Favicon

Input Drafts for 2011-03 SG16 H.248 meeting


Hello Christian,
fyi, I've submitted already the input drafts for the March meeting:

http://www.itu.int/md/T09-SG16-110314-TD-WP2/en

[ 458-WP2 ] H.248.RTPTOPO 
	"RTP topology dependent RTCP handling by H.248 Media Gateways with IP Terminations": Input draft (Ed.
0.2) 

[ 457-WP2 ] H.248.NATTP2P 
	"NAT-traversal for peer-to-peer services": Input draft (Ed. 0.2)     

[ 456-WP2 ] H.248.DPI 
	"Gateway control protocol: H.248 Support for deep packet inspection": Input draft (Ed. 0.4)     	

I was again unsure about the choosen work item names (for 457 & 458), thus I kept the ones from the output
drafts of the RTP meeting (if it's ok for your).

Regards,
Albrecht
Christian Groves | 9 Dec 2010 04:56

ITU-T Q.3/16 Meeting Results

Hello all,

For those who have an interest in the latest work of ITU-T Q.3/16 we 
recently had a meeting. The results of which can be found in:
http://wftp3.itu.int/av-arch/avc-site/2009-2012/1011_Res/TD-13a.zip

Four new work items were started that have a relation to work ongoing in 
the IETF:

·H.248.ECN“Explicit Congestion Notification Support”

·H.248.NP2P “NAT-Traversal for Peer-to-Peer Services”

·H.248.RTCPHAND "H.248 IP-to-IP Gateways – RTCP handling vs RTP topologies"

·H.248.LOOPB "Usage of Loopback in H.248"

All the documents referenced in the report can be found at:
http://wftp3.itu.int/av-arch/avc-site/2009-2012/1011_Res/1011_Res.html

Regards, Christian

latching vs stream mode=sendonly

Hello,

 

 my question concerns the Border Gateway Function in IMS. Assume that a termination on the BGF has been set to stream mode = SendOnly with a modify command that also activates the ipnapt/latch package with latch or relatch. Is this a valid combination? If the BGF next receives a Modify command with stream mode = sendreceive and latch=off, is it expected that latching has occurred in previous step (while in send only mode), so two way communication is allowed ? Could the case be that the BGF drops all incoming traffic since stream mode = sendonly and thus does not latch on the first received packet remote descriptor? I have gone through H248 standards but have not found any clear statement on that, so any reference would be highly appreciated!

 

Many thanks, Marios

 

Marios Aronis
BSO VIPT RD VoIP hiQ43 PI

 

_______________________________________________
Megaco mailing list
Megaco <at> ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/megaco
Favicon

Re: latching vs stream mode=sendonly

Hi Marios,

 

Latching is a mechanism mainly to provide early bearer on IMS network where there is a big call setup latency involved. e.g. in wireless IUCS operations where there is IUCS signaling involved for early bearer but remote SDP is not known yet.

So this is basically left to implementation to accept remote packet from any IP address & open Pinhole is case of BGF for a certain period of time during call setup till the remote SDP is known thru signaling when latch is set to off & modified to the known remote IP.

 

In case of BGF it does create a hole in initial session setup as far as security is concerned.

 

-Arindam

 

From: megaco-bounces <at> ietf.org [mailto:megaco-bounces <at> ietf.org] On Behalf Of Aronis, Marios (NSN - GR/Athens)
Sent: Thursday, December 09, 2010 11:58 AM
To: megaco <at> ietf.org
Subject: [Megaco] latching vs stream mode=sendonly

 

Hello,

 

 my question concerns the Border Gateway Function in IMS. Assume that a termination on the BGF has been set to stream mode = SendOnly with a modify command that also activates the ipnapt/latch package with latch or relatch. Is this a valid combination? If the BGF next receives a Modify command with stream mode = sendreceive and latch=off, is it expected that latching has occurred in previous step (while in send only mode), so two way communication is allowed ? Could the case be that the BGF drops all incoming traffic since stream mode = sendonly and thus does not latch on the first received packet remote descriptor? I have gone through H248 standards but have not found any clear statement on that, so any reference would be highly appreciated!

 

Many thanks, Marios

 

Marios Aronis
BSO VIPT RD VoIP hiQ43 PI

 

_______________________________________________
Megaco mailing list
Megaco <at> ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/megaco
Schwarz, Albrecht (Albrecht | 10 Dec 2010 08:41
Favicon

Re: latching vs stream mode=sendonly

>I have gone through H248 standards but have not found any clear statement on that, so any reference would be highly appreciated!

 
Marios,
 
you know that the H.248.37 procedures are normative for latching.
Clause 6.6/H.248.37 (06/08) specifies the behaviour of "latch modes" versus "StreamMode settings"!
 
