Greg Bernstein | 1 Nov 2009 17:28

Re: draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-g-694-lambda-labels and unique resource identification

Hi Lou and Richard,
I think a related example that came up in a discussion at a previous CCAMP was of identifying a specific regenerator or wavelength converter used at a particular node. I would think that there could be a "tight binding" between a regenerator or wavelength converter and the laser.
In the latest  "compatibility draft" and updated "signaling draft" we start to identify extensions for specifying regeneration at a particular node via additional signaling attributes.

We initially kept this stuff separate from the label, but that was  mainly to preserve the notion of wavelengths as labels.

Best Regards

Greg

Lou Berger wrote:
Richard, Okay let me try again with a specific case. If I have an rro or ero that identifies the label (lambda) per your document, how does a node know which laser the label corresponds to when all lasers in the system are tunable? Thanks, Lou On 10/29/2009 2:22 PM, Richard Rabbat wrote:
sorry for the lag. do you want to describe your use-case further in terms of what you can't do and your proposed change? thanks, Richard. On Thu, Oct 15, 2009 at 8:53 AM, Lou Berger <lberger <at> labn.net <mailto:lberger <at> labn.net>> wrote: Authors, Have you given any additional thought on the repesentation of tunable lasers (and unique resource identification) beyond what is currently in the draft? The current text is: If the node has a tunable wavelength transponder, the tuning wavelength is considered as a part of wavelength switching operation. In the past, labels used for TE LSPs always represented a specific resource that is uniquely identifiable by the node that allocates the label and resource. Such unique identification is important/required for certan restart and other corner cases. Your current definition works fine for fixed lasers that can only be mapped to a single fiber. But, the defined global label will not uniquely identify a resource on a node when (a) tunable lasers are used, or (b) when a node supports multiple fixed lasers that can be (optically) switched to a particular output interface. What are your thoughts on how to provide such link-scoped unique resource identification in the context of your draft? I don't think it'll be too difficult to address this critical point, and see a couple of straightforward solutions if you'd like to discuss off-line. Much thanks, Lou _______________________________________________ CCAMP mailing list CCAMP <at> ietf.org <mailto:CCAMP <at> ietf.org> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ccamp
_______________________________________________ CCAMP mailing list CCAMP <at> ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ccamp

-- =================================================== Dr Greg Bernstein, Grotto Networking (510) 573-2237
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Vishwas Manral | 2 Nov 2009 05:03
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Re: RFC 4207 LMP Erratum

Hi Adrian,

I think the BNF format below is ambiguous as it does not tell which
part is repeatetive (only trace or others too):

   <TraceMonitor Message> ::= <Common Header> <MESSAGE_ID>
                              <LOCAL_INTERFACE_ID>
                              <TRACE> ...

If we want to be consistent with the other messages in the RFC it should be:

   <TraceMonitor Message> ::= <Common Header> <MESSAGE_ID>
                              <LOCAL_INTERFACE_ID>
                              <TRACE> [<TRACE> ...]

However the best representation would be:

   <TraceMonitor Message> ::= <Common Header> <MESSAGE_ID>
                              <LOCAL_INTERFACE_ID> <TRACE_LIST>

   <TRACE_LIST> ::= <TRACE> [<TRACE_LIST> | ]

Thanks,
Vishwas

On Fri, Oct 30, 2009 at 2:45 AM, Adrian Farrel <Adrian.Farrel <at> huawei.com> wrote:
> Hi CCAMP,
>
> Can I please have your help in resolving an Erratum raised against the LMP
> spec RFC 4207.
>
> You can see the full details at
> http://www.rfc-editor.org/errata_search.php?rfc=4207&eid=167
>
> The essence of the question is: how many <TRACE> objects may be present on a
> <TraceMonitor Message>?
>
> The BNF in section 4.1.1 currently implies just one. But the text could be
> interpreted to man more than one.
>
>
> While you are looking at this, can you say whether any other messages should
> also allow more than one <TRACE> object?
>
> Many thanks,
> Adrian
> _______________________________________________
> CCAMP mailing list
> CCAMP <at> ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ccamp
>
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Vishwas Manral | 2 Nov 2009 05:16
Picon

Re: RFC 4207 LMP Erratum

Modifying the best BNF format a bit.

