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Mr Ian Primus | 6 Jun 2008 16:31
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Installing NetBSD on a MicroVax 3900

I now have a MicroVax 3900. I have cleaned the dust out of the system, replaced the battery, and built a
console cable. It works, and I can get to the chevron prompt. The machine has:

KA655 CPU
MS650 16mb RAM boards (3)
KDA50 SDI disk controller
KLESI TU81 tape controller
TQK70 TK70 controller
CMD CQD-203/T SCSI tape controller
DESQA ethernet

The BA213 cabinet contains an RA70. The TK70 tape drive is missing.

I also have two RA90's. So far, I have tried one of them, and it seems to work. The RA70 also seems to work.
Neither disk that I have tried contains a bootable file system.

Now, here's my problem. I want to get an OS loaded on this machine. I have a friend that has a DEC CD boot server,
and I can drive my system over there, hook it up, and probably get VMS installed - and I do plan to load VMS at
some point. But, in the mean time, I would love to get NetBSD working on this. But... how to do it? In my
previous experiments with my MicroVax II, I tried to install NetBSD from tape using the instructions in
the FAQ. And I learned several things. Namely, that the TK50 is an incredibly slow device, and that
NetBSD/VAX no longer has a working method of booting or installing from tape.

This machine has a SCSI tape controller, but it can't handle SCSI disks. If there is a method of installing
NetBSD from tape, I can use a newer tape drive (like a DLT4000, or an Exabyte drive) to install. I could
probably boot from Ethernet, but I've never done that with a VAX before.

Any pointers?

-Ian
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Jim MacKenzie | 6 Jun 2008 18:45
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Re: Installing NetBSD on a MicroVax 3900


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mr Ian Primus" <ian_primus <at> yahoo.com>
To: <port-vax <at> netbsd.org>
Sent: Friday, June 06, 2008 8:31 AM
Subject: Installing NetBSD on a MicroVax 3900

> This machine has a SCSI tape controller, but it can't handle SCSI disks. 
> If there is a method of installing NetBSD from tape, I can use a newer 
> tape drive (like a DLT4000, or an Exabyte drive) to install. I could 
> probably boot from Ethernet, but I've never done that with a VAX before.

Ethernet is your ticket.  I have a VAXStation 4000/60 running OpenBSD, but 
the installation procedure is not that different.  I haven't carefully 
studied the netbooting instructions of NetBSD, but they should be adequate 
(read OpenBSD's for some guidance if you need clarity, since I obviously 
survived it).  Essentially you need to install mopd on another machine on 
your LAN, have it serve the mopboot file to your VAX, and let that file 
network boot.  Once you're network booting, you can run an installation 
kernel and put the OS onto a local disk and boot normally.

Network booting isn't that awful, and once you've set it up, you have a 
viable method of easily upgrading the machine, or fixing a broken 
installation . It's worth the bother.

Jim
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Mr Ian Primus | 6 Jun 2008 16:59
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Test - please ignore

Just a quick test of the list.
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Johnny Billquist | 6 Jun 2008 22:15
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Re: Installing NetBSD on a MicroVax 3900

All I can say is that the only reasonably working way is over ethernet. You need 
some machine with a mop daemon running. A NetBSD system normally have mopd to do 
that. Then you just need to read up on netbooting, and also find an image that 
will boot.

	Johnny

Mr Ian Primus skrev:
> I now have a MicroVax 3900. I have cleaned the dust out of the system, replaced the battery, and built a
console cable. It works, and I can get to the chevron prompt. The machine has:
> 
> KA655 CPU
> MS650 16mb RAM boards (3)
> KDA50 SDI disk controller
> KLESI TU81 tape controller
> TQK70 TK70 controller
> CMD CQD-203/T SCSI tape controller
> DESQA ethernet
> 
> The BA213 cabinet contains an RA70. The TK70 tape drive is missing.
> 
> I also have two RA90's. So far, I have tried one of them, and it seems to work. The RA70 also seems to work.
Neither disk that I have tried contains a bootable file system.
> 
> Now, here's my problem. I want to get an OS loaded on this machine. I have a friend that has a DEC CD boot
server, and I can drive my system over there, hook it up, and probably get VMS installed - and I do plan to load
VMS at some point. But, in the mean time, I would love to get NetBSD working on this. But... how to do it? In my
previous experiments with my MicroVax II, I tried to install NetBSD from tape using the instructions in
the FAQ. And I learned several things. Namely, that the TK50 is an incredibly slow device, and that
NetBSD/VAX no longer has a working method of booting or installing from tape.
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Dave McGuire | 6 Jun 2008 22:13

