Jameson "Chema" Quinn | 1 Dec 02:12 2008
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Re: [Sugar-devel] OLPC + Sugar



I haven't found it to be that difficult.

o Sugar Labs has defined itself fairly clearly.

o The OLPC volunteers are out doing software development,
localization, and other essential tasks with extensive public
discussion. It seems likely that most of the software development will
move over to Sugar Labs, leaving behind OFW, drivers, and such. People
are working on transferring some of the servers. 


o OLPC management and staff have never communicated effectively with
the outside world. Not with volunteers, not with partner
organizations, not with the public. I am working on this problem, and
have established a tenuous connection with Nicholas and some of
management, but don't hold your breath.

I presume you mean to include the OLPC contractors (Tomeu, Sayamindu, Morgs) and the more available of the staff (Eben, for instance) in the general category with volunteers, since it seems clear to me that they are capable of effective communication, but also clear that they do not receive effective communication from OLPC higher-ups.

Jameson

_______________________________________________
Sugar mailing list
Sugar <at> lists.laptop.org
http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
Tomeu Vizoso | 1 Dec 14:16 2008

Re: Sugar on Ubuntu Intrepid broken

On Thu, Nov 27, 2008 at 4:45 PM, Erik Blankinship <erikb <at> mediamods.com> wrote:
> Perhaps address how Activity authors might need to handle / work
> around the different distro specifics on one page, unless the goal is
> to have different activity releases per distro.

Yeah, that's an interesting subject. We have control on the sugar api,
in other words, what activity authors can expect to find that is
specific to sugar. But activities use lots of other, non-sugar,
software like libraries, X, etc How can activity authors know what
their activities can expect in the environments they are run in?

One notable example: many activities developed for the XO depend on
pygame, but I'm not sure it's properly packaged for all distros, and
even then, activities installed as .xo won't be dragging it along. How
can we give a better experience here?

Regards,

Tomeu

> On 11/27/08, Walter Bender <walter.bender <at> gmail.com> wrote:
>> I think the distro-specific issues should be delegated to the
>> individual distro pages. The Supported Systems page is a bit of a
>> tangle right now. Anyone have time to do a reorg?
>>
>> -walter
>>
>> On Thu, Nov 27, 2008 at 4:09 AM, Morgan Collett
>> <morgan.collett <at> gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Thu, Nov 27, 2008 at 02:06, Edward Cherlin <echerlin <at> gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> On Wed, Nov 26, 2008 at 2:33 PM, Luke Faraone <luke <at> laptop.org> wrote:
>>>>> On Wed, Nov 26, 2008 at 17:07, Edward Cherlin <echerlin <at> gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> mokurai <at> mokurai-laptop:~$ sugar-emulator
>>>>>> Traceback (most recent call last):
>>>>>>  File "/usr/bin/sugar-emulator", line 22, in <module>
>>>>>>    from emulator import main
>>>>>>  File "/usr/share/sugar/shell/emulator.py", line 31, in <module>
>>>>>>    from sugar import env
>>>>>> ImportError: No module named sugar
>>>>>
>>>>> Edward, this is not a Sugar problem, please ask about it on the
>>>>> sugar-ubuntu
>>>>> mailing list.
>>>>
>>>> We need a Wiki page with a detailed statement of which bugs and
>>>> support questions go on which lists. I think that the current setup
>>>> works fine for the developers working in each of the projects
>>>> involved, but is hopeless for others, especially newcomers.
>>>
>>> I agree. I'm not sure where such a page should go - on the supported
>>> systems page? On the page for each distro?
>>>
>>> The plan for Ubuntu is that you should log bugs in the Ubuntu
>>> bugtracker, https://launchpad.net - for example,
>>> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sugar for Sugar itself.
>>> Please log your issue there so we can track it.
>>>
>>>>> In any case, how did you install sugar, exactly? It works fine for me on
>>>>> a
>>>>> fresh intrepid install.
>>>>
>>>> I had Sugar installed, and I upgraded to Intrepid. There was one
>>>> dependency error that required me to do a manual package installation,
>>>> replacing sugar-datastore with python-olpc-datastore, IIRC.
>>>
>>> That is a known issue which still needs fixing, ubuntu-sugarteam...
>>>
>>> Regards
>>> Morgan
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Sugar mailing list
>>> Sugar <at> lists.laptop.org
>>> http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Walter Bender
>> Sugar Labs
>> http://www.sugarlabs.org
>> _______________________________________________
>> Sugar mailing list
>> Sugar <at> lists.laptop.org
>> http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Sugar mailing list
> Sugar <at> lists.laptop.org
> http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
>
Greg Smith | 1 Dec 17:28 2008
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Re: OLPC Afghanistan

Hi Ebtihaj,

I came across two pages in our wiki which refer to OLPC Afghanistan:
http://wiki.laptop.org/go/One_Laptop_Per_Child_Afghanistan
and
http://wiki.laptop.org/go/OLPC_Afghanistan

They are very similar but not exactly the same. Can you collapse them 
both in to a single page?

By tradition, we use the OLPC_Afghanistan naming convention. Whatever 
works for you as long as we have a main, single place to look.

Thanks,

Greg S

***************

Date: Thu, 27 Nov 2008 01:50:19 -0800 (PST)
From: Ebtihaj Obaidi <ebtihaj_obaidi <at> yahoo.com>
Subject: [sugar] OLPC Afghanistan
To: Localization <localization <at> lists.laptop.org>,
	sugar <at> lists.laptop.org,	grassroots <at> lists.laptop.org
Message-ID: <228980.26323.qm <at> web58403.mail.re3.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Hi dears.
finally OLPC Afghanistan started its official work from Afghanistan.
For details just visit:
http://wiki.laptop.org/go/One_Laptop_Per_Child_Afghanistan
OR
http://www.olpc.blogsky.com

Sohaib Obaidi "Ebtihaj"

BSc. (Hons.) Economics, IIIE-IIUI
OLPC Afghanistan
Community Development Liaison.