> Hi Adrian,
>
> I think the BNF format below is ambiguous as it does not tell which
> part is repeatetive (only trace or others too):
>
>   <TraceMonitor Message> ::= <Common Header> <MESSAGE_ID>
>                              <LOCAL_INTERFACE_ID>
>                              <TRACE> ...
>
> If we want to be consistent with the other messages in the RFC it should be:
>
>   <TraceMonitor Message> ::= <Common Header> <MESSAGE_ID>
>                              <LOCAL_INTERFACE_ID>
>                              <TRACE> [<TRACE> ...]
>
>
> However the best representation would be:
>
>   <TraceMonitor Message> ::= <Common Header> <MESSAGE_ID>
>                              <LOCAL_INTERFACE_ID> <TRACE_LIST>
>
>   <TRACE_LIST> ::= <TRACE> [<TRACE_LIST> | <empty> ]
>
> Thanks,
> Vishwas
>
> On Fri, Oct 30, 2009 at 2:45 AM, Adrian Farrel <Adrian.Farrel <at> huawei.com> wrote:
>> Hi CCAMP,
>>
>> Can I please have your help in resolving an Erratum raised against the LMP
>> spec RFC 4207.
>>
>> You can see the full details at
>> http://www.rfc-editor.org/errata_search.php?rfc=4207&eid=167
>>
>> The essence of the question is: how many <TRACE> objects may be present on a
>> <TraceMonitor Message>?
>>
>> The BNF in section 4.1.1 currently implies just one. But the text could be
>> interpreted to man more than one.
>>
>>
>> While you are looking at this, can you say whether any other messages should
>> also allow more than one <TRACE> object?
>>
>> Many thanks,
>> Adrian
>> _______________________________________________
>> CCAMP mailing list
>> CCAMP <at> ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ccamp
>>
>
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Fatai Zhang | 2 Nov 2009 09:06
Favicon

Re: RFC 4207 LMP Erratum

Hi Adrian and Vishwas,
 
I think Vishwas's suggestions are very good  if we want to allow multiple <TRACE> objects in a <TraceMonitor Message>.

However, when we investigate how many <TRACE> objects may be presented on a <TraceMonitor Message>, I think it is natural to include only one <TRACE> ojbect in <TraceMonitor Message>,  because the following format of <TraceMonitor Message> makes the programmer to do that without deep consideration.
  <TraceMonitor Message> ::= <Common Header> <MESSAGE_ID>
                                                     <LOCAL_INTERFACE_ID> <TRACE>
Therefore, I think it depends on how to correct the descriptions of RFC4207 to decide how many <TRACE>objects should be presented in the <TraceMonitor Message>.
 
When we look at other messages, I think <Test> message should also be taken into accout, besides <xxTracexx> messages.
 
(1)Test Message: I think only one <TRACE> object should be included.
 
<Test Message> ::=<Common Header> <LOCAL_INTERFACE_ID>
                                  <VERIFY_ID> <TRACE>
(2) TraceMonitor Message: discussed above.
 
If there are multiple <TRACE> objects in this message, and then there are multiple "Trace Messages". In some cases, if all the Trace objects are processed correctly, we can understand that there is no Trace Mismatch. But if some of them are correct and some of them are incorrect, how to handle that? (i.e.,  in the latter case,  for a specific Local_Interface_ID, is it mismatched  or matched?  Obviously, we must  change <TraceMonitorNack>  or extend ERROR_CODE. ) 
  :-)~~~
 
 
(3) TraceReport Message: I think only one <TRACE> should be included in the <TraceReport Message>.
 
If we look at the format of <TraceReq Message> and <TraceReport Message>, we can get the answer.
<TraceReq Message> ::= <Common Header> <MESSAGE_ID>
                                             <LOCAL_INTERFACE_ID> <TRACE_REQ>
<TraceReport Message> ::= <Common Header> <MESSAGE_ID_ACK> <TRACE>
   The TraceReport message (Message Type 27) is sent over the control channel after receiving a TraceReq message.
 
(4) InsertTrace Message: I think only one <TRACE> should be included in the <InsertTrace Message> for the following description.
 
The InsertTrace message (Message Type 29) is sent over the control channel and is used to request a remote node to send "a specific trace message" over a data link (this assumes that the remote knows the mapping between the local and remote interface_Ids before fulfilling such request).
 
 
Thanks
 
Fatai
 
Advanced Technology Department
Wireline Networking Business Unit
Huawei Technologies Co., LTD.
Huawei Base, Bantian, Longgang,
Shenzhen 518129 P.R.China
Tel: +86-755-28972912
Fax: +86-755-28972935
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, November 02, 2009 12:16 PM
Subject: Re: [CCAMP] RFC 4207 LMP Erratum

Modifying the best BNF format a bit.

