Internet Printing Protocol (ipp)

Michael Sweet | 1 May 2011 02:32

Re: Question on PWG draft specification mismatch & parsing

On Apr 28, 2011, at 9:46 PM, Roy Samuel wrote:

...

I found that neither of the directories contained files that adhered to the draft document w.r.t parsing the header. Specifically for the value of ‘NumColors’.

--1--

According to the draft document, bytes 420-423 need to contain ‘NumColors’ value, however, I found them to be zero. Are the sample files outdated??

Not exactly outdated, just the code that generated them (and the page headers) contains an error. I will post updates next week.

--2--

...

(I use GIMP to open the output raster file in RAW mode).

I have attached a screenshot of the output file that I’m able to view through GIMP (scaled down version).

Is my algorithm wrong? Or are the specs incorrect?

I would suspect the former since the compression code that generated the files has been in use for many years now.

Another tool you can use is RasterView, available here (with source):

http://www.easysw.com/~mike/rasterview/

__________________________________________________

Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair

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Zehler, Peter | 2 May 2011 14:42

[Pwg-Announce] PWG Candidate Standard MFD Model and Common Semantics [PWG 5108.1-2011]

All,

The newly approved PWG Candidate Standard "MFD Model and Common Semantics" [PWG 5108.1-2011] is posted on the PWG server at:

<ftp://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/candidates/cs-sm20-mfdmodel10-20110415-5108.1.pdf>

it's also listed on the PWG standards web page with the Abstract at:

< http://www.pwg.org/standards.html>

The MFD Working group page has been updated with the approved specification and includes links to the associated schema and the official namespace. The MFD page is available at:

<http://www.pwg.org/mfd>

Peter Zehler

Chair of PWG’s MFD Working Group

Peter Zehler

Xerox Research Center Webster
Email: Peter.Zehler <at> Xerox.com
Voice: (585) 265-8755
FAX: (585) 265-7441
US Mail: Peter Zehler
Xerox Corp.
800 Phillips Rd.
M/S 128-25E
Webster NY, 14580-9701

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Rich Gray | 2 May 2011 18:32

RE: Requested Additions to PWG Raster

Ok, I'll wander in from the peanut gallery and probably expose my ignorance. I've only been following these festivities loosely, but the posts about total pages and then then the desire for a compressed size did catch my attention. Looking over ftp://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippraster10-20110327-rev.pdf , from a server perspective, it bothers me greatly that it is not possible to find and extract pages from this format without uncompressing the images out to the desired page(s). Yes, the server will probably have the resources (disk and processor) to accomplish this, but given these are by definition large files, it seems like a bloody waste. If this is to become a widely used format, then ideally, it should be possible for a server to ingest and send these pages on their way with minimal overhead, unless the server really has to do some sort of reformatting.

I see two possibilities to make it easier on servers:

1. chunk the data

2. take a page from the PDF format and write the size of the preceding image data into a field in the FOLLOWING page header. This would require some sort of trailer record on the file. With this, a server could run backwards through the file, stepping from header to header and with low overhead find any desired page in the file.

My humble $.02

Rich

Richard B. Gray
Senior Software Engineer
Plus Technologies LLC
444 Alexandersville Road
Miamisburg, OH 45342-3568
+1 937-847-0614 ext. 2405
+1 937-384-0842 fax
877-899-7587 toll free
rgray <at> plustechnologies.com
www.plustechnologies.com

From: ipp-bounces <at> pwg.org [mailto:ipp-bounces <at> pwg.org] On Behalf Of Petrie, Glen
Sent: Friday, April 22, 2011 1:33 PM
To: Michael Sweet
Cc: ipp <at> pwg.org
Subject: RE: [IPP] Requested Additions to PWG Raster

As stated below, I do understand objection to adding the field. I would to hear from other PWG members on the addition of these fields.