Anything unclear or missing in H.248.37? 
If yes, please comment against the standard.
 
Regards,
Albrecht
 

From: megaco-bounces <at> ietf.org [mailto:megaco-bounces <at> ietf.org] On Behalf Of Bhattacharjee, Arindam (Arindam)
Sent: Donnerstag, 9. Dezember 2010 18:38
To: Aronis, Marios (NSN - GR/Athens); megaco <at> ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Megaco] latching vs stream mode=sendonly

Hi Marios,

 

Latching is a mechanism mainly to provide early bearer on IMS network where there is a big call setup latency involved. e.g. in wireless IUCS operations where there is IUCS signaling involved for early bearer but remote SDP is not known yet.

So this is basically left to implementation to accept remote packet from any IP address & open Pinhole is case of BGF for a certain period of time during call setup till the remote SDP is known thru signaling when latch is set to off & modified to the known remote IP.

 

In case of BGF it does create a hole in initial session setup as far as security is concerned.

 

-Arindam

 

From: megaco-bounces <at> ietf.org [mailto:megaco-bounces <at> ietf.org] On Behalf Of Aronis, Marios (NSN - GR/Athens)
Sent: Thursday, December 09, 2010 11:58 AM
To: megaco <at> ietf.org
Subject: [Megaco] latching vs stream mode=sendonly

 

Hello,

 

 my question concerns the Border Gateway Function in IMS. Assume that a termination on the BGF has been set to stream mode = SendOnly with a modify command that also activates the ipnapt/latch package with latch or relatch. Is this a valid combination? If the BGF next receives a Modify command with stream mode = sendreceive and latch=off, is it expected that latching has occurred in previous step (while in send only mode), so two way communication is allowed ? Could the case be that the BGF drops all incoming traffic since stream mode = sendonly and thus does not latch on the first received packet remote descriptor? I have gone through H248 standards but have not found any clear statement on that, so any reference would be highly appreciated!

 

Many thanks, Marios

 

Marios Aronis
BSO VIPT RD VoIP hiQ43 PI

 

_______________________________________________
Megaco mailing list
Megaco <at> ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/megaco
Maridi R. Makaraju (Raju | 10 Dec 2010 17:29
Favicon

Re: latching vs stream mode=sendonly

In addition to saving a Modify to update remote ip/port + early media case...
Another purpose of latching (arguably the main purpose) is for "NAT Traversal", i.e. to deal with endpoints behind a NAT; in such a case the bearer (RTP/RTCP) port received in signaling is different from the bearer port allocated by NAT. In this case, latching is the only way BGF can "latch " on to (or learn ) the incoming port (of NAT).
 
Marios,
To answer your question, The combinations "latch=on, mode=sendonly/inactive" is ambiguous and may or may not work depending on BGF implementation.
For RTP/RTCP based streams, please note that in case of modes sendonly or inactive RTCP packets still go through in both the directions.
So, BGF can at least latch onto RTCP port (and in most cases RTP port can be determined as "RTCP -1") as BGF should be prepared to accept
RTCP packets. RTCP based latching may take longer as it depends on the RTCP reports which may occur at ever ~5sec or so.
BGF implementation may choose to drop RTP packets without considering latch setting or can accept just one RTP packet (but not pass it through)
and start dropping rest of them.
 
Having said all that, in my opinion, "latch=on, mode=sendonly/inactive" works or not may depend on BGF implementation, it is better for call control to choose a more deterministic
approach of using "latch=on, mode=recvonly".
 
More robust implementations might do:
step1: latch=on, mode=recvonly/inactive(in your example)
and then followed by
step2: latch=on, mode=sendrecv (basically keep the latching signal unmodified, so no need to send Signal descriptor again).
 
If latching was already done in step1 then step 2 won't do latching again.
If latch is turned off in step2 then there is a risk that latching might not be complete in step1 (even if mode was set to sendrecv or recvonly).
 
 
-Raju

From: megaco-bounces <at> ietf.org [mailto:megaco-bounces <at> ietf.org] On Behalf Of Bhattacharjee, Arindam (Arindam)
Sent: Thursday, December 09, 2010 11:38 AM
To: Aronis, Marios (NSN - GR/Athens); megaco <at> ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Megaco] latching vs stream mode=sendonly

Hi Marios,

 

Latching is a mechanism mainly to provide early bearer on IMS network where there is a big call setup latency involved. e.g. in wireless IUCS operations where there is IUCS signaling involved for early bearer but remote SDP is not known yet.

So this is basically left to implementation to accept remote packet from any IP address & open Pinhole is case of BGF for a certain period of time during call setup till the remote SDP is known thru signaling when latch is set to off & modified to the known remote IP.

