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dross00 | 4 Jun 2008 06:27
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Question on the images in /miniroot

I'm going to be installing NetBSD on a TT030 a little later this week. 
After reading through the install doc, I'm still unclear on the differences 
between the three filesystem images (miniroot.fs, prepare.fs, sysinst.fs).

I'm guessing that I first boot off of miniroot.fs and then I'll be prompted 
for the other two as necessary.  Is this correct?

It's also unclear to me if the boot floppy supports the Riebl NIC so I can 
install off the net, or if I'll need to go find a SCSI CD-ROM drive to 
install from.

Sure I could find out by experimentation but I'd just like to save a little 
time.  =)

David Ross
dross <at> pobox.com
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dross00 | 7 Jun 2008 10:27
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Re: Question on the images in /miniroot

So I got my TT and I've been attempting to boot NetBSD to get an install 
going.  Being an Atari newb, I'm having a tough time...

It seems I can trigger a boot off the floppy by holding Alt for a while 
during boot.  I haven't quite gotten this down to a science yet though --  
sometimes I end up booting to the HD regardless.

It looks like the various filesystem images in the 4.0 release /miniroot 
directory aren't bootable floppies.  Or at least I wasn't able to boot to 
them.

The furthest I got was being able to drop the boot kernel onto the hard 
drive and then using loadbsd.ttp to kick off a netbsd boot.  Unfortunately 
boot would hang immediately after the following line:
kbd0 at mainbus0

This would happen with both the BOOT and ATARITT kernels.

So then I decided to do a little digging in the archive and found that 
NetBSD 1.6 shipped with what really does appear to be a bootable floppy.  So 
I booted it up.  It's unclear to me if I'm just booting into TOS running out 
of ROM or if I'm really booting up the disk -- I just get a low res TOS 
desktop.  From there I can launch loadbsd with the "-b netbsd" command line. 
But unfortunately I just get dumped right back into TOS.  Same thing if I 
try dropping the files on the hard drive and executing them from there after 
booting into the TOS living on the hard drive.

I'm not sure where to go with this next...  I guess what would help me the 
most is if someone could describe a known-good way to boot NetBSD on a TT. 
As in -- which release and which files to grab.  This machine has 10mb ST
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dross00 | 9 Jun 2008 06:55
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Re: Question on the images in /miniroot

OK, I've figured things out.  The only real issue seems to be a kernel 
change which prevents my TT from booting on 4.0.  Every version I've tried 
prior to that boots for me (1.1 up to 3.1.1).

Here's my boot procedure...

Prerequisites:
1.  A TT030 with sufficient memory, 1.44mb floppy drive, SCSI HD with a 
bootable TOS install.
2.  A blank floppy disk.
3.  The TT Advanced Utilities Disk.  Mine is labeled HDX 5.03.
4.  A PC with a floppy drive (mine's running Windows)

I used GEMExplorer first to image the SCSI HD so I can revert to the 
original TOS install at any point.  Since this doesn't seem to work on XP or 
above, I installed WinME on a spare PC with an Adaptec 2940AU.  There are 
easier ways to rip a SCSI disk but this is what I've done in the past and 
know to be reliable.

As described above, the 4.0 kernel appears to have a bug.  It's not clear if 
it's just my hardware, but I suspect this will happen on any TT030.  As 
described in my previous mail, the 4.0 kernel locks up on boot after "kbd0 
at mainbus0".  I'm not sure if this is a TT030-specific kernel bug or what's 
going on.  (Perhaps related to Izumi Tsutsui's change here: 
http://mail-index.netbsd.org/port-atari/2007/03/oindex.html ???)  I also 
suspect it may have something to do with the floppy driver, which is what 
I've seen load just after that kbd0 line on bootable kernels.

Here are the explicit steps I followed to get booted up:
(Continue reading)

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Izumi Tsutsui | 9 Jun 2008 17:28
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Re: Question on the images in /miniroot

> As described above, the 4.0 kernel appears to have a bug.  It's not clear if 
> it's just my hardware, but I suspect this will happen on any TT030.  As 
> described in my previous mail, the 4.0 kernel locks up on boot after "kbd0 
> at mainbus0".