Glen

From: Michael Sweet [mailto:msweet <at> apple.com]
Sent: Friday, April 22, 2011 10:20 AM
To: Petrie, Glen
Cc: ipp <at> pwg.org
Subject: Re: [IPP] Requested Additions to PWG Raster

On Apr 22, 2011, at 9:34 AM, Petrie, Glen wrote:

...

[gwp] The important case is the size of the compressed raster data. The decompressed size is recorded only if the raster is uncompressed.

[gwp] I agree that some (a few or a lot) of implementation may not provide the information but as I said, I am requesting that the assignment be made and those who can (want to) may record the size information.

It really isn't a matter of "may not provide", in most cases clients (and printers) simply can't buffer hundreds of megabytes of raster data. I can add the field, but since most producers of PWG Raster will not be able to supply the compressed size of the raster no printer will be able to depend on it anyways, so IMHO it is best to have the printer, if it is going to do any local processing of full page images, use its own optimal internal storage format than try to gerry-rig something into the format that just won't work.

[gwp] As I stated in my original request, I am not worried about the printer, it will accept the streaming input just fine. I want the size information for navigation of a many page raster without having to decompress pages in a serial manor. I am not jerry-rigging anything. I do not understand your comment “that just won’t work”. It works fine. In fact, I wrote a routine that will find the size-only of compressed page by running the compression routine without storing the compressed data. I don’t understand your objection to assigning the field.

...

I would actually prefer to flag the file as version 3 which is an uncompressed CUPS Raster with the version 2 page header. And in the case of local processing, you'll likely want to use native word order (another feature of CUPS Raster that we are not bringing along for PWG Raster...)

[gwp] Do you mean big/little-endian? I am nothing requesting the word ordering flag (value) be used. The current specification is ok.

My main point was that if you are concerned about having a standard representation for intermediate data, CUPS Raster already provides that. If you are trying to tweak PWG Raster for use as an internal representation format then I'd rather not put that in the standard since internal formats are OOS for any PWG standard.

Would it be sufficient to document an uncompressed version of PWG Raster (with the "RAS3" file header) and then mark the native word order support as out-of-scope for the spec but something that might be used internally?

[gwp] I believe the RAS3 is for the entire PWG Raster file. I am requesting a flags (value) for individual pages.

Since the format does not support this, I would be opposed to adding something that would be used only for an internal representation of a PWG Raster file.

[gwp] Again, I do not understand your objection.

________________________________________________________________________
Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair

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Michael Sweet | 2 May 2011 20:14

Minutes posted from today's conference call

All,

I have posted the minutes from today's conference call at:

ftp://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/minutes/ippv2-concall-minutes-20110502.pdf

Action items:

Action: Mike to issue new draft of JPS3 with changes accepted up to section 5.5.14
Action: Mike to prepare draft slides for IPP sessions for next concall
Action: Andrew to provide section 4.4 UPNP discovery text (ONGOING - for next F2F)
Action: Mike and Paul to reach out to label/portable printer vendors to join IPP WG discussions (ONGOING - both to send summary to ipp list and details to SC list)

________________________________________________________________________
Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair

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Michael Sweet | 3 May 2011 06:43

Re: Requested Additions to PWG Raster

On May 2, 2011, at 9:32 AM, Rich Gray wrote:

Ok, I'll wander in from the peanut gallery and probably expose my ignorance. I've only been following these festivities loosely, but the posts about total pages and then then the desire for a compressed size did catch my attention. Looking over ftp://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippraster10-20110327-rev.pdf , from a server perspective, it bothers me greatly that it is not possible to find and extract pages from this format without uncompressing the images out to the desired page(s). Yes, the server will probably have the resources (disk and processor) to accomplish this, but given these are by definition large files, it seems like a bloody waste. If this is to become a widely used format, then ideally, it should be possible for a server to ingest and send these pages on their way with minimal overhead, unless the server really has to do some sort of reformatting.

If you want random access, you'll either want to do reformatting or generate an index of the PWG Raster file. Any server will be able to rapidly index a raster file...