 

In case of BGF it does create a hole in initial session setup as far as security is concerned.

 

-Arindam

 

From: megaco-bounces <at> ietf.org [mailto:megaco-bounces <at> ietf.org] On Behalf Of Aronis, Marios (NSN - GR/Athens)
Sent: Thursday, December 09, 2010 11:58 AM
To: megaco <at> ietf.org
Subject: [Megaco] latching vs stream mode=sendonly

 

Hello,

 

 my question concerns the Border Gateway Function in IMS. Assume that a termination on the BGF has been set to stream mode = SendOnly with a modify command that also activates the ipnapt/latch package with latch or relatch. Is this a valid combination? If the BGF next receives a Modify command with stream mode = sendreceive and latch=off, is it expected that latching has occurred in previous step (while in send only mode), so two way communication is allowed ? Could the case be that the BGF drops all incoming traffic since stream mode = sendonly and thus does not latch on the first received packet remote descriptor? I have gone through H248 standards but have not found any clear statement on that, so any reference would be highly appreciated!

 

Many thanks, Marios

 

Marios Aronis
BSO VIPT RD VoIP hiQ43 PI

 

_______________________________________________
Megaco mailing list
Megaco <at> ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/megaco
Maridi R. Makaraju (Raju | 10 Dec 2010 00:01
Favicon

Re: latching vs stream mode=sendonly

In addition to saving a Modify to update remote ip/port + early media case...
Another purpose of latching (arguably the main purpose) is for "NAT Traversal", i.e. to deal with endpoints behind a NAT; in such a case the bearer (RTP/RTCP) port received in signaling is different from the bearer port allocated by NAT. In this case, latching is the only way BGF can "latch " on to (or learn ) the incoming port (of NAT).
 
Marios,
To answer your question, The combinations "latch=on, mode=sendonly/inactive" is ambiguous and may or may not work depending on BGF implementation.
For RTP/RTCP based streams, please note that in case of modes sendonly or inactive RTCP packets still go through in both the directions.
So, BGF can at least latch onto RTCP port (and in most cases RTP port can be determined as "RTCP -1") as BGF should be prepared to accept
RTCP packets. RTCP based latching may take longer as it depends on the RTCP reports which may occur at ever ~5sec or so.
BGF implementation may choose to drop RTP packets without considering latch setting or can accept just one RTP packet (but not pass it through)
and start dropping rest of them.
 
Having said all that, in my opinion, "latch=on, mode=sendonly/inactive" works or not may depend on BGF implementation, it is better for call control to choose a more deterministic
approach of using "latch=on, mode=recvonly".
 
-Raju
 
From: megaco-bounces <at> ietf.org [mailto:megaco-bounces <at> ietf.org] On Behalf Of Bhattacharjee, Arindam (Arindam)
Sent: Thursday, December 09, 2010 11:38 AM
To: Aronis, Marios (NSN - GR/Athens); megaco <at> ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Megaco] latching vs stream mode=sendonly

Hi Marios,

 

Latching is a mechanism mainly to provide early bearer on IMS network where there is a big call setup latency involved. e.g. in wireless IUCS operations where there is IUCS signaling involved for early bearer but remote SDP is not known yet.

So this is basically left to implementation to accept remote packet from any IP address & open Pinhole is case of BGF for a certain period of time during call setup till the remote SDP is known thru signaling when latch is set to off & modified to the known remote IP.

 

In case of BGF it does create a hole in initial session setup as far as security is concerned.

 

-Arindam

 

From: megaco-bounces <at> ietf.org [mailto:megaco-bounces <at> ietf.org] On Behalf Of Aronis, Marios (NSN - GR/Athens)
Sent: Thursday, December 09, 2010 11:58 AM
To: megaco <at> ietf.org
Subject: [Megaco] latching vs stream mode=sendonly

 

Hello,

 

 my question concerns the Border Gateway Function in IMS. Assume that a termination on the BGF has been set to stream mode = SendOnly with a modify command that also activates the ipnapt/latch package with latch or relatch. Is this a valid combination? If the BGF next receives a Modify command with stream mode = sendreceive and latch=off, is it expected that latching has occurred in previous step (while in send only mode), so two way communication is allowed ? Could the case be that the BGF drops all incoming traffic since stream mode = sendonly and thus does not latch on the first received packet remote descriptor? I have gone through H248 standards but have not found any clear statement on that, so any reference would be highly appreciated!

 

Many thanks, Marios

 

Marios Aronis
BSO VIPT RD VoIP hiQ43 PI

 

_______________________________________________
Megaco mailing list
Megaco <at> ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/megaco

Gmane