+923349072974
sohaib <at> paiwastoo.com.af

http://www.eqtisad.co.cc
http://www.olpc.blogsky.com
http://www.olpc.af
Simon Peter | 1 Dec 17:48 2008
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Sbuntu 8.10: Sugar for Ubuntu Live USB, updated


I have updated sbuntu (Sugar for Ubuntu Live USB) to Ubuntu 8.10 (Intrepid
Ibex). This solves many issues that were present in the earlier version.

http://dev.laptop.org/~probono/sbuntu/

Basically, you just need to add one file to a stock Ubuntu Live USB system
made from  the official ubuntu-8.10-desktop-i386.iso and you will have a
Ubuntu 8.10 Sugar Live USB system.

Let me address some questions and concerns that came up on the Sugar mailing
list earlier:

Caroline Meeks asked:
> Is there a way I can I copy my USB and make the new one bootable 
> so I don't have to go through the whole process again?  

If you have more than one USB stick with the exact same size, you can clone
the entire stick using the dd command. Boot a Linux distribution, attach the
source and the target USB sticks. Find out their device names. In the
following example I will assume that the source device is /dev/sdb and the
target device is /dev/sdc. CAUTION! These names will likely be different on
your system and using the following command is DANGEROUS as it will WIPE the
target device. Unmount both sticks. Then as root, run:
dd if=/dev/sdb of=/dev/sdc bs=8M
This will clone the contents of the source stick (sdb) to the target stick
(sdc). This is a standard procedure that should work with any kind of
bootable USB stick.

Walter Bender asked:
> I've tried with a 1 GB and a 2 GB USB. In both cases, it complains 
> that I don't have enough space. Anyone have any experience getting 
> this to work? Also, creating the USB image was **very** slow. 

These were known bugs in the liveusb tool, but starting with Ubuntu 8.10,
Ubuntu includes a different tool called usb-creator (System ->
Administration -> Create a USB startup disk).

Caroline Meeks asked:
> This particular setup doesn't let you escape out of Sugar 
> back down into Ubuntu as far as I could figure out.

Sbuntu is configured to launch Sugar by default. But if you log out from
sugar (press Ctrl-Alt-Backspace), you get the Ubuntu (GDM) login screen
which lets you choose your session type from the settings menu in the
bottom-left corner. Select "Gnome", and login as user "ubuntu" with no
password. This will give you the standard Gnome desktop, with the Sugar
Emulator available from the applications menu.

Caroline Meeks asked:
> Please provide instructions on exactly what to download. 
> I picked liveusb_0.1.1_all.deb
> Then also provide instructions on exactly what the user should do 
> to install it.  

This step is no longer necessary since starting with Ubuntu 8.10, Ubuntu
itself includes a tool called usb-creator (System -> Administration ->
Create a USB startup disk).

Caroline Meeks asked:
> If you use the persistence option, you need to replace casper/initrd.gz

This step is no longer necessary since the bug has been fixed in Ubuntu
8.10.

Caroline Meeks asked:
> Add the file sugar.squashfs to the directory casper/ on the USB stick
> Again the write protection on Casper made this more of a challenge 
> then might be expected.

If you want to modify the USB stick you are currently running from, do:
sudo mount /cdrom -o remount,rw 
Starting with Ubuntu 8.10, this will remount the USB stick writable by root. 

Tomeu Vizoso asked: 
> Have already been any discussions about adding Subuntu to the list of 
> official Ubuntu derivatives for the next release?

Sbuntu is a customization (add-on file) to an existing Ubuntu Live system,
not a derivative distribution. (This has advantages... you can update the
sugar portion by exchanging 1 file, without having to remaster the
underlying Ubuntu distribution itself. Also the download is much smaller.)

Caroline Meeks asked:
> Is there an easier way to help people create USBs?

If there is enough demand, one could make a Sugar activity that would clone
the currently running USB stick to a blank USB stick.

Please report Sbuntu issues to me, and issues related to usb-creator to
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/usb-creator

Of course, ideas for improvement are welcome!

--

-- 
View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/Sbuntu-8.10%3A-Sugar-for-Ubuntu-Live-USB%2C-updated-tp1599461p1599461.html
Sent from the Sugar mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
Edward Cherlin | 1 Dec 21:45 2008
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Re: [Sugar-devel] [sugar] OLPC + Sugar

On Sun, Nov 30, 2008 at 5:12 PM, Jameson Chema Quinn
<jquinn <at> cs.oberlin.edu> wrote:

>> o OLPC management and staff have never communicated effectively with
>> the outside world. Not with volunteers, not with partner
>> organizations, not with the public. I am working on this problem, and
>> have established a tenuous connection with Nicholas and some of
>> management, but don't hold your breath.
>
> I presume you mean to include the OLPC contractors (Tomeu, Sayamindu, Morgs)
> and the more available of the staff (Eben, for instance) in the general
> category with volunteers, since it seems clear to me that they are capable
> of effective communication, but also clear that they do not receive
> effective communication from OLPC higher-ups.

Quite right. Thanks for the more precise and more correct restatement.

> Jameson

--

-- 
Silent Thunder
(默雷/धर्ममेघशब्दगर्ज/دھرممیگھشبدگر ج) is my name
And Children are my nation.
The Cosmos is my dwelling place, The Truth my destination.
http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/User:Mokurai
_______________________________________________
IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!)
IAEP <at> lists.sugarlabs.org
http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep
Walter Bender | 1 Dec 23:00 2008
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Sugar Digest 2008-12-01

=== Sugar Digest ===

1. Bonjour: I gave the keynote at the first Netbook World Summit in
Paris (See [[Presentations]]). The opening welcome was delivered by
Hervé Yahi, CEO of Mandriva, and indeed Mandriva was well represented
at the congress. Yahi asked, "How big will the netbook market become?"
He (and almost every subsequent speaker) broke the market down into
two categories: a primary tool in the emerging market and a second
device in the developed world. In my talk, I suggested that the
netbook was at the forefront of the emerging cultural and
technological battle between telephony and computing—i.e., the culture
of service and the culture of creation. Inviting children into the
community of learners and problem-solvers is ''the'' opportunity
afforded by giving them access to computation and "learning as a
verb".

OLPC's Bastien Guéry (of Haiti-deployment fame; soon moving to
Lebanon) and Patrick Ferran, director of a educational netbook
company, Gdium.com (a MIPS platform running Mandriva), held a panel
discussion on education. Collaboration was the hot topic—the Sugar
model is attractive even in the developed world. And, as always, how
to change the culture of learning in schools remains a conundrum.

