Zachery Bir | 6 May 13:07 2004

Re: (was Re: Tiger is On)

On May 5, 2004, at 6:07 PM, Google Kreme wrote:

> (I can have both lint and not lint!)

Uh, I think you mean tea and not tea...


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Jared ''Danger'' Earle | 6 May 18:50 2004

Re: Uncaught bounce notification

mailman-bounces@... wrote:
> We  have  received a  request  for  adding the  osx-nutters@...
> mailing list  to the Gmane mail-to-news  gateway/archive. A subscription
> request  message has  been sent.  

...and this mail should seed it. Thanks, Zac.


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Kevin Callahan | 6 May 18:02 2004

more photos at wash post


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Kevin Callahan | 6 May 16:31 2004

Red Cross repeatedly asked U.S. authorities to take action over reported abuse


" The International Red Cross said Thursday that it had repeatedly  
asked U.S. authorities to take action over reported abuse at Iraq's Abu  
Ghraib prison before the recent revelations.

  Noting that Red Cross representatives had been visiting the prison and  
talking privately with detainees, spokeswoman Nada Doumani said in  
Geneva, “We were aware of what was going on, and based on our findings  
we have repeatedly requested the U.S. authorities to take corrective  

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Charles Bennett | 6 May 15:59 2004

Re: Freedom human kind

Dave Schroeder wrote:

>>> I thought this was speech and not press? I'm losing track.
>>> Does this mean we can all get our views distributed by a major 
>>> motion picture house??
>>> A witty quote by Henry Mencken doesn't prove your point. I still 
>>> fail to see why it's Michael Moore's right to have his opinions 
>>> distributed by Mirimax and/or Disney. Of course, if you want to have 
>>> a fantasy that Disney is in Bush's pocket or something like that, 
>>> then it's all wrapped up in a neat little package.
>> What I think interesting in this news is the fact that Disney for 
>> political and economic reason make this decision, while they promote 
>> very very bad movie with very very bad behavior.
>> Yes, MM can still make new movies, books and so on, but it is 
>> something like a demonstration of something very bad happening in the 
>> US now.
> I disagree. Because the people who think this is very bad are saying 
> that it's because of Disneyworld, which is in Florida, of which Jeb 
> Bush is governor, which means that Disney was pressured by the Bush 
> family to not release the film, etc. (Actually, that's what Michael 
> Moore himself is saying, predictably. That he's being "silenced" by 
> Bush.)
(Continue reading)

Patrick Coskren | 6 May 16:52 2004

Re: Strategy (was: Freedom human kind)

On May 6, 2004, at 2:04 AM, Stefano Mori wrote:

> This is an interesting point. The Fundamentalist meme was already 
> starting to fade 300 years ago. And instead of, in SD language, making 
> the jump up to Rational ORANGE, it entrenched it's position back into 
> BLUE and even down to RED. The people had the opportunity to develop 
> their thinking up into rational levels, but because that would have 
> meant the death of the old level of thinking, they retreated into even 
> simpler levels of thinking. Now isn't that amazing?
> And fucking worrying.

  A really good book on this topic is "The Battle For God", by Karen 
Armstrong, who traces the development of modern fundamentalism in 
Christianity, Judaism, and Islam.  Her thesis is that the phrase 
"modern fundamentalism" isn't an oxymoron, but that the fundamentalism 
we encounter today is both a reaction to the modern world and deeply 
influenced by it.  Science, she argues, is frequently interpreted as 
giving absolute answers: the lights turn on, so we know electricity is 
real.  We know the earth revolves around the sun because we've sent out 
spacecraft to look.  And so on.  (The fact that real scientific 
endeavor is far more contingent is beside the point; we're talking 
about popular conception.)

