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Cyndi Norwitz | 1 Dec 2007 23:20
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Viewing Full Subscriber & Subscriber Security

Hi, I'm new to the list, though I undoubtedly know some of you from other
list management lists.  I am in the process of migrating my mailing lists
from majordomo on a friend's server to mailman at sonic.net.

I have many questions which I haven't been able to answer by reading the
FAQ's.  Some are specific to Sonic most likely and I post those to the
Sonic usenet group for mailman, though it's a slow group.

My first question is about how to view my subscriber list.  It's not a
problem for the small lists.  I simply go to that page in the interface and
there everyone is.  

Unfortunately, once membership hits a certain level, mailman won't provide
the full list.  Now I have to look by letter.  So instead of viewing my
subscriber list in one fail swoop, I need to do it 26 times.

The FAQ taught me about the roster page, which is cool, but it just gives
the list of names, divided by regular and digest.  I can't do things like
page down to see who to unmoderate.  See:
http://lists.sonic.net/mailman/roster/lcveg   

Is there a way to see the entire membership list with all the interactive
boxes I get as an admin? 

Is this a setting on the ISP's end?  Can they make the option available?
or at least raise the threshhold for putting the list into letter-only
status?

Then there is a security question.  When I got the roster (requiring no
password), each name on the list was clickable.  When I clicked on a name,
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Mark Sapiro | 2 Dec 2007 00:32
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Re: Viewing Full Subscriber & Subscriber Security

Cyndi Norwitz wrote:
>
>Is there a way to see the entire membership list with all the interactive
>boxes I get as an admin? 
>
>Is this a setting on the ISP's end?  Can they make the option available?
>or at least raise the threshhold for putting the list into letter-only
>status?

There are bug reports and feature requests in the sourceforge tracker
about this and lots of email in the archives. I'm embarrased to say
one of the bug reports is mine and I've never fixed it. See
<http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1072002&group_id=103&atid=100103>,
<http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=782436&group_id=103&atid=350103>
and
<http://www.google.com/search?q=site%3Amail.python.org++inurl%3Amailman++admin_member_chunksize>

The short answer is the Mailman admins at the ISP have to do it. There
is a site configuration setting DEFAULT_ADMIN_MEMBER_CHUNKSIZE which
defaults to 30 and sets the list's admin_member_chunksize attribute at
list create time. This in turn is the number above which the
membership is 'chunked'.

This can be changed for a list by running

bin/config_list -i <input_file> <listname>

with an input file containing the single line

admin_member_chunksize = 200
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Cyndi Norwitz | 2 Dec 2007 01:58
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Re: Viewing Full Subscriber & Subscriber Security

   Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2007 15:32:45 -0800
   From: Mark Sapiro <mark <at> msapiro.net>

   There are bug reports and feature requests in the sourceforge tracker
   about this and lots of email in the archives. I'm embarrased to say
   one of the bug reports is mine and I've never fixed it. See
   <http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1072002&group_id=103&atid=100103>,
   <http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=782436&group_id=103&atid=350103>
   and
   <http://www.google.com/search?q=site%3Amail.python.org++inurl%3Amailman++admin_member_chunksize>

Well, there are things that have been in my inbox for years too :)

But if you want a "me too" for making it a priority, here it is.

   The short answer is the Mailman admins at the ISP have to do it. There
   is a site configuration setting DEFAULT_ADMIN_MEMBER_CHUNKSIZE which
   defaults to 30 and sets the list's admin_member_chunksize attribute at
   list create time. This in turn is the number above which the
   membership is 'chunked'.

Thanks, I will pass this on to the site admins.

   >Then there is a security question.  When I got the roster (requiring no
   >password), each name on the list was clickable.  When I clicked on a
   >name, it took me to the subscription page for that person.  Without
   >requiring a password.  When I did it for my own name I figured that my
   >password was just in a cookie.  But it works for a random name too.

   If this were a real security issue, it should be posted per
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Cyndi Norwitz | 2 Dec 2007 02:06
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Mass Subscribe Option

Okay, another question.

I am migrating lists from another system and the easiest way to do this is
to use mass subscribe and just put all the old users into it.  With a few
warnings on the existing list that anyone who doesn't want to be moved
needs to unsub now.

When I use mass subscribe at Sonic.net, the text indicates I'll have a
choice of actually subscribing the addresses or inviting them.  But there
is no choice.  It just goes directly to invite.

This has been a problem because, for one list I've migrated, there are
about 65 subscribers who have responded to the invite (I've done it twice
along with several posts to the existing list with links to the direct sub
page) and about 250 who haven't.  Only one person has asked not to be
migrated.  In some cases, friends of mine haven't responded to the invite
(and said they didn't see the requests...because they weren't paying
attention, not because they weren't sent).

I'd really like to sub everyone and be done with it.

I assume this is a setting on Sonic's end?  I posted to the local usenet
group for mailman and got no reply (their tech support prefers to use
usenet for anything that's not a basic issue and they are good about
replying except in the mailman group, which is rarely used).

If someone can confirm my suspicion and give me the details, I will pass it
on to Sonic tech support and see if they can do something about it.  I
suspect it was set this way on purpose as an antispam measure, but it's a
big inconveince for those of us migrating legitimate lists.
(Continue reading)

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Mark Sapiro | 2 Dec 2007 02:34
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Re: Mass Subscribe Option

Cyndi Norwitz wrote:
>
>When I use mass subscribe at Sonic.net, the text indicates I'll have a
>choice of actually subscribing the addresses or inviting them.  But there
>is no choice.  It just goes directly to invite.