Re: Installing NetBSD on a MicroVax 3900

On Jun 6, 2008, at 10:31 AM, Mr Ian Primus wrote:
> I now have a MicroVax 3900. I have cleaned the dust out of the  
> system, replaced the battery, and built a console cable. It works,  
> and I can get to the chevron prompt. The machine has:
...
> Now, here's my problem. I want to get an OS loaded on this machine.  
> I have a friend that has a DEC CD boot server, and I can drive my  
> system over there, hook it up, and probably get VMS installed - and  
> I do plan to load VMS at some point. But, in the mean time, I would  
> love to get NetBSD working on this. But... how to do it? In my  
> previous experiments with my MicroVax II, I tried to install NetBSD  
> from tape using the instructions in the FAQ. And I learned several  
> things. Namely, that the TK50 is an incredibly slow device, and  
> that NetBSD/VAX no longer has a working method of booting or  
> installing from tape.

   Well you just turn up everywhere nowadays, don't you Ian. ;)  I  
agree with Jim's assertion that netbooting is probably your easiest  
option.  It shouldn't give you any trouble.

   Hey, are you gonna cut me those Apple ][ floppies?   *poke*   
*prod* ;)

            -Dave

--

-- 
Dave McGuire
Port Charlotte, FL
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Mr Ian Primus | 7 Jun 2008 07:03
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Re: Installing NetBSD on a MicroVax 3900

--- On Fri, 6/6/08, Johnny Billquist <bqt <at> softjar.se> wrote:

> From: Johnny Billquist <bqt <at> softjar.se>
> Subject: Re: Installing NetBSD on a MicroVax 3900
> To: ian_primus <at> yahoo.com
> Cc: port-vax <at> netbsd.org
> Date: Friday, June 6, 2008, 4:15 PM
> All I can say is that the only reasonably working way is
> over ethernet. You need 
> some machine with a mop daemon running. A NetBSD system
> normally have mopd to do 
> that. Then you just need to read up on netbooting, and also
> find an image that 
> will boot.

Well, I spent my free time this afternoon setting up a spare machine to be a MOP server. (I didn't feel like
installing MOP on one of my running machines, that's all) After some frustration finding a working disk
for the Sun box I'm using as a MOP server, I got everything going. I now have a Sun Ultra 2 running Linux, with a
fresh burned copy of NetBSD 4.0, and mopd installed.

I found out that MOP is rather picky when it comes to the networking devices it'll play with. I kept getting
?4B CTRLERR errors with the two computers connected with a Kensington hub. It also did not like the Cisco
Catalyst 2900 - which makes sense, this is a switch, and MOP isn't TCP/IP. Then, I swapped in an old,
reliable BayStack hub. This seems to work fine. I now get MOP requests on the screen when running mopd -d
eth0. 

I have copied the "boot" file from the CDROM and put it in /tftpboot/mop, and named it 08002b17fbd5.SYS (the
MAC address of the Vax's ethernet card). Booting the vax gets MOP requests to show up on the screen of the
Sun, and on two occasions it seemed to actually download the file - lots of stuff scrolled up the Sun's
screen, network activity blinking... but it wouldn't boot. Once I got the Vax to go to 1...0. and then it
(Continue reading)

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Mr Ian Primus | 7 Jun 2008 07:07
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Re: Installing NetBSD on a MicroVax 3900

--- On Fri, 6/6/08, Johnny Billquist <bqt <at> softjar.se> wrote:

> From: Johnny Billquist <bqt <at> softjar.se>
> Subject: Re: Installing NetBSD on a MicroVax 3900
> To: ian_primus <at> yahoo.com
> Cc: port-vax <at> netbsd.org
> Date: Friday, June 6, 2008, 4:15 PM
> All I can say is that the only reasonably working way is
> over ethernet. You need 
> some machine with a mop daemon running. A NetBSD system
> normally have mopd to do 
> that. Then you just need to read up on netbooting, and also
> find an image that 
> will boot.

Well, I spent my free time this afternoon setting up a spare machine to be a MOP server. (I didn't feel like
installing MOP on one of my running machines, that's all) After some frustration finding a working disk
for the Sun box I'm using as a MOP server, I got everything going. I now have a Sun Ultra 2 running Linux, with a
fresh burned copy of NetBSD 4.0, and mopd installed.

I found out that MOP is rather picky when it comes to the networking devices it'll play with. I kept getting
?4B CTRLERR errors with the two computers connected with a Kensington hub. It also did not like the Cisco
Catalyst 2900 - which makes sense, this is a switch, and MOP isn't TCP/IP. Then, I swapped in an old,
reliable BayStack hub. This seems to work fine. I now get MOP requests on the screen when running mopd -d
eth0. 