The netbook hardware session featured a panel with representatives
from ASUS, Samsung, Qualcomm, Lenovo, and MSI. ASUS is interested in
offering a network bundle with web storage and Linux application
bundles. Their original idea was the laptop as a second PC, but now
they are also targeted to the first PC market. Samsung has entered the
netbook market recently and has big, but ambiguous plans. They are
also thinking hard about connectivity. (It is ironic that roughly
15-years ago, when I was on the IBM mobile computing advisory board, I
tried to convince them to make connectivity a product differentiator.
Their response was to sell off their Global connectivity business.
Sigh.) Qualcomm, which has 30% of the handset market, announced a new
chipset to compete in the netbook space. Their chips provide
connectivity and the multimedia functionality in phones. The always
connect/always on nature of a phone is the kind of experience that
they are trying to bring to the netbook market. Its focus is a mobile
device—moving towards phone-like experience. Lenovo is game—they are
thinking in terms of corporate buyers for a variety of categories,
including education. MSI is a French OEM that makes the Wind product.
They are explicitly targeting education in the emerging market. Their
Wind Box is a fanless, screenless brick, which may have potential for
a low-end school server.

The moderator asked what are the criteria for choosing for the OS on
these devices: Lenovo sees predominately new users to date. (Although
the world-wide economic slowdown is playing a role as well.) Their
education customers are Linux-focused; consumers are asking for both.
Qualcomm sees this as a new market—the best of the wireless world and
the best of the laptop world—a new device. Samsung thinks the user
wants something simple for the second PC—web browsing. The first-PC
market is looking for "standard" systems (XP).  ASUS is also splitting
their strategy between emerging and mature markets. Everyone agreed
that netbooks are not cannibalizing the traditional notebook market
(but they are having an impact on price). But also everyone seems to
be drifting towards larger screens, a hard disk, and Windows—along
with a higher price. "10 inches is where the market is going." The
retail market is asking for XP, but the professional and vertical
markets, e.g., education are asking for Linux.

The follow-on panel was pretty depressing: Are netbooks mobile device
or PC replacements. Mozilla opined always-on connectivity is
essential, the browser is ''the'' application and nothing else is
important, e.g., the OS doesn't matter and running non-web-based
applications is "old think". In contradiction to this, "Linux has
momentum and it is a place for innovation; you innovate because you
can." [http://www.thinkgos.com/ gOS], who makes "Cloud", a Linux
distribution that focuses on a browser, with an application "doc" in
the browser. It is a "dual boot" machine, but the Linux distribution
is instant on to a browser. Xandros argued that "Economics drives
adoption of Linux from the OEM perspective"; but now there is a race
in the application space. There is a 20-Euro difference in the OEM
price between XP and Linux, but that is not enough to convince an OEM
to switch away from the mainstream. The netbook started as a new type
of device, but now it is marketed as a mini-laptop, which is why
Windows is getting a larger market share: the consumer as consumer.

The final panel featured service providers. SFR (www.sfr.com) has its
base of customers using their services for web access from mobile
phones; they have recently expanded into the netbook (specifically,
the eeePC market) by offering 3G connectivity. Comwax (www.comwax.com)
offers a touch-based ("iPhone on a notebook") user
experience—"always-on social networks" being the buzz phrase most
often heard at the meeting. They tout lots of Sugar-like features: 1
click; unified contact list; and the seemingly ubiquitous application
store. They'll be marketing through mobile carriers. gloBull
(www.myglobull.com) focused their presentation on mobility and
security. They have a secure boot that then launches a signed virtual
environment—Windows or XP. (Sound familiar?)

A concluding presentation was given by IDC, a market research company,
entitled "Netbook market opportunity: Hype or hope?" IDC believe that
netbooks represent a big opportunity: 30 million units by 2012 (35%
annual growth per year). (OLPC is only a very small consideration in
their market projections. I guess they are playing wait and see if his
prediction of 200 million XOs in 2009 running Windows will be
realized.) Price and ease of use are considered the key contributions
to the market share. (What does ease of use mean when we are talking
about vanilla XP?) Intel and Microsoft have been very aggressive in
marketing in EMEA (l'Europe, le Moyen-Orient (Middle East) et
l'Afrique). In EMEA, the OS is rapidly switching to XP with big push
in retail channels by Microsoft and 80% of shipments are to consumers
as second laptops with laptop expectations for their netbooks.
However, IDC sees one-to-one computing in education as a big
opportunity—50% of all portable PCs sold to education by 2012 (but a
small percentage of the overall netbook market). Telcos are beginning
to enter the netbook market—in an effort to push mobile broadband. The
netbook fits that role, with the added benefit that they pay a smaller
subsidy per consumer. All of this is putting pricing pressure on
traditional notebooks. The big surprise to me is the extent to which
Europe is dominating the netbook market—I always thought they were a
mobile phone culture.

The reception was held at the Paris Museum of Modern Art (MAM) where
we had a private viewing of a Dufy retrospective and cocktails in the
Matisse Room (See
[http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3253/3075519670_5a008de2cb_b.jpg Dufy]
and [http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3041/3075519684_b5940e9c23_b.jpg
Matisse]).

2. Threads: There have been a number of interesting discussions on the
lists this week:

* Luis Michelena and Daniel Ajoy have been in a dynamic discussion of
new Turtle Art features driven by pedagogical features being voiced by
teachers ([http://lists.laptop.org/pipermail/olpc-sur/2008-November/001359.html]
and [http://lists.laptop.org/pipermail/olpc-sur/2008-November/001455.html])
* Tomeu Vizoso has blogged about his experience walking the teachers
in Uruguay through the process of building a "mind map" activity
([http://blog.tomeuvizoso.net/2008/11/labyrinth-experience.html]).
* Martin Langhoff has started a thread in the laptop.org wiki
regarding the school server Moodle design
([http://wiki.laptop.org/go/XS_Moodle_design XS Moodle design]).

