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James L. Harrison | 1 Jan 2006 01:27
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Re: Digest Number 1951

In my case with the GR-30 I  did not change the guitar tuning; I just 
created the patches with [IIRC] 17,17,17,17,16,17 semitones lower to 
give me the BEADGC six string bass tuning.

James

>Message: 9         
>   Date: Fri, 30 Dec 2005 14:26:26 -0800 (PST)
>   From: Bassic Audio Video Electronic Systems <bassic <at> sbcglobal.net>
>Subject: Re: Need help on tracking for lower tunings.
>
>I am a bass player thinking about using midi  very soon. I have been montoring this site for a while and have
one comment. Since ths is midi on a solid body guitar we are talking about why do you have to change the tuning
on your guitar. Can't the tuning be changed via midi and turn down the volume one the guitar and monitor the
midi  output. Since the tuning as well as the tension of the strings on the guitar haven't changed that would
eliminate any tracking problems. And could the unamplified sound on the guitar be easily ignored so that
the amplified midi sound with the lowered tuning would be what you were listening to. Isn't thins one uses
of midi.
>   
>  I haven't used midi on guitar so this might be too simplistic but I have used midi with keyboards, effects
etc.Maybe there is some reason I haven't thought of that would require you to lower the tuning. Other than
not knowing how to change tunings vis midi, I can't think of any.
>   
>  Please enlighten me
>   
>  
>
>ralf <buttjuicer <at> hotmail.com> wrote:
>  Hi all. I am looking for some input on improving tracking with 
>extremely down-tuned guitars.
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Michael something or other | 1 Jan 2006 02:20
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hard to find parts

This is not spam, but a quick note where you can findd those hard to 
find parts. I was looking for a rotary encoder/data pot for my emu 
proteus. Some kind person sent me this link, and I just thought the 
rest of you might need some hard to find doodad.
www.digikey.com

Good luck for the new year!
mlr_pa <at> yahoo.com
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/pageartist.cfm?bandID=440762

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Greg | 1 Jan 2006 08:32
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Re: Need help on tracking for lower tunings.

buy a baritone guitar?

Greg

*****

--- In midiguitar <at> yahoogroups.com, "ralf" <buttjuicer <at> h...> wrote:
>
> Hi all. I am looking for some input on improving tracking with 
> extremely down-tuned guitars. 
> I am using GK-2A & GK-2 pickups on a Les Paul & a Gibson Rd Artist 
> respectivly, with a GR-1 . Normally I tune a drop-Db (DbAbDbGbBbEb) 
> with gauge .052 to .012 , and everything works fine.
> 
> However, with a new band I am starting to work with, they tune much 
> lower,  AEADF#B, low to high using gauges .065 to .015. Under this 
> setup, notes on the 1st,2nd or 3rd fret are dicey at best. Open notes 
> don't track at all. Anything 4th fret or above tracks adequatly. 
> 
> Now, i've played around adjusting the height of the hex pickup,and 
> there may be a few more mils I can get closer, but given that higher 
> notes work ok , I am skeptical of how much this will improve the 
> situation
> 
> I am curious is anyone else has had to deal with this problem ? After 
> nosing around the net for a while I have some possible improvements.
> 
> 1) Use a longer scale guitar: Ive read at the amir-derakh.com site 
> (he's the guitar player in Orgy)that his signature guitars are 26.25" 
> to accomodate low tuning/synth tracking .
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Nik | 1 Jan 2006 09:22
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RE: Speaking of guage,pitch&tracking

The official Axon documentation also says that the Axon learns your
technique and adapts to it, and we know that that is rubbish. The Neural Net
did all its learning during product development.

I read Andras' original patents for the Axon system a few years ago. I wish
I had kept copies - maybe Andras would like to post them to the group files
section? Anyway, there is a direct relationship between string length,
density (gauge), tension, impulse propagation and wavelength. 

The Axon gets it's advantage from the fact that regular pitch detection
algorithms such as used by Roland (and the Axon when in fingerpick mode)
require TWO oscillations of the string at least.

Nik

-----Original Message-----
From: midiguitar <at> yahoogroups.com [mailto:midiguitar <at> yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Udo van der Meer
Sent: 31 December 2005 22:54
To: midiguitar <at> yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [midiguitar] Speaking of guage,pitch&tracking

That's interesting. It appears to disagree with, what I presume is, the 
official Axon documentation that came with my unit: '..... Engineers at 
Blue Chip have successfully developed an early recognition system that 
analyzes the impulse that occurs at the very instant a string is played. 
This system recognizes the pitch of a string before it fully vibrates'.

Happy New Year everyone (we're already about 10 hours into it here in 
Sydney).
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a.szalay | 1 Jan 2006 14:19
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RE: Speaking of guage,pitch&tracking

On 1 Jan 2006 at 8:22, Nik wrote:

> The official Axon documentation also says that the Axon learns your
> technique and adapts to it, and we know that that is rubbish. The Neural Net
> did all its learning during product development.