Can you get ddb(4) prompt at that point?
<Alt>-<LeftShift>-<F9> might invoke it as noted in ddb(4) man page.
---
Izumi Tsutsui
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dross00 | 10 Jun 2008 07:29
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Re: Question on the images in /miniroot

Unfortunately the <Alt>-<LeftShift>-<F9> sequence doesn't do anything, at 
least with the pre-built 4.0 BOOT kernel on netbsd.org.

But as it turns out, if I wait for a few minutes, NetBSD 4.0 actually boots 
past the point where I had previously noted that it freezes.  It gets up 
until it prints this line:
scsibus0: waiting 2 seconds for devices to settle...
At that point I left it for maybe 20 minutes and it didn't get any further.

David Ross
dross <at> pobox.com

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Izumi Tsutsui" <tsutsui <at> ceres.dti.ne.jp>
Sent: Monday, June 09, 2008 8:28 AM
To: <dross00 <at> hotmail.com>
Cc: <port-atari <at> NetBSD.org>; <tsutsui <at> ceres.dti.ne.jp>
Subject: Re: Question on the images in /miniroot

>> As described above, the 4.0 kernel appears to have a bug.  It's not clear 
>> if
>> it's just my hardware, but I suspect this will happen on any TT030.  As
>> described in my previous mail, the 4.0 kernel locks up on boot after 
>> "kbd0
>> at mainbus0".
>
> Can you get ddb(4) prompt at that point?
> <Alt>-<LeftShift>-<F9> might invoke it as noted in ddb(4) man page.
> ---
> Izumi Tsutsui
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dross00 | 11 Jun 2008 08:54
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Re: Question on the images in /miniroot

Last night I managed to get my Riebl card working on 3.1.1!  From the 
sysinst filesystem I just drop to a shell and set it up with ifconfig.  I'm 
then able to connect to ftp.netbsd.org, etc.  Fantastic.

On to the next challenge...

Everything seems to indicate that sysinst.fs is the way to go, and 
prepare.fs / miniroot.fs are legacy.  So I went to kick off an install 
through sysinst and it was unable to partition the disk, giving me an error 
that /etc/disktab could not be opened.  This appears to be because the / 
filesystem is read-only and the file does not exist, just as this guy 
documented last December:

http://archives.devshed.com/forums/bsd-93/install-37470-could-not-open-etc-disktab-using-sysinst-fs-2388826.html

I have a hunch this may have something to do with the fact that 
"mount_kernfs /kern /kern" doesn't do anything.  Even if / is read-only, it 
should be able to mount the kernel parameter namespace under /kern, right?

Sometime in the next few days I'll jump back a few releases and see if I can 
get to one where the / filesystem isn't read-only and/or mount_kernfs works. 
Then I think I should be able to go through sysinst no problem.

David Ross
dross <at> pobox.com

--------------------------------------------------
From: <dross00 <at> hotmail.com>
Sent: Monday, June 09, 2008 10:29 PM
To: "Izumi Tsutsui" <tsutsui <at> ceres.dti.ne.jp>
(Continue reading)

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dross00 | 12 Jun 2008 08:57
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Re: Question on the images in /miniroot

The saga continues...

I have some more information on the kernfs / read-only filesystem problem I 
discussed previously.  In NetBSD 2.1, all is good.  As of NetBSD 3.0 
however, kernfs is toast and the filesystem gets mounted read-only, 
preventing sysinst from operating properly.

That's it for tonight.  Assuming no other issues, I'll be doing a 2.1 
install later this week.