3. Looking for a project?: Tomeu has posted notes from the Sugar Camp
brainstorming session regarding collaboration features for Sugar
Activities. Lots of opportunities to get your start developing in
Sugar ([[Sugarcamp/Minutes#Items_from_the_roadmap_brainstorm|Roadmap
Brainstorm]]).

4. Ouch: A harsh criticism of Sugar from a blogger can be found at
[http://learnonline.wordpress.com/2008/12/01/my-experience-with-olpc-in-tuvalu/
My experience with OLPC in Tuvalu]. I've extracted it in part below
with some acknowledgements and rebuttals.

: List of things wrong with OLPCs Operating System:

: 1. The connectivity metaphor on start up is inappropriate for people
in areas where connectivity is a long way away. The OLPC is more
useful to people in Tuvalu as a device for games, media and typing
before it is for connecting to the Internet, so the connectivity
interface should not be the main focus at start up.

Why is the community metaphor inappropriate? It is available
regardless of Internet connectivity—95% of the schools in Peru are off
the Internet, and yet the children and their teachers can use Sugar to
collaborate within the community. It makes a very efficient use of
whatever Internet resources are available.

: 2. That said, we were using wireless connectivity in the Government
building, but the OLPCs holding that connection was flaky. We had no
trouble keeping a connection to the network on the Windows machines,
but the OLPCs kept dropping. Placing a Wireless modem in the room with
us seemed to help the situation. Another problem relating to
connectivity was the amount of time some of the OLPCs took to connect.
Some didn't at all. All of them need clearer indication of progress in
connecting.

Improved wireless stability remains a goal, but the situation is much
improved from Sugar 0.71, which seems to be the version of Sugar being
tested (See #4 below).

: 3. The pop up menu for the operating system is very frustrating and
seems to be affected by processing. Sometimes it is slow to initiate
and even slower to disappear. I think its better to use the key on the
keyboard instead, and turn off the mouse over feature.

I will conject that this comment is in regard to the hover menus. They
come up instantly from a right-mouse click. But this seemed not be
discoverable in the first three hours of use. A keyboard shortcut may
also be a good addition.

: 4. Need better preloaders for the software. When we clicked an icon
the software takes a while to load. Sometimes the loader dialog that
says "starting" would take too long to appear. The icon does appear in
the pie chart indicating active applications, perhaps something in
that graphic could more effectively illustrate it as loading.

The "pie chart" comment suggests that the evaluation was done on a
very old version of Sugar—pre 0.82—which makes it somewhat irrelevant.
Launch time is better, but we have a ways to go.

: 5. The browser must have tabbed browsing! If I missed where it was,
then it is too hard to find. There was no right click option on any of
the OLPC we were using, and I don't know if there is meant to be. If
the tabbed browsing relies on a right click then we were thwarted.
Also, I think the browser needs work on its layout and features. The
address bar takes up too much room and for some unknown reason wants
to display the page name instead of the URL. The URL is for more
useful in terms of information, and having to click into the address
bar just to check the URL is just silly. The scroll bars are too
small, and especially noticeable when managing a website with a
scrolling window inside it, like the edit view of a wiki. We didn't
try any ajax, java or flash – but I hope they are good to go!

Tabs in the Browse Activity are still on the wish list. The full
address is revealed if you click in the address bar—again, apparently
not readily discoverable in the first 3 hours. Java and Flash are
compatible with Sugar, but there may well be performance issues on the
OLPC-XO.

: 6. I couldn't work out how to manage files. I could download PDFs
ok, but it was a bit of a fumble to display them, and I have no idea
how to save them. I tried plugging in a USB but as far as I could
tell, no new icon appeared offering me access, and nowhere in the
browser of the PDF display could I find how to save the file to the
USB.

The Browse Activity offers to open the Journal (where downloaded files
are stored), but perhaps not in the older builds. The USB shows up in
the Journal, but perhaps it should show up in the Frame as well, as a
notification when it is inserted?

: 7. I wonder about the touch pad. I am used to using them and use the
one on this Asus all the time, but seeing as the OLPCs are so ready to
think outside the square, lets rethink the touch pad. If you didn't
have the touch pad, you could have so much more room for keys! Apart
from supplying a small mouse (which is infinitely more easy to use) I
wonder if the game controllers in the screen could substitute a mouse,
as could smart use of the tab key. That little blue dial that IBM used
in the middle of their keyboard had potential I thought.

We have more work to do on keyboard shortcuts, especially on non-OLPC
hardware. As regards the OLPC-XO tablet, 'nough said.

: 8. I reckon the operating system and software should completely
change, and I'd suggest something like what Asus has done. I can
certainly appreciate the innovations that I've found so far, but the
extreme difference between the OLPC and other OS is too great, and
will affect the usefulness of the laptops… think of it like Vista..
you are causing stress and lock in by being so different. The OLPC is
not the place to experiment if your primary objective is to offer
people in poorer economies to access and exploit opportunities. Of
course there is the new opportunity of servicing and administering the
OLPCs themselves, but that's hardly sustainable and I hope it wasn't
planned for!

Growing community and jobs around Sugar is an important part of the
roadmap. But also providing a platform that enhances learning is our
primary concern. We've not proved our case yet, but there is plenty of
evidence that a vanilla XP-approach is not having a positve impact on
learning and hence is truly not a wise investment—"unlimited
potential", indeed.

=== Community jams, meet-ups, and meetings ===

5. FUDCon will be held at MIT (Cambridge, MA) 9–11 January. If you can
attend, please *SIGN UP* on the wiki page:
[http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FUDCon/FUDConF11 FUDConF11] and please
recommend topics for the hackfest. [http://paul.frields.org/ Paul
Frields] is available to answer any questions you may have.

6. Kevin Cole reports that video from the last OLPC Learning Club DC
is available at
[http://www.careercenter.arlington.k12.va.us/gctaa/xolaptop_bee_project.html
xolaptop bee].

7. There will be a Skolelinux/Debian-Edu developer gathering in
Trondheim, Norway 23–25 January 2009 (See
[http://friprogramvareiskolen.no/Gathering/2009-01-Trondheim 2009-01
Trondheim]).

