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Mark Cranness | 1 Dec 2004 06:39
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UBS churn fee

This doc:
http://www.telecom.co.nz/binarys/ubs_faq1.pdf
... clarifies the churn fee, and I think it is now clear that the churn fee
is NOT paid to the ISP that looses the customer.

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paul | 1 Dec 2004 08:05

Re: UBS churn fee

Mark Cranness wrote:

>This doc:
>http://www.telecom.co.nz/binarys/ubs_faq1.pdf
>... clarifies the churn fee, and I think it is now clear that the churn fee
>is NOT paid to the ISP that looses the customer.
>
>  
>
When I interviewed Telecom about this they confirmed that the churn fee 
would be paid to Telecom regardless of which ISP was doing the taking 
and which ISP was doing the losing.

So if a UBS customer leaves Xtra for Orcon, Orcon pays Telecom a churn 
fee. If a UBS customer leaves Ihug for Orcon, Orcon pays Telecom a churn 
fee.

I've had it described to me as a book-keeping cost on a par with 
establishing a new connection for a customer who moves or installing a 
connection on a customer premises. While I can see the cost involved in 
a technician coming out to put the kit in place, I fail to see how 
Telecom needs to spend anywhere near $100 in letting an Ihug customer 
move to Orcon or whatever.

Cheers,

Paul Brislen

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Craig Humphrey | 1 Dec 2004 22:07
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RE: UBS churn fee

I suspect part of the churn fee is to make sure that Telecom makes a buck,
regardless of who is stealing customers from who...

As for $100 a pop... Perhaps the Xtra/JetStream/Telecom (HelpDesk group of
the day) people aren't able to make this change, so it needs to go via a
"technician", which means you have a handling fee plus the X seconds of time
it takes for the tech to locate the user (by phone number I guess) and
select a different ISP to route their traffic to.  (Please tell me it's that
simple... If not, perhaps it's time someone wrote an app to make it that
simple...)

Interesting to note that if an ISP converts it's existing JetStream
customers over to UBS, and runs out of "Churn credits", they then have to
start paying Telecom... For existing customers!

Just my 2c.
And expressly not the view of my employer.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-adsl <at> unixathome.org 
> [mailto:owner-adsl <at> unixathome.org] On Behalf Of paul
> Sent: Wednesday, December 01, 2004 8:06 PM
> To: Mark Cranness
> Cc: ADSL List
> Subject: Re: UBS churn fee

[snip snip]

> When I interviewed Telecom about this they confirmed that the 
> churn fee
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Steven Ellis | 5 Dec 2004 06:44

Orcon ADSL issues today (Sunday 5 Dec)?


Got major problems browsing anywhere using Orcon today. Is it just them 
or do other ISPs have issues.

Most sites, including Orcon's home page, won't even load. www.xtra.co.nz 
works, as does www.paradise.co.nz, but www.google.co.nz often doesn't 
even resolve DNS.

I've rebooted router and firewall with no change.

It was getting pretty bad on Saturday, but this morning it is unusable.

Steve
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John Morch | 5 Dec 2004 06:58
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RE: Orcon ADSL issues today (Sunday 5 Dec)?

I use both UBS and ADSL from Orcon (2 seperate Circuits)
and had no problems noticed with either today.

>From: Steven Ellis <mail_lists <at> stevencherie.net>
>To: ADSL List <adsl <at> lists.unixathome.org>
>Subject: Orcon ADSL issues today (Sunday 5 Dec)?
>Date: Sun, 05 Dec 2004 18:44:27 +1300
>
>
>Got major problems browsing anywhere using Orcon today. Is it just them or 
>do other ISPs have issues.
>
>Most sites, including Orcon's home page, won't even load. www.xtra.co.nz 
>works, as does www.paradise.co.nz, but www.google.co.nz often doesn't even 
>resolve DNS.
>
>I've rebooted router and firewall with no change.
>
>It was getting pretty bad on Saturday, but this morning it is unusable.
>
>Steve
>--
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>http://unixathome.org/adsl/ for archives, FAQ, and various documents. To 
>unsubscribe: send mail to majordomo <at> lists.unixathome.org with "unsubscribe 
>adsl" in the body of the message
>

_________________________________________________________________
Check out news, entertainment and more  <at>   http://xtra.co.nz/broadband
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Steve Phillips | 5 Dec 2004 07:12
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Re: Orcon ADSL issues today (Sunday 5 Dec)?

On Sun, 5 Dec 2004, Steven Ellis wrote:

>
> Got major problems browsing anywhere using Orcon today. Is it just them or do 
> other ISPs have issues.
[snip]
> It was getting pretty bad on Saturday, but this morning it is unusable.

And of course you have tried ringing Orcon helpdesk and asking them ?

I fail to see why this requires a post to the ADSL technical mailing list.

please keep OT posts to -chat.

(I've even CC'd that so you can simply trim the address field.)

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Steven Ellis | 5 Dec 2004 07:35

Re: Orcon ADSL issues today (Sunday 5 Dec)?

John Morch wrote:

> I use both UBS and ADSL from Orcon (2 seperate Circuits)
> and had no problems noticed with either today.

Got through to Orcon just now. They have other customers with the same 
issues which relate to Layer 3 UBS issues.

Steve
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Steven Ellis | 5 Dec 2004 08:01

Re: Orcon ADSL issues today (Sunday 5 Dec)?


Yes i've spoken to Orcon. Yes there is a problem.

It is a technical issue with Layer 3 UBS. They can't say if it has 
affected other ISPs

Hence isn't this the correct place to discuss it?

Steve
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Steven Ellis | 5 Dec 2004 09:12

Re: Orcon ADSL issues today (Sunday 5 Dec)?

Hmm

There is a TECHNICAL issue.. Hence reference technical email list..

I don't subscribe to chat as i'm only interested in technical 
problem/issues etc.

Steve

Steve Phillips wrote:

> On Sun, 5 Dec 2004, Steven Ellis wrote:
>
>>
>> Yes i've spoken to Orcon. Yes there is a problem.
>>
>> It is a technical issue with Layer 3 UBS. They can't say if it has 
>> affected other ISPs
>>
>> Hence isn't this the correct place to discuss it?
>>
>
> No.
>
> As I said, this should be discussed on adsl-chat <at>  NOT adsl <at>  or can you 
> somehow tell me how this relates to the technical side of the DSL world ?
>
> To me it seems markedly like an Orcon/Telecom/Service issue, why not 
> keep harassing them until such time as you get an answer or if you 
> really must ask other people then do it on the correct list.
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Mark Foster | 5 Dec 2004 09:26

Re: Orcon ADSL issues today (Sunday 5 Dec)?

Its not about DSL at a technical level, as it appears to be Orcon specific
- and its certainly the kind of thing that should be addressed via their
tech support guys.

I can understand Steves frustration, as there seems to be a trend to post
on here about issues which really should go straight to helpdesks first.

I mean, I know that people with a slight technical bent dont tend to like
helpdesks - its that whole 'I know more than they do' mentality coupled
with the 'i dont want to sit on hold' mentality - however it does need to
be take into consideration that

1) they provide a service, this includes (or not) tech support.
2) This is a list for the discussion of ADSL Technical issues. This doesnt
extend to doing the ISP tech support role for them...

I personally think Steve is being slightly Nazi here, but untill such time
as this becomes a 'problem with UBS in general' it really is of limited
interest to a lot of the audience here, some of whom don't use UBS and
many of whom will not be Orcon customers.

IMHO.

Mark.

On Sun, 5 Dec 2004, Steven Ellis wrote:

> Hmm
>
> There is a TECHNICAL issue.. Hence reference technical email list..
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