholics.  It proved
very adaptable to local circumstances and opportunities and played an
active role with law enforcement in breaking up bootlegging during
prohibition.  While the KKK generally worked through the Democratic
Party, it did enter the Republican Party where it was the dominant
party.  Anything for power and influence.

The Klan began shriveling because Grand Dragon David C. Stephenson of
Indiana (who actually directed the organization across the North) was
found guilty of getting a woman drunk, then raping and murdering her.
In response to the scandal, membership began declining after the mid
1920s.  As what was left began an even more frenzied level of
violence, the conservative elite that had been coddling them pulled
the rug out from under the KKK and it began a free fall until the
period of the civil rights movement.

ML

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Adam Richmond | 1 Jan 04:16
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Re: Blacks versus the New Deal

As Cincinnati's local bourgeiosie are often the descendents of Bavarian Catholics how do you see this as
having figured into the KKK's growth in SW Ohio?

Adam Richmond
Former resident of Hamilton, Ohio 

      
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Mark Lause | 1 Jan 05:31
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Re: Blacks versus the New Deal

I'm not from here and don't know much about the local bourgeoisie
today much less the 1920s.  (Anyone familiar with the area should
check out Dan Labotz's excellent and informative "Who Rules
Cininnati?"
http://www.cincinnatistudies.org/studies.html)

As to the 1920s, I doubt the KKK ever suspended its virulent
anti-Catholicism to accommodate the locals. While there were some
Catholic (and some Jewish) members who seem to have joined for purely
opportunistic reasons (like business or political connections), my
impression is that they weren't open about their identity.  On the
other hand, I wouldn't doubt that various recent immigrant groups
might have been interested in proving their "Americanism" by taking on
membership.

ML

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Dbachmozart | 1 Jan 05:32
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Israel Is Foolishly Breeding the Next Generation of Islamic Militants in Gaza


By _Chris Hedges_ (http://www.alternet.org/authors/5769/) , _Truthdig_ 
(http://www.truthdig.com/) .  Posted _December  31, 2008_ 
(http://www.alternet.org/ts/archives/?date[F]=12&date[Y]=2008&date[d]=31&act=Go/) . 

Those who orchestrate such sieges do not grasp the terrible rage born of  
long humiliation, indiscriminate violence and abuse. A father or a mother whose  
child dies because of a lack of vaccines or proper medical care does not 
forget.  A boy whose ill grandmother dies while detained at an Israel checkpoint 
does not  forget. A family that loses a child in an airstrike does not forget. 
All who  endure humiliation, abuse and the murder of family members do not 
forget. This  rage becomes a virus within those who, eventually, stumble out into 
the  daylight. Is it any wonder that 71 percent of children interviewed at a 
school  in Gaza recently said they wanted to be a "martyr"?  
The Israelis in Gaza, like the American forces in Iraq and Afghanistan, are  
foolishly breeding the next generation of militants and Islamic radicals.  
Jihadists, enraged by the injustices done by Israel and the United States, seek  
to carry out reciprocal acts of savagery, even at the cost of their own lives. 
 The violence unleashed on Palestinian children will, one day, be the 
violence  unleashed on Israeli children. This is the tragedy of Gaza. This is the 
tragedy  of Israel. 

http://www.alternet.org/audits/116393/

**************New year...new news.  Be the first to know what is making 
headlines. (http://www.aol.com/?ncid=emlcntaolcom00000026)
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sobuadhaigh | 1 Jan 06:00
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Re: Hamas is hoping for an IDF ground operation


Eric wrote:

>What hamas shows me is that their is NO substitution for a marxist 
>anylisis and National liberation based on the class struggle.
> 
To which JScotlive responded:
> 
>What this remark shows me is that even as an oppressed people are 
>being slaughtered, we still have armchair socialists from the 
comfort of 
>their keyboards engaging in puritanical horseshit.
> 
>I wonder if you'd have made the same remark to the Jews of the 
>Warsaw  Ghetto in 1943?
> 
>This is no time for paternalism. 
>
What does a critical observation about the political leadrship of 
Hamas have 
to do with Puritans or Puritanism? Eric was not making a moral 
judgement
and your guilt trip about armchairs and keyboards is juvenile. As 
to the Warsaw 
Ghetto uprising it was, in fact, lead by Communists and Socialists 
so there would 
be no need for the kind of criticism Eric was making.

I agree this is no time for paternalism and it is definately not 
time for
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