8. There will be a Python for Teachers workshop at [http://pycon.org
Pycon] in Chicago in late March, 2009.

=== Tech Talk ===

9. SOAS: Simon Peter reports that he has updated Sbuntu (Sugar for
Ubuntu Live USB) to Ubuntu 8.10 (Intrepid Ibex). This should resolve
many issues that were present in the earlier version.
([http://dev.laptop.org/~probono/sbuntu/ Sbuntu]). Please report
Sbuntu issues to Peter and issues related to usb-creator to
[https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/usb-creator USB creator].

Morgan Collett has put some updated Sugar packages in the Ubuntu Sugar
Team's PPA: [https://launchpad.net/~sugarteam/+archive Sugar archive].
He is updating them to include support for Network Manager 0.7, so
that Neighborhood View will support connecting to access points again.

=== Sugar Labs ===

10. Self-organizing map (SOM): Gary Martin has generated another SOM
from the past week of discussion on the IAEP mailing list (Please see
[[:Image:2008-November-22-28-som.jpg|SOM]]).

--

-- 
Walter Bender
Sugar Labs
http://www.sugarlabs.org
Sebastian Silva | 1 Dec 23:17 2008

Re: Sugar Labs introduction

Hello,
I realize I should have jumped into this discussion earlier. Please
excuse me, I've just put myself thru an intense matrixesque
self-learning weeks around learning communities, communities of
practice, community learning, critical pedagogy, radical pedagogy,
network logics (economies, brains, forests, evolution, the internet),
network economics, ecology, emergent control, beekeeping, and
de-centralized governance... it's been fascinating.
My research question has been "¿how to jumpstart an ecosystem?"

The reason for my research is because I've been looking for a
sustainability model for our FuenteLibre.Org grassroots initiative.
I'll briefly relate our story: Born peruvian, raised in Chile,
came to Lima where I have familiy a year ago to volunteer for OLPC.
Got into suport-gang, eek,
support for G1G1? So Walter comes, brings me an XO laptop, I meet
Hernan Pachas from the ministry, and I offer to organize volunteers
for support and training, etc. At the time, they had their hands full
(and their heads), so they informed me they would not be working with
volunteers, "they would handle it" and that "I should not worry about
it".

I understood immediately that for this project to succeed, it needed
community involvement and transparency. I rallied for volunteers and
got over 150 emails from educators, techies and all sorts of people
accross Perú interested in helping out. I tailored a Xubuntu+Sugar
LiveCD in spanish for download. Alas, as yama puts it, I was "nobody",
so we were left out of helping out in the deployment and were pointed
to "boring" (but important) stuff like translating the wiki. This was
very frustrating and I will not make this mistake again. This is not
to say we wont translate - its part of our mission too.

Now back to the point, Regional SugarLabs. I investigated the Ubuntu
LoCoTeam "model" if there is such a thing. I found none, sorry to say,
only a Howto describing very crude "how to run a team" and "what a
team can do". It does not go into the relation to the mission a local
group should have, the relationship it would have with SL central
("explicit connections outside" mantra). It also does not touch into
the organizational principles or the strategies or goals of a
relationship.

The ubuntu LoCo team is explicitly compared to Linux user groups, that
is, interest groups, fan clubs. That is what it is, basically, a fan
club. Now I know sugar has fans, I'm one of them, but ubuntu has a
large user base and great momentum, neither of which sugar has. In the
spirit of the message being the medium, nobody is getting the message.

Regional SugarLabs should be highly autonomous, carry their own
identity and mission (which should significantly overlap or include
central sugarlabs's mission). They should agree on similar set of
values / principles and also joint set of goals. We just want to be
"community centers", nodes in a network, not "Regional Offices".
Basically this means recognition as local partners and ability to
collect donations for our efforts. The reason for this perhaps is
obvious: ¿How are we to expect peer recognition if our own structure
is vertical?

I'm thinking the problem is the underlying model of "aid" - developed
countries helping developing countries. How are we hoping to bridge
the divide with this mental model?
I suggest a diffent approach, an education project aproach for
de-centralized massive collaboration for learning communities.
FuenteLibre leverages Sugar fot this and hopes to explore the realm of
libre social networking (integrating Elgg with the schoolserver for
instance). This way the medium is the message. For supporting this
model I'll point you to some strategies in this book:
http://www.kk.org/newrules/ "New Rules for the New Economy" by Kevin
Kelly, in summary:

1) Embrace the Swarm.
2) Increasing Returns.
3) Plentitude, Not Scarcity.
4) Follow the Free.
5) Feed the Web First.
6) Let Go at the Top.
7) From Places to Spaces
8) No Harmony, All Flux.
9) Relationship Tech.
10) Opportunities Before Efficiencies.

So paraphrasing NN, regional sugarlabs Are Educations Projects, not
Software development projects. This is important, because as such, we
will be more involved in deployment / integration / training.
FuenteLibre, is currently involved in a potential deployment of 2300
desktop computers with Sugar and Ubuntu, and will be offering a
community learning workshop model for the regional education direction
tech team that will be deploying and supporting these 200 computer
labs.

We would be more like a community managed education technology
consultant non profit, community partner of sugarlabs and working
closely in accordance to whatever we agree. One of FuenteLibre's goals
is also to explore replicable / scalable governance model for learning
communities, so we would encourage more local groups with diverse
models / missions, and support and incubate them, provided they agree
to the givene set of principles.

This brings us to the principles, which I'm currently working on very
heavily for FuenteLibre, for to quote Greg again, in large
de-centralized projects, the values are the organization. One point
here where FuenteLibre has a strong commitment is with free software
and once our discourse and our legal personality (in the works) are in
place, we will lauch a campaign for rejecting propietary software in
education (this is also an example of why we shuold keep our own
identity).

I'll preparing the principles for FuenteLiber and our new site at
http://beta.fuentelibre.org/

Thanks for walking with me thru this, and thank you for your support
of our efforts!

I'll add my comments to the other stuff bellow.

Sebastian

2008/11/28 Rafael Enrique Ortiz Guerrero <dirakx <at> gmail.com>:
> For example here in Colombia,  OLPC/Sugar pilots are beginning to get
> managed by Companies or Foundations, with needs for money but not with needs
> for doing things well or loving what they are doing ;).

>
> Barely they are beginning to understand the project, but they are
> truly advanced in relation to contracts.($$$).
>
> In addition to this, they are not even remotely interested in free software
> communities...and in some way the liberties are getting compromised.