David Ross
dross <at> pobox.com

--------------------------------------------------
From: <dross00 <at> hotmail.com>
Sent: Tuesday, June 10, 2008 11:54 PM
To: <port-atari <at> NetBSD.org>
Subject: Re: Question on the images in /miniroot

> Last night I managed to get my Riebl card working on 3.1.1!  From the 
> sysinst filesystem I just drop to a shell and set it up with ifconfig. 
> I'm then able to connect to ftp.netbsd.org, etc.  Fantastic.
>
> On to the next challenge...
>
> Everything seems to indicate that sysinst.fs is the way to go, and 
> prepare.fs / miniroot.fs are legacy.  So I went to kick off an install 
> through sysinst and it was unable to partition the disk, giving me an 
> error that /etc/disktab could not be opened.  This appears to be because 
> the / filesystem is read-only and the file does not exist, just as this
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Izumi Tsutsui | 13 Jun 2008 20:17
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Re: Question on the images in /miniroot

dross00 <at> hotmail.com wrote:

> described in my previous mail, the 4.0 kernel locks up on boot after "kbd0 
> at mainbus0".  I'm not sure if this is a TT030-specific kernel bug or what's 
> going on.  (Perhaps related to Izumi Tsutsui's change here: 
> http://mail-index.netbsd.org/port-atari/2007/03/oindex.html ???)

Note this MI softintr change is not in the netbsd-4 branch.
(i.e. NetBSD 4.0 doesn't have the change)

There are few major atari specific changes between 3.0 and 4.0,
and I guess one of the most important changes is gcc version.

Could you try these BOOT kernels?

4.0_STABLE BOOT kernel compiled with gcc4 -O (not default -O2)
http://www.ceres.dti.ne.jp/~tsutsui/netbsd/netbsd-atari-BOOT-20080613a.gz

4.0_STABLE BOOT kernel compiled with gcc3 (from NetBSD 3.0 toolchain)
http://www.ceres.dti.ne.jp/~tsutsui/netbsd/netbsd-atari-BOOT-20080613b.gz

If both won't work, we have to check more atari specific changes
(which driver sticks).
---
Izumi Tsutsui
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dross00 | 15 Jun 2008 07:48
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Re: Question on the images in /miniroot

Izumi,

Thanks so much for building these!  The first one does the same as the 
original 4.0 kernel -- it boots until "kbd0 at mainbus0" and then freezes. 
(I didn't let it sit there for any amount of time, but I imagine if I did it 
would keep going and lock up further, as I saw with the original 4.0 
kernel.)

The second one doesn't have this problem.  It boots up further without a 
delay.  The last line it prints is "scsibus0: waiting 2 seconds for devices 
to settle..." and then things go bad and I get:
panic: lockmgr: no context
Stopped at    netbsd:cpu_Debugger+0x6:    unlk    a6
db>

Hopefully that gives you some useful info to go on.  Thanks a lot for 
looking at this!

David Ross
dross <at> pobox.com

--------------------------------------------------
From: "Izumi Tsutsui" <tsutsui <at> ceres.dti.ne.jp>
Sent: Friday, June 13, 2008 11:17 AM
To: <dross00 <at> hotmail.com>
Cc: <port-atari <at> NetBSD.org>; <tsutsui <at> ceres.dti.ne.jp>
Subject: Re: Question on the images in /miniroot

> dross00 <at> hotmail.com wrote:
>
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Izumi Tsutsui | 15 Jun 2008 08:03
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Re: Question on the images in /miniroot

dross00 <at> hotmail.com wrote:

> The second one doesn't have this problem.  It boots up further without a 
> delay.

Okay, then there are some gcc4 specific issue around atari sources.
(gcc4 is so aggressive on optimization and it could produce unexpected
 code if program has any statement which is "undefined" in C89/C99 spec)

> The last line it prints is "scsibus0: waiting 2 seconds for devices 
> to settle..." and then things go bad and I get:
> panic: lockmgr: no context
> Stopped at    netbsd:cpu_Debugger+0x6:    unlk    a6
> db>

Hmm, could you please "tr" commant on the db> prompt?
It will show which function the kernel fails in.
(looks some uninitialized variables)
---
Izumi Tsutsui
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Gmane