In a world where we can have literal truth about reality, the argument 
continues, people who are inclined to be religious are more likely to 
view the religion as literal, affecting the physical world.  Hence the 
idea of Christian fundies that the earth was created in a literal six 
days.  She traces this modern way of looking at books that were 
frequently written to be metaphorical and spiritual, and tries very 
(Continue reading)

Fabien Roy | 6 May 16:47 2004

Rumsfeld knew about the pictures in January

 From the NYT:
>  Pentagon officials said that Mr. Rumsfeld was first notified about 
> the pictures in mid-January, after a soldier turned them over to Army 
> officials, prompting the opening of an investigation. A senior 
> Pentagon official said that Mr. Rumsfeld was told of the allegations 
> of abuse and given a general description of the photographs.
>  Within weeks, the Pentagon official said, Mr. Rumsfeld told the 
> president about the case. But it is not clear, the official said, 
> whether Mr. Rumsfeld mentioned the photographs or their basic content 
> to Mr. Bush at that point.
>  Mr. Bush first mentioned the abuse scandal publicly last Friday in 
> the Rose Garden, when he said he shared "deep disgust" about the 
> photographs. That evening, he went to a party at Mr. Rumsfeld's house 
> in the Kalorama section of Washington, where it is not known whether 
> he and his defense secretary talked about the pictures.

Go figure!

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Dave Schroeder | 6 May 15:59 2004

Re: Freedom human kind

On May 6, 2004, at 3:40 AM, Matthew Healey wrote:

> On 06/05/2004, at 1:19 AM, Dave Schroeder wrote:
>>>> It's corporate censorship, pure and simple.  Disney's within their
>>>> rights to do it, but it's despicable behavior.
>>> Actaully, it appears Disney is NOT within their rights to do it, and
>>> this will likely go to court/arbitration, and Disney will likely
>>> loose.
>>> However, that will be AFTER the election.
>> Good.
>> Because Michael Moore's conspiratorial and sometimes false rantings 
>> shouldn't be mass-distributed for the purposes of attempting to alter 
>> the outcome of the election. If he wants to rant, he can find some 
>> other distributor that will be more open to it.
> So your alluding to the fact that Politicians/Powerbrokers should be 
> allowed to flood the place with propaganda, but the public should not 
> be allowed to counter it or do the same?

"The public"? Michael Moore isn't the public. And still, no one has 
told me why Michael Moore has some intrinsic right to have his speech 
mass-distributed by a film house like Mirimax. And I wouldn't worry; 
the Media Fund,, etc., seem to be doing just fine coming up 
(Continue reading)

Gerard Iglesias | 6 May 23:32 2004

Re: Freedom human kind

May 6, 2004 – Editorial, New York Times

Disney's Craven Behavior

Give the Walt Disney Company a gold medal for cowardice for blocking  
its Miramax division from distributing a film that criticizes President  
Bush and his family. A company that ought to be championing free  
expression has instead chosen to censor a documentary that clearly  
falls within the bounds of acceptable political commentary.

The documentary was prepared by Michael Moore, a controversial  
filmmaker who likes to skewer the rich and powerful. As described by  
Jim Rutenberg yesterday in The Times, the film, "Fahrenheit 9/11,"  
links the Bush family with prominent Saudis, including the family of  
Osama bin Laden. It describes financial ties that go back three decades  
and explores the role of the government in evacuating relatives of Mr.  
bin Laden from the United States shortly after the Sept. 11 terrorist  
attacks. The film was financed by Miramax and was expected to be  
released this summer.

Mr. Moore's agent said that Michael Eisner, Disney's chief executive,  
had expressed concern that the film might jeopardize tax breaks granted  
to Disney for its theme park, hotels and other ventures in Florida,  
where Jeb Bush is governor. If that is the reason for Disney's move, it  
would underscore the dangers of allowing huge conglomerates to gobble  
up diverse media companies.

On the other hand, a senior Disney executive says the real reason is  
that Disney caters to families of all political stripes and that many  
of them might be alienated by the film. Those families, of course,  
(Continue reading)

Kevin Callahan | 6 May 17:35 2004

Re: Strategy (was: Freedom human kind)

On May 5, 2004, at 11:04 PM, Stefano Mori wrote:

> Now, can we talk strategy?
> Stefano


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