In our economies, there is not much meritorcracy. Contracts are gained
by influence. We grassroots geeks have no influence. You re our only
point of refernce for influence and we expect your full support
because we locally represent our shared principles that are being
compromised by these incumbents.

> So as David says there are two schemes, and people in countries can begin to
> adjust to one or another.
I'm very interested in this "company partner" scheme. Will be
monitoring and figuring how to make it work here as well.

>> > On Sat, Nov 29, 2008 at 1:13 PM, Yamandu Ploskonka
>> > <yamaplos <at> bolinux.org> wrote:
>> >
>> >> One thing that we need to see is about giving legitimacy to volunteers
>> >> in
>> >> countries where only if you have an "official" piece of paper you are
>> >> to be
>> >> taken into account.  Right now I have an active, enthusiastic, capable
>> >> volunteer in Uruguay who is not taken into account by higher
>> >> authorities
>> >> because he basically is "nobody".
>> >>
He must be my twin brother then! Please put us in touch.

PS: I'd like to have my blog on planet too, tags OLPC and Sugar... Thanks!!
--

-- 
Sebastian Silva
Iniciativa FuenteLibre
http://blog.sebastiansilva.com/
Sebastian Silva | 1 Dec 23:20 2008

Re: Sugar Labs introduction

Oh, also found this to be relevant:
http://www.creatinglearningcommunities.org/etcetera/selflearning.htm
http://www.creatinglearningcommunities.org/book/internet/lamoreaux1.htm
http://alcob.com/new/alcom_alcob/alcom_alcob_disp.html

Cheers!

Sebastian

2008/12/1 Sebastian Silva <sebastian <at> fuentelibre.org>:
> Hello,
> I realize I should have jumped into this discussion earlier. Please
> excuse me, I've just put myself thru an intense matrixesque
> self-learning weeks around learning communities, communities of
> practice, community learning, critical pedagogy, radical pedagogy,
> network logics (economies, brains, forests, evolution, the internet),
> network economics, ecology, emergent control, beekeeping, and
> de-centralized governance... it's been fascinating.
> My research question has been "¿how to jumpstart an ecosystem?"
>
> The reason for my research is because I've been looking for a
> sustainability model for our FuenteLibre.Org grassroots initiative.
> I'll briefly relate our story: Born peruvian, raised in Chile,
> came to Lima where I have familiy a year ago to volunteer for OLPC.
> Got into suport-gang, eek,
> support for G1G1? So Walter comes, brings me an XO laptop, I meet
> Hernan Pachas from the ministry, and I offer to organize volunteers
> for support and training, etc. At the time, they had their hands full
> (and their heads), so they informed me they would not be working with
> volunteers, "they would handle it" and that "I should not worry about
> it".
>
> I understood immediately that for this project to succeed, it needed
> community involvement and transparency. I rallied for volunteers and
> got over 150 emails from educators, techies and all sorts of people
> accross Perú interested in helping out. I tailored a Xubuntu+Sugar
> LiveCD in spanish for download. Alas, as yama puts it, I was "nobody",
> so we were left out of helping out in the deployment and were pointed
> to "boring" (but important) stuff like translating the wiki. This was
> very frustrating and I will not make this mistake again. This is not
> to say we wont translate - its part of our mission too.
>
> Now back to the point, Regional SugarLabs. I investigated the Ubuntu
> LoCoTeam "model" if there is such a thing. I found none, sorry to say,
> only a Howto describing very crude "how to run a team" and "what a
> team can do". It does not go into the relation to the mission a local
> group should have, the relationship it would have with SL central
> ("explicit connections outside" mantra). It also does not touch into
> the organizational principles or the strategies or goals of a
> relationship.
>
> The ubuntu LoCo team is explicitly compared to Linux user groups, that
> is, interest groups, fan clubs. That is what it is, basically, a fan
> club. Now I know sugar has fans, I'm one of them, but ubuntu has a
> large user base and great momentum, neither of which sugar has. In the
> spirit of the message being the medium, nobody is getting the message.
>
> Regional SugarLabs should be highly autonomous, carry their own
> identity and mission (which should significantly overlap or include
> central sugarlabs's mission). They should agree on similar set of
> values / principles and also joint set of goals. We just want to be
> "community centers", nodes in a network, not "Regional Offices".
> Basically this means recognition as local partners and ability to
> collect donations for our efforts. The reason for this perhaps is
> obvious: ¿How are we to expect peer recognition if our own structure
> is vertical?
>
> I'm thinking the problem is the underlying model of "aid" - developed
> countries helping developing countries. How are we hoping to bridge
> the divide with this mental model?
> I suggest a diffent approach, an education project aproach for
> de-centralized massive collaboration for learning communities.
> FuenteLibre leverages Sugar fot this and hopes to explore the realm of
> libre social networking (integrating Elgg with the schoolserver for
> instance). This way the medium is the message. For supporting this
> model I'll point you to some strategies in this book:
> http://www.kk.org/newrules/ "New Rules for the New Economy" by Kevin
> Kelly, in summary:
>
> 1) Embrace the Swarm.
> 2) Increasing Returns.
> 3) Plentitude, Not Scarcity.
> 4) Follow the Free.
> 5) Feed the Web First.
> 6) Let Go at the Top.
> 7) From Places to Spaces
> 8) No Harmony, All Flux.
> 9) Relationship Tech.
> 10) Opportunities Before Efficiencies.
>
> So paraphrasing NN, regional sugarlabs Are Educations Projects, not
> Software development projects. This is important, because as such, we
> will be more involved in deployment / integration / training.
> FuenteLibre, is currently involved in a potential deployment of 2300
> desktop computers with Sugar and Ubuntu, and will be offering a
> community learning workshop model for the regional education direction
> tech team that will be deploying and supporting these 200 computer
> labs.
>
> We would be more like a community managed education technology
> consultant non profit, community partner of sugarlabs and working
> closely in accordance to whatever we agree. One of FuenteLibre's goals
> is also to explore replicable / scalable governance model for learning
> communities, so we would encourage more local groups with diverse
> models / missions, and support and incubate them, provided they agree
> to the givene set of principles.
>
> This brings us to the principles, which I'm currently working on very
> heavily for FuenteLibre, for to quote Greg again, in large
> de-centralized projects, the values are the organization. One point
> here where FuenteLibre has a strong commitment is with free software
> and once our discourse and our legal personality (in the works) are in
> place, we will lauch a campaign for rejecting propietary software in
> education (this is also an example of why we shuold keep our own
> identity).
>
> I'll preparing the principles for FuenteLiber and our new site at
> http://beta.fuentelibre.org/
>
> Thanks for walking with me thru this, and thank you for your support
> of our efforts!
>
> I'll add my comments to the other stuff bellow.
>
> Sebastian
>
> 2008/11/28 Rafael Enrique Ortiz Guerrero <dirakx <at> gmail.com>:
>> For example here in Colombia,  OLPC/Sugar pilots are beginning to get
>> managed by Companies or Foundations, with needs for money but not with needs
>> for doing things well or loving what they are doing ;).
>
>
>
>>
>> Barely they are beginning to understand the project, but they are
>> truly advanced in relation to contracts.($$$).
>>
>> In addition to this, they are not even remotely interested in free software
>> communities...and in some way the liberties are getting compromised.
>
> In our economies, there is not much meritorcracy. Contracts are gained
> by influence. We grassroots geeks have no influence. You re our only
> point of refernce for influence and we expect your full support
> because we locally represent our shared principles that are being
> compromised by these incumbents.
>
>> So as David says there are two schemes, and people in countries can begin to
>> adjust to one or another.
> I'm very interested in this "company partner" scheme. Will be
> monitoring and figuring how to make it work here as well.
>
>>> > On Sat, Nov 29, 2008 at 1:13 PM, Yamandu Ploskonka
>>> > <yamaplos <at> bolinux.org> wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> One thing that we need to see is about giving legitimacy to volunteers
>>> >> in
>>> >> countries where only if you have an "official" piece of paper you are
>>> >> to be
>>> >> taken into account.  Right now I have an active, enthusiastic, capable
>>> >> volunteer in Uruguay who is not taken into account by higher
>>> >> authorities
>>> >> because he basically is "nobody".
>>> >>
> He must be my twin brother then! Please put us in touch.
>
> PS: I'd like to have my blog on planet too, tags OLPC and Sugar... Thanks!!
> --
> Sebastian Silva
> Iniciativa FuenteLibre
> http://blog.sebastiansilva.com/
>