I have copied the "boot" file from the CDROM and put it in /tftpboot/mop, and named it 08002b17fbd5.SYS (the
MAC address of the Vax's ethernet card). Booting the vax gets MOP requests to show up on the screen of the
Sun, and on two occasions it seemed to actually download the file - lots of stuff scrolled up the Sun's
screen, network activity blinking... but it wouldn't boot. Once I got the Vax to go to 1...0. and then it
(Continue reading)

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Jochen Kunz | 7 Jun 2008 09:19
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Re: Installing NetBSD on a MicroVax 3900

On Fri, 6 Jun 2008 07:31:34 -0700 (PDT)
Mr Ian Primus <ian_primus <at> yahoo.com> wrote:

> I would love to get NetBSD working on this. But... how to do it?
Netboot is the way to go.
You might find some valuable information here:
http://www.netbsd.org/docs/network/netboot/index.html

BTW: Raelly nice machine. Especially with tose RA90. :-)
--

-- 

tsch__,
       Jochen

Homepage: http://www.unixag-kl.fh-kl.de/~jkunz/
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Mr Ian Primus | 7 Jun 2008 15:15
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Re: Installing NetBSD on a MicroVax 3900

--- On Sat, 6/7/08, Mr Ian Primus <ian_primus <at> yahoo.com> wrote:

> I have copied the "boot" file from the CDROM and
> put it in /tftpboot/mop, and named it 08002b17fbd5.SYS (the
> MAC address of the Vax's ethernet card). Booting the vax
> gets MOP requests to show up on the screen of the Sun, and
> on two occasions it seemed to actually download the file -
> lots of stuff scrolled up the Sun's screen, network
> activity blinking... but it wouldn't boot. Once I got
> the Vax to go to 1...0. and then it crashed with an error.
> Most of the time though, it just doesn't load, and goes
> to "Retrying network bootstrap". I have yet to get
> the Vax to actually execute the code, or give any hint of
> NetBSD or a bootloader.
> 
> Both computers are connected to a BayStack hub, and to
> nothing else.
> 
> So, I don't know what I'm doing wrong.

Trying again some this morning, I also tried downloading NetBSD 3.1, and using the boot.vax from that disc.
No go. When running mopd as "mopd -f eth0", I can get more consise messages, and they're all just "My address
is 08:00:20:86:7c:82" (the MAC address of the Sun I'm using as a MOP server), scrolling up the screen as the
Vax tries to boot. The lights on the hub blink as if the vax is downloading from the Sun, but it never works. It
just goes to "Retrying network bootstrap". Once more I got it to go to 1..0.. on the Vax, but then it hung.
I've got the file named 08002b17fbd5.SYS, and I've also tried calling it mopboot.SYS, and booting with
/100 on the Vax to be able to specify the filename.

What is wrong?
(Continue reading)

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Mr Ian Primus | 7 Jun 2008 15:15
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Re: Installing NetBSD on a MicroVax 3900

--- On Sat, 6/7/08, Mr Ian Primus <ian_primus <at> yahoo.com> wrote:

> I have copied the "boot" file from the CDROM and
> put it in /tftpboot/mop, and named it 08002b17fbd5.SYS (the
> MAC address of the Vax's ethernet card). Booting the vax
> gets MOP requests to show up on the screen of the Sun, and
> on two occasions it seemed to actually download the file -
> lots of stuff scrolled up the Sun's screen, network
> activity blinking... but it wouldn't boot. Once I got
> the Vax to go to 1...0. and then it crashed with an error.
> Most of the time though, it just doesn't load, and goes
> to "Retrying network bootstrap". I have yet to get
> the Vax to actually execute the code, or give any hint of
> NetBSD or a bootloader.
> 
> Both computers are connected to a BayStack hub, and to
> nothing else.
> 
> So, I don't know what I'm doing wrong.

Trying again some this morning, I also tried downloading NetBSD 3.1, and using the boot.vax from that disc.
No go. When running mopd as "mopd -f eth0", I can get more consise messages, and they're all just "My address
is 08:00:20:86:7c:82" (the MAC address of the Sun I'm using as a MOP server), scrolling up the screen as the
Vax tries to boot. The lights on the hub blink as if the vax is downloading from the Sun, but it never works. It
just goes to "Retrying network bootstrap". Once more I got it to go to 1..0.. on the Vax, but then it hung.
I've got the file named 08002b17fbd5.SYS, and I've also tried calling it mopboot.SYS, and booting with
/100 on the Vax to be able to specify the filename.

What is wrong?
(Continue reading)

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