(and keep in mind that a server will likely advertise support for a higher-level format like PDF anyways, so the client will likely supply that instead of PWG Raster...)

I see two possibilities to make it easier on servers:

1. chunk the data

Since we are not trying to define a new format, this isn't an option.

2. take a page from the PDF format and write the size of the preceding image data into a field in the FOLLOWING page header. This would require some sort of trailer record on the file. With this, a server could run backwards through the file, stepping from header to header and with low overhead find any desired page in the file.

Since CUPS Raster (the base format we are using for PWG Raster) does not have a trailer, we have no opportunity to do this, either.

__________________________________________________

Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair

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Murdock, Joe | 4 May 2011 18:45

[Pwg-Announce] Approved IDS Charter posted

The updated and SC approved IDS charter has been posted to the PWG FTP site:

ftp://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ids/charter/ch-ids-charter-201100503.pdf

Joe

---------------------------------------

Joe Murdock

Principal Engineer and Researcher

Co-Chair IEEE/ISTO Printer Working Group Imaging Device Security

Sharp Labs of America

5750 NW Pacific Rim Blvd

Camas, WA 98607

(360) 817-7542

jmurdock <at> sharplabs.com

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Petrie, Glen | 4 May 2011 21:57

RE: Question on PWG draft specification mismatch & parsing

I was looking some of the PWGR images you provided. I expected the sgray-8 to have 8 bits/color and 8 bits/pixel but the file shows 24 bits/pixel. Which is correct?

Glen

From: ipp-bounces <at> pwg.org [mailto:ipp-bounces <at> pwg.org] On Behalf Of Roy Samuel
Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2011 9:47 PM
To: ipp <at> pwg.org; Michael Sweet
Subject: [IPP] Question on PWG draft specification mismatch & parsing

Hi Michael,

I had downloaded the sample PWGRaster files from: http://ftp.easysw.com/pub/cups/examples/PWGRasterSamples.zip, with your latest working draft of the PWG raster found at: ftp://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippraster10-20110327-rev.pdf. I compared the raster files in the folders:

PWGRasterSamples\srgb-16 &

PWGRasterSamples\srgb-8, with the specs given in the draft document.

I found that neither of the directories contained files that adhered to the draft document w.r.t parsing the header. Specifically for the value of ‘NumColors’.

--1--

According to the draft document, bytes 420-423 need to contain ‘NumColors’ value, however, I found them to be zero. Are the sample files outdated??

--2--

Based on the decode algorithm given in the draft document, I had tried to obtain plain RGB raster data from a pwg-raster file. I had converted the PDF document obtained here: http://orenyomtov.com/downloads/testpage.pdf to obtain pwg-raster file using Google cloud print. I am able to get the pwg-raster file from GCP successfully. However, on converting the pwg-raster file to RGB data, I have been successful in decoding around 1/6th or so, to raster data successfully, i.e. the top part of the page is being rendered successfully, while the rest is not rendered.

(I use GIMP to open the output raster file in RAW mode).

I have attached a screenshot of the output file that I’m able to view through GIMP (scaled down version).

Is my algorithm wrong? Or are the specs incorrect?

Regards.

_________________________________________________

Roy Samuel | Celstream Technologies | www.celstream.com

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______________________________________________________________________________ DISCLAIMER: This electronic message and any attachments to this electronic message is intended for the exclusive use of the addressee(s) named herein and may contain legally privileged and confidential information. It is the property of Celstream Technologies Pvt Limited. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby strictly notified not to copy, forward, distribute or use this message or any attachments thereto. If you have received this message in error, please delete it and all copies thereof, from your system and notify the sender at Celstream Technologies or administrator <at> celstream.com immediately. ______________________________________________________________________________

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Michael Sweet | 4 May 2011 22:17

Re: Question on PWG draft specification mismatch & parsing

It should be 8-bits per pixel. I'm working on regenerating the files...