--

-- 
Sebastian Silva
Iniciativa FuenteLibre
http://blog.sebastiansilva.com/
Yamandu Ploskonka | 2 Dec 02:17 2008

Drexler sings Plan Ceibal

Jorge Drexler, a noted Uruguayan singer/composer, released a song for "Plan Ceibal", the OLPC/Sugar
deployment in Uruguay

(a spot of free translation of part of the lyrics)
..."I'll go navigating
by the Southern sky,
without leaving my heart
by the shade of the ceibo-tree..."

('ceibal' is the ceibo tree, the ceibo being the national flower of Uruguay)

_of_course_ the link to a sound file is .ogg, playable on an XO!
http://www.pilas.net/archivos/Drexler_Alasombradelceibal.ogg

Thanks to Rodolfo Pilas for the announcement,

Jorge Drexler creo e interpretó una hermosa canción (como no podía ser
de otra manera) para el proyecto Ceibal en Uruguay.

http://www.pilas.net/20081201/drexler-le-canta-al-plan-ceibal/

Saludos,
Rodolfo Pilas
_______________________________________________
Lista olpc-Sur
olpc-Sur <at> lists.laptop.org
http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/olpc-sur
David Farning | 2 Dec 18:23 2008

Re: Sugar Labs introduction

On Tue, Dec 2, 2008 at 4:17 PM, Sebastian Silva
<sebastian <at> fuentelibre.org> wrote:
> Hello,
> I realize I should have jumped into this discussion earlier. Please
> excuse me, I've just put myself thru an intense matrixesque
> self-learning weeks around learning communities, communities of
> practice, community learning, critical pedagogy, radical pedagogy,
> network logics (economies, brains, forests, evolution, the internet),
> network economics, ecology, emergent control, beekeeping, and
> de-centralized governance... it's been fascinating.
> My research question has been "¿how to jumpstart an ecosystem?"

Pretty fascinating stuff.  My background is in economics so this stuff
is right up my alley:)

> The reason for my research is because I've been looking for a
> sustainability model for our FuenteLibre.Org grassroots initiative.
> I'll briefly relate our story: Born peruvian, raised in Chile,
> came to Lima where I have familiy a year ago to volunteer for OLPC.
> Got into suport-gang, eek,
> support for G1G1? So Walter comes, brings me an XO laptop, I meet
> Hernan Pachas from the ministry, and I offer to organize volunteers
> for support and training, etc. At the time, they had their hands full
> (and their heads), so they informed me they would not be working with
> volunteers, "they would handle it" and that "I should not worry about
> it".

"If you want it done right, you must do it yourself."  This mindset
still the biggest hurdle at OLPC and we are suffering from it at SL.
Slowly we are trying to build the trust back with the community.

> I understood immediately that for this project to succeed, it needed
> community involvement and transparency. I rallied for volunteers and
> got over 150 emails from educators, techies and all sorts of people
> accross Perú interested in helping out. I tailored a Xubuntu+Sugar
> LiveCD in spanish for download. Alas, as yama puts it, I was "nobody",
> so we were left out of helping out in the deployment and were pointed
> to "boring" (but important) stuff like translating the wiki. This was
> very frustrating and I will not make this mistake again. This is not
> to say we wont translate - its part of our mission too.

I apologize for that.  If you are still interested, we are very
interested in setting up a Local Lab in Peru.  Setting up a local labs
seems slightly less boring than translating:)

> Now back to the point, Regional SugarLabs. I investigated the Ubuntu
> LoCoTeam "model" if there is such a thing. I found none, sorry to say,
> only a Howto describing very crude "how to run a team" and "what a
> team can do". It does not go into the relation to the mission a local
> group should have, the relationship it would have with SL central
> ("explicit connections outside" mantra). It also does not touch into
> the organizational principles or the strategies or goals of a
> relationship.