Right, this is true. However, the statement:
'This system recognizes the pitch of a string before it fully vibrates'.
is not completely false by my interpretation. It is a question what do we mean
'the string fully vibrates'. I would say, ideally this is the case when the 
vibration periods are repeating so that they are absolutely equal.
In the real world, this would be when they are almost equal. Anyway,
it assumes at least two cycles before you can make such a statement. 

> I read Andras' original patents for the Axon system a few years ago. I wish
> I had kept copies - maybe Andras would like to post them to the group files
> section? Anyway, there is a direct relationship between string length,
> density (gauge), tension, impulse propagation and wavelength. 

You can find them at the US Patent Office web page, www.uspto.gov;
search for SZALAY in the INVENTOR NAME field, and GUITAR in ALL FIELDS.

Andras Szalay

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gregor_malecha | 1 Jan 2006 15:22
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Re: Speaking of guage,pitch&tracking

The full & direct link for the Szalay & Guitar patents search is: 

http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?
Sect1=PTO2&Sect2=HITOFF&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2Fsearch-
bool.html&r=0&f=S&l=50&TERM1=Szalay&FIELD1=INZZ&co1=AND&TERM2=GUITAR&F
IELD2=&d=ptxt

(just hack the link together into your browser's address bar.)

or, the page where to enter the terms Andras mentioned is: 

http://patft.uspto.gov/netahtml/search-bool.html

:^) Greg

--- and: happy new year to all! ---

--- In midiguitar <at> yahoogroups.com, a.szalay <at> a... wrote:
>
> On 1 Jan 2006 at 8:22, Nik wrote:
> 
> > The official Axon documentation also says that the Axon learns 
> > your technique and adapts to it, and we know that that is 
> > rubbish. The Neural Net did all its learning during product 
> > development.
> 
> Right, this is true. However, the statement:
> 'This system recognizes the pitch of a string before it fully 
> vibrates' is not completely false by my interpretation. It is a 
> question what do we mean 'the string fully vibrates'. I would say,
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Nik | 1 Jan 2006 19:20
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Re: Re: Speaking of guage,pitch&tracking

Thanks!

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "gregor_malecha" <greg.malecha <at> tiscali.de>
To: <midiguitar <at> yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, January 01, 2006 2:22 PM
Subject: [midiguitar] Re: Speaking of guage,pitch&tracking

> The full & direct link for the Szalay & Guitar patents search is: 
> 
> http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?
> Sect1=PTO2&Sect2=HITOFF&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2Fsearch-
> bool.html&r=0&f=S&l=50&TERM1=Szalay&FIELD1=INZZ&co1=AND&TERM2=GUITAR&F
> IELD2=&d=ptxt
> 
> (just hack the link together into your browser's address bar.)
> 
> or, the page where to enter the terms Andras mentioned is: 
> 
> http://patft.uspto.gov/netahtml/search-bool.html
> 
> :^) Greg
> 

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Nik | 1 Jan 2006 19:20
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Re: Speaking of guage,pitch&tracking

Fair enough.

Nik

----- Original Message ----- 
From: <a.szalay <at> axelero.hu>
To: <midiguitar <at> yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, January 01, 2006 1:19 PM
Subject: RE: [midiguitar] Speaking of guage,pitch&tracking

 the statement:
> 'This system recognizes the pitch of a string before it fully vibrates'.
> is not completely false by my interpretation. It is a question what do we 
> mean
> 'the string fully vibrates'. I would say, ideally this is the case when 
> the
> vibration periods are repeating so that they are absolutely equal.
> In the real world, this would be when they are almost equal. Anyway,
> it assumes at least two cycles before you can make such a statement.
>
> 

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Tim Gallant | 1 Jan 2006 23:40
Tim Gallant <tim <at> timgallant.org>

Re: Speaking of guage,pitch&tracking

--- In midiguitar <at> yahoogroups.com, "gregor_malecha"
<greg.malecha <at> t...> wrote:
>
> The full & direct link for the Szalay & Guitar patents search is: 
> 
> http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?
> Sect1=PTO2&Sect2=HITOFF&p=1&u=%2Fnetahtml%2Fsearch-
> bool.html&r=0&f=S&l=50&TERM1=Szalay&FIELD1=INZZ&co1=AND&TERM2=GUITAR&F
> IELD2=&d=ptxt
> 
> (just hack the link together into your browser's address bar.)

Considerably easier:

http://tinyurl.com/d6cem

:)

tim

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Jon Francis | 2 Jan 2006 21:56
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So VG8>VGS1>VGEX?

It has been recommended that the VG8has better synth like capabilities.

I did look on ebay and just missed a bid on a VGS1. S1?? OK, this is
what I found out, lets see if I understand this.

First comes the VG8. Then came an S1 expansion card that you stuck
into the unit and it "burned' new enhancements and bug fixes into the
VG8 memory, eprom, whatever..
Then came the VGEX which has the S1 enhancements already installed
from the factory PLUS 32 more presets added. 
So, basically the S1 was an upgrade and the EX, while still being an
S1, (same amps,pickups,guitar models,etc) simply has more factorey
presets added.
Also, one final thing. The VG8 needed the hex pickup entirely, were as
with the VG88 it will also take the straight guitar pickups as well as
the hex to access more features. Yes?

Is this right?

Thanks
Jon

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Gmane