On May 4, 2011, at 12:57 PM, Petrie, Glen wrote:

I was looking some of the PWGR images you provided. I expected the sgray-8 to have 8 bits/color and 8 bits/pixel but the file shows 24 bits/pixel. Which is correct?

Glen

From: ipp-bounces <at> pwg.org [mailto:ipp-bounces <at> pwg.org] On Behalf Of Roy Samuel
Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2011 9:47 PM
To: ipp <at> pwg.org; Michael Sweet
Subject: [IPP] Question on PWG draft specification mismatch & parsing

Hi Michael,

I had downloaded the sample PWGRaster files from:http://ftp.easysw.com/pub/cups/examples/PWGRasterSamples.zip, with your latest working draft of the PWG raster found at: ftp://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippraster10-20110327-rev.pdf. I compared the raster files in the folders:

PWGRasterSamples\srgb-16 &

PWGRasterSamples\srgb-8, with the specs given in the draft document.

I found that neither of the directories contained files that adhered to the draft document w.r.t parsing the header. Specifically for the value of ‘NumColors’.

--1--

According to the draft document, bytes 420-423 need to contain ‘NumColors’ value, however, I found them to be zero. Are the sample files outdated??

--2--

Based on the decode algorithm given in the draft document, I had tried to obtain plain RGB raster data from a pwg-raster file. I had converted the PDF document obtained here:http://orenyomtov.com/downloads/testpage.pdf to obtain pwg-raster file using Google cloud print. I am able to get the pwg-raster file from GCP successfully. However, on converting the pwg-raster file to RGB data, I have been successful in decoding around 1/6th or so, to raster data successfully, i.e. the top part of the page is being rendered successfully, while the rest is not rendered.

(I use GIMP to open the output raster file in RAW mode).

I have attached a screenshot of the output file that I’m able to view through GIMP (scaled down version).

Is my algorithm wrong? Or are the specs incorrect?

Regards.

_________________________________________________

Roy Samuel | Celstream Technologies | www.celstream.com

--
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______________________________________________________________________________ DISCLAIMER: This electronic message and any attachments to this electronic message is intended for the exclusive use of the addressee(s) named herein and may contain legally privileged and confidential information. It is the property of Celstream Technologies Pvt Limited. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby strictly notified not to copy, forward, distribute or use this message or any attachments thereto. If you have received this message in error, please delete it and all copies thereof, from your system and notify the sender at Celstream Technologies or administrator <at> celstream.com immediately. ______________________________________________________________________________

________________________________________________________________________

Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair

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Michael Sweet | 4 May 2011 23:13

[Pwg-Announce] REMINDER: 4 DAY PWG May 2011 Face-to-Face Meeting in Webster, NY

[This is a REMINDER for all of you that haven't yet gone to the survey page...]

All,

The May 2011 PWG face-to-face meeting page is now available. The agenda and venue information can be found at:

http://www.pwg.org/chair/meeting-info/may_2011_webster.html

NOTE: This meeting is 4 days long to accommodate the amount of material we have to discuss.

This page will be updated with document links as the material becomes available.

Please visit the February 2011 survey page and indicate whether you plan to participate in person or call in:

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s/T3H2YTC

For those not able to attend in person, the usual telephone bridge number will be provided. The details of the conference call are:

Call-in toll-free number (US/Canada): +1 866 469-3239
Call-in toll number (US/Canada): +1 650 429-3300
Call-in toll number (US/Canada): +1 408 856-9570

Attendee access code: Please request from the PWG Chair (msweet <at> apple.com) if you need it.

________________________________________________________________________

Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair

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Roy Samuel | 5 May 2011 06:42

RE: Question on PWG draft specification mismatch & parsing

Hi Michael,

Thanks for your reply.