Here I think we are having a miss communication.  LoCo teams are a
pretty good starting point for how to administratively set up and
monitor Local Labs from an upstream point of view.  I am, necessarily,
looking at the Sugar Labs/Local Labs relationship from the upstream
point of view.

There is nothing in the LoCo team documentation about how to run a
successful Local Lab.  Because, no one know how yet:)  It is still an
unsolved problem.  Hence, my approach to Local Labs is to make them as
autonomous as possible.   Over the next several months and years a set
of best pratices, adjusted for cultural differences, will develop.

> The ubuntu LoCo team is explicitly compared to Linux user groups, that
> is, interest groups, fan clubs. That is what it is, basically, a fan
> club. Now I know sugar has fans, I'm one of them, but ubuntu has a
> large user base and great momentum, neither of which sugar has. In the
> spirit of the message being the medium, nobody is getting the message.
>
> Regional SugarLabs should be highly autonomous, carry their own
> identity and mission (which should significantly overlap or include
> central sugarlabs's mission). They should agree on similar set of
> values / principles and also joint set of goals. We just want to be
> "community centers", nodes in a network, not "Regional Offices".
> Basically this means recognition as local partners and ability to
> collect donations for our efforts. The reason for this perhaps is
> obvious: ¿How are we to expect peer recognition if our own structure
> is vertical?

Yes, I agree and am pushing for autonomy!  My goal is for Local Labs
to become the key component of Sugar Labs.  Once we get the initial
Local Labs setup.  I am guessing that the Local Labs will have 10
times as many activate participants as the upstream Sugar Labs.

> I'm thinking the problem is the underlying model of "aid" - developed
> countries helping developing countries. How are we hoping to bridge
> the divide with this mental model?
> I suggest a diffent approach, an education project aproach for
> de-centralized massive collaboration for learning communities.
> FuenteLibre leverages Sugar fot this and hopes to explore the realm of
> libre social networking (integrating Elgg with the schoolserver for
> instance). This way the medium is the message. For supporting this
> model I'll point you to some strategies in this book:
> http://www.kk.org/newrules/ "New Rules for the New Economy" by Kevin
> Kelly, in summary:
>
> 1) Embrace the Swarm.
> 2) Increasing Returns.
> 3) Plentitude, Not Scarcity.
> 4) Follow the Free.
> 5) Feed the Web First.
> 6) Let Go at the Top.
> 7) From Places to Spaces
> 8) No Harmony, All Flux.
> 9) Relationship Tech.
> 10) Opportunities Before Efficiencies.
>
> So paraphrasing NN, regional sugarlabs Are Educations Projects, not
> Software development projects. This is important, because as such, we
> will be more involved in deployment / integration / training.
> FuenteLibre, is currently involved in a potential deployment of 2300
> desktop computers with Sugar and Ubuntu, and will be offering a
> community learning workshop model for the regional education direction
> tech team that will be deploying and supporting these 200 computer
> labs.
>
> We would be more like a community managed education technology
> consultant non profit, community partner of sugarlabs and working
> closely in accordance to whatever we agree. One of FuenteLibre's goals
> is also to explore replicable / scalable governance model for learning
> communities, so we would encourage more local groups with diverse
> models / missions, and support and incubate them, provided they agree
> to the givene set of principles.

Here we are back to the idea of autonomy:)  I don't care _how_ an
individual local lab is set up or run:)  Anyone is able to set up a
Local Lab however they want, as long as we agree on the basics of
mission, vision, and values.

> This brings us to the principles, which I'm currently working on very
> heavily for FuenteLibre, for to quote Greg again, in large
> de-centralized projects, the values are the organization. One point
> here where FuenteLibre has a strong commitment is with free software
> and once our discourse and our legal personality (in the works) are in
> place, we will lauch a campaign for rejecting propietary software in
> education (this is also an example of why we shuold keep our own
> identity).

Would you mind also documenting some of your thoughts on the Sugar Labs wiki?

> I'll preparing the principles for FuenteLiber and our new site at
> http://beta.fuentelibre.org/
>
> Thanks for walking with me thru this, and thank you for your support
> of our efforts!
>
> I'll add my comments to the other stuff bellow.
>
> Sebastian
>
> 2008/11/28 Rafael Enrique Ortiz Guerrero <dirakx <at> gmail.com>:
>> For example here in Colombia,  OLPC/Sugar pilots are beginning to get
>> managed by Companies or Foundations, with needs for money but not with needs
>> for doing things well or loving what they are doing ;).
>
>
>
>>
>> Barely they are beginning to understand the project, but they are
>> truly advanced in relation to contracts.($$$).
>>
>> In addition to this, they are not even remotely interested in free software
>> communities...and in some way the liberties are getting compromised.
>
> In our economies, there is not much meritorcracy. Contracts are gained
> by influence. We grassroots geeks have no influence. You re our only
> point of refernce for influence and we expect your full support
> because we locally represent our shared principles that are being
> compromised by these incumbents.

Please keep bugging us about this!

>> So as David says there are two schemes, and people in countries can begin to
>> adjust to one or another.
> I'm very interested in this "company partner" scheme. Will be
> monitoring and figuring how to make it work here as well.

thanks
david
>>> > On Sat, Nov 29, 2008 at 1:13 PM, Yamandu Ploskonka
>>> > <yamaplos <at> bolinux.org> wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> One thing that we need to see is about giving legitimacy to volunteers
>>> >> in
>>> >> countries where only if you have an "official" piece of paper you are
>>> >> to be
>>> >> taken into account.  Right now I have an active, enthusiastic, capable
>>> >> volunteer in Uruguay who is not taken into account by higher
>>> >> authorities
>>> >> because he basically is "nobody".
>>> >>
> He must be my twin brother then! Please put us in touch.
>
> PS: I'd like to have my blog on planet too, tags OLPC and Sugar... Thanks!!
> --
> Sebastian Silva
> Iniciativa FuenteLibre
> http://blog.sebastiansilva.com/
> _______________________________________________
> Sugar mailing list
> Sugar <at> lists.laptop.org
> http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar
>
_______________________________________________
Sugar mailing list
Sugar <at> lists.laptop.org
http://lists.laptop.org/listinfo/sugar

Gmane