I'm not aware of any bugs in this specific function, so I can only
assume that this is a sonic.net 'feature' to force you to invite only.
Why they wouldn't also fix the web page to make it clear is beyond me,
but mass subscribe works in all the Mailman versions that I have any
experience with.

--

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark <at> msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
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Ignacio Valdes | 2 Dec 2007 05:21
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httpd.conf Rewrite rules with ZOPE to use mailman.

Hi all,

I'm running a Zope instance that requires me to have re-write rules
(below) in httpd.conf that are not compatible with Mailman. I can use
mailman if I don't use the Zope re-write rules or I can use Zope but
not mailman with the re-write rules below. This seems like a black art
to me. Is there a way to change the re-write rules so that they both
work at the same time? Thanks!

NameVirtualHost 72.51.39.124:80

    <VirtualHost 72.51.39.124:80>
    ServerName brainimagingnews.net
    ServerAdmin webmaster <at> brainimagingnews.net
    ProxyPass /
http://localhost:8080/VirtualHostBase/http/brainimagingnews.net:80/brainimagingnews/VirtualHostRoot/
    ProxyPassReverse /
http://localhost:8080/VirtualHostBase/http/brainimagingnews.net:80/brainimagingnews/VirtualHostRoot/
    </VirtualHost>

    <VirtualHost 72.51.39.124:80>
    ServerName www.brainimagingnews.net
#    ServerAlias *
# redirects everything
    Redirect permanent / http://brainimagingnews.net/
   </VirtualHost>

My mailman.conf looks like this:

#
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Mark Sapiro | 2 Dec 2007 07:59
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Re: Mass Subscribe Option

Cyndi Norwitz wrote:
>
>If someone can confirm my suspicion and give me the details, I will pass it
>on to Sonic tech support and see if they can do something about it.  I
>suspect it was set this way on purpose as an antispam measure, but it's a
>big inconveince for those of us migrating legitimate lists.

As I said in my prior reply, I suspect this is intentional on Sonic's
part, but you may be able to negotiate with them to do a one time add
for you from a list provided by you. The command line add_members tool
should still be functional. It takes a file of lines like

Jane Doe <jdoe <at> example.com>

and adds each name/address to the list.

--

-- 
Mark Sapiro <mark <at> msapiro.net>        The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area, California    better use your sense - B. Dylan
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Christopher X. Candreva | 2 Dec 2007 14:44
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Re: httpd.conf Rewrite rules with ZOPE to use mailman.

On Sat, 1 Dec 2007, Ignacio Valdes wrote:

> I'm running a Zope instance that requires me to have re-write rules
> (below) in httpd.conf that are not compatible with Mailman. I can use
> mailman if I don't use the Zope re-write rules or I can use Zope but
> not mailman with the re-write rules below. This seems like a black art
> to me. Is there a way to change the re-write rules so that they both
> work at the same time? Thanks!

The easiest thing may be to set up another NameVirtualHost  
mailman.brainimagingnews.net  to run mailman that doesn't have the re-write 
rules.

==========================================================
Chris Candreva  -- chris <at> westnet.com -- (914) 948-3162
WestNet Internet Services of Westchester
http://www.westnet.com/
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Noel da Costa | 2 Dec 2007 16:54
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Re: MX records

Hi all,

Thanks for the replies so far.

> From: "Shadow" <Shadow <at> shadowsnetwork.com>
> I would say that this line shows the problem
> Diagnostic-Code: smtp; 550 <newlist <at> mydomain.co.uk>: invalid address

Yes, I agree.. but I'm not sure how to add a mail alias to my domain  
if not through the admin console.

> From: Brad Knowles <brad <at> shub-internet.org>
> Option #2 would probably be closest, but what you'd have to do is  
> to set up the ten aliases needed for each list to be forwarded to a  
> local program on the machine.  If your hosting provider doesn't  
> allow that, then you can't use their interface to set up aliases.

I have root access, so it should be possible, I just don't know how.

> If your provider is using an MTA like postfix, with the right  
> options specified in the Mailman configuration file then you can  
> use mechanisms built into Mailman that can automatically generate  
> the necessary aliases for you, and postfix will automatically pick  
> up those changes on-the-fly.  However, this also requires  
> modification to the postfix configuration files, and if your  
> provider doesn't allow that, then obviously this won't be an option  
> for you.

It sounds, from what you are saying, that I shouldn't need to set the  
aliases up manually via the management console if Postfix is
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Brad Knowles | 2 Dec 2007 17:20
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Re: MX records

On 12/2/07, Noel da Costa wrote:

>  It sounds, from what you are saying, that I shouldn't need to set the
>  aliases up manually via the management console if Postfix is
>  correctly integrated.

Correct.  What will happen is that, as new lists are created, Mailman 
will add the appropriate aliases to a second file, which postfix will 
be told how to read, and postfix will automatically pick up all 
changes.  However, postfix will also be told not to otherwise try to 
manage the second aliases file in question -- Mailman will do that 
instead.

>                         I looked through the Mailman manual, at the bit
>  which says Postfix Integration, but to be honest, it was all greek to
>  me.
>
>  Anyone care to help me through it?

Regretfully, that's not something I've got time to help with right now.  ;(

--

-- 
Brad Knowles <brad <at> shub-internet.org>
LinkedIn Profile: <http://tinyurl.com/y8kpxu>
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