I have been able to parse the PWG-raster file successfully to obtain plain RGB data – but only from the one, present in the directory “PWGRasterSamples” obtained from : http://ftp.easysw.com/pub/cups/examples/PWGRasterSamples.zip

The specific PWG raster file used is : “img_6461.jpg-srgb-8-150dpi.pwg”

I was able to write the parser based on the specifications described in the PWG draft document.

I tried using “Rasterview” from http://www.easysw.com/~mike/rasterview/ running on Ubuntu 10.10, to open the file mentioned above, “img_6461.jpg-srgb-8-150dpi.pwg”. I received an error, “Unable to read page data: Resource temporarily unavailable”

Using the tools/maketestfiles.sh, I was able to create a raster file with magic number, “3SaR” and not “RaS2”, which I don’t think is a PWG raster (?). I used the pstoraster filter. This generated file opens fine with RasterView v1.2.1. , FYI.

I was able to “/fetch” a pwg raster file from Google Cloud Print (GCP), by creating a print job from a pdf file. (location of pdf file: ftp://ftp.pwg.org/pub/pwg/ipp/wd/wd-ippraster10-20110327-rev.pdf). I was not able to open this PWG raster file, with RasterView, nor was I able to parse this file completely using the parser that was developed based on PWG draft specifications. (I was able to obtain about 1/6th of the file converted to RGB data successfully, the rest – was not decoded, and appeared as ‘0x00’ for the remainder of the raster data.)

Are there different versions of the PWG raster file?

Perhaps GCP is not using the latest PWG specifications?

Is RasterView not updated to parse the latest PWG files?

Regards,

Roy Samuel.

From: Michael Sweet [mailto:msweet <at> apple.com]
Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2011 6:02 AM
To: Roy Samuel
Cc: ipp <at> pwg.org
Subject: Re: Question on PWG draft specification mismatch & parsing

On Apr 28, 2011, at 9:46 PM, Roy Samuel wrote:

...

I found that neither of the directories contained files that adhered to the draft document w.r.t parsing the header. Specifically for the value of ‘NumColors’.

--1--

According to the draft document, bytes 420-423 need to contain ‘NumColors’ value, however, I found them to be zero. Are the sample files outdated??

Not exactly outdated, just the code that generated them (and the page headers) contains an error. I will post updates next week.

--2--

...

(I use GIMP to open the output raster file in RAW mode).

I have attached a screenshot of the output file that I’m able to view through GIMP (scaled down version).

Is my algorithm wrong? Or are the specs incorrect?

I would suspect the former since the compression code that generated the files has been in use for many years now.

Another tool you can use is RasterView, available here (with source):

http://www.easysw.com/~mike/rasterview/

__________________________________________________

Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair

--
This message has been scanned for viruses and
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believed to be clean.

______________________________________________________________________________ DISCLAIMER: This electronic message and any attachments to this electronic message is intended for the exclusive use of the addressee(s) named herein and may contain legally privileged and confidential information. It is the property of Celstream Technologies Pvt Limited. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby strictly notified not to copy, forward, distribute or use this message or any attachments thereto. If you have received this message in error, please delete it and all copies thereof, from your system and notify the sender at Celstream Technologies or administrator <at> celstream.com immediately. ______________________________________________________________________________

_______________________________________________
ipp mailing list
ipp <at> pwg.org
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Re: Question on PWG draft specification mismatch & parsing

[Pwg-Announce] PWG Candidate Standard MFD Model and Common Semantics [PWG 5108.1-2011]

RE: Requested Additions to PWG Raster

Minutes posted from today's conference call

Re: Requested Additions to PWG Raster

[Pwg-Announce] Approved IDS Charter posted

RE: Question on PWG draft specification mismatch & parsing

Re: Question on PWG draft specification mismatch & parsing

[Pwg-Announce] REMINDER: **4 DAY** PWG May 2011 Face-to-Face Meeting in Webster, NY

RE: Question on PWG draft specification mismatch & parsing

[Pwg-Announce] REMINDER: 4 DAY PWG May 2011 Face-to-Face Meeting in Webster, NY