> Hi Adrian,
>
> I think the BNF format below is ambiguous as it does not tell which
> part is repeatetive (only trace or others too):
>
> <TraceMonitor Message> ::= <Common Header> <MESSAGE_ID>
> <LOCAL_INTERFACE_ID>
> <TRACE> ...
>
> If we want to be consistent with the other messages in the RFC it should be:
>
> <TraceMonitor Message> ::= <Common Header> <MESSAGE_ID>
> <LOCAL_INTERFACE_ID>
> <TRACE> [<TRACE> ...]
>
>
> However the best representation would be:
>
> <TraceMonitor Message> ::= <Common Header> <MESSAGE_ID>
> <LOCAL_INTERFACE_ID> <TRACE_LIST>
>
> <TRACE_LIST> ::= <TRACE> [<TRACE_LIST> | <empty> ]
>
> Thanks,
> Vishwas
>
> On Fri, Oct 30, 2009 at 2:45 AM, Adrian Farrel <Adrian.Farrel <at> huawei.com> wrote:
>> Hi CCAMP,
>>
>> Can I please have your help in resolving an Erratum raised against the LMP
>> spec RFC 4207.
>>
>> You can see the full details at
>> http://www.rfc-editor.org/errata_search.php?rfc=4207&eid=167
>>
>> The essence of the question is: how many <TRACE> objects may be present on a
>> <TraceMonitor Message>?
>>
>> The BNF in section 4.1.1 currently implies just one. But the text could be
>> interpreted to man more than one.
>>
>>
>> While you are looking at this, can you say whether any other messages should
>> also allow more than one <TRACE> object?
>>
>> Many thanks,
>> Adrian
>> _______________________________________________
>> CCAMP mailing list
>> CCAMP <at> ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ccamp
>>
>
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https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ccamp
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Jonas Mårtensson | 2 Nov 2009 11:35
Picon

Re: draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-g-694-lambda-labels and unique resource identification

Lou,

Maybe this is a silly question but if all lasers in the system are tunable, why does it matter which one is
used? Can't the node decide this locally?

Regards,
Jonas 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: ccamp-bounces <at> ietf.org [mailto:ccamp-bounces <at> ietf.org] 
> On Behalf Of Lou Berger
> Sent: den 30 oktober 2009 14:02
> To: Richard Rabbat
> Cc: ccamp <at> ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [CCAMP] 
> draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-g-694-lambda-labels and unique 
> resource identification
> 
> Richard,
> 
> Okay let me try again with a specific case.  If I have an rro 
> or ero that identifies the label (lambda) per your document, 
> how does a node know which laser the label corresponds to 
> when all lasers in the system are tunable?
> 
> Thanks,
> Lou
> 
> On 10/29/2009 2:22 PM, Richard Rabbat wrote:
> > sorry for the lag.
> > do you want to describe your use-case further in terms of what you 
> > can't do and your proposed change?
> > thanks,
> > Richard.
> > 
> > On Thu, Oct 15, 2009 at 8:53 AM, Lou Berger <lberger <at> labn.net 
> > <mailto:lberger <at> labn.net>> wrote:
> > 
> >     Authors,
> >            Have you given any additional thought on the 
> repesentation of
> >     tunable
> >     lasers (and unique resource identification) beyond what 
> is currently in
> >     the draft? The current text is:
> >       If the node has a tunable wavelength transponder, the tuning
> >       wavelength is considered as a part of wavelength switching
> >       operation.
> > 
> >     In the past, labels used for TE LSPs always represented 
> a specific
> >     resource that is uniquely identifiable by the node that 
> allocates the
> >     label and resource.  Such unique identification is 
> important/required
> >     for certan restart and other corner cases. Your current 
> definition works
> >     fine for fixed lasers that can only be mapped to a 
> single fiber.  But,
> >     the defined global label will not uniquely identify a 
> resource on a node
> >     when (a) tunable lasers are used, or (b) when a node 
> supports multiple
> >     fixed lasers that can be (optically) switched to a 
> particular output
> >     interface.
> > 
> >     What are your thoughts on how to provide such link-scoped unique
> >     resource identification in the context of your draft?
> > 
> >     I don't think it'll be too difficult to address this 
> critical point, and
> >     see a couple of straightforward solutions if you'd like 
> to discuss
> >     off-line.
> > 
> >     Much thanks,
> >     Lou
> > 
> > 
> >     _______________________________________________
> >     CCAMP mailing list
> >     CCAMP <at> ietf.org <mailto:CCAMP <at> ietf.org>
> >     https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ccamp
> > 
> > 
> _______________________________________________
> CCAMP mailing list
> CCAMP <at> ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ccamp
> 
> 

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Alfred Hönes | 2 Nov 2009 08:29
Picon

Re: RFC 4207 LMP Erratum

Vishwas Manral wrote:

> Hi Adrian,
>
> I think the BNF format below is ambiguous as it does not tell which
> part is repeatetive (only trace or others too):
>
>    <TraceMonitor Message> ::= <Common Header> <MESSAGE_ID>
>                               <LOCAL_INTERFACE_ID>
>                               <TRACE> ...

No!
See Section 2.2.5 of RFC 5511, an RFC which expressly was targetted
to codify "existing practice" (so it seems legitimate to apply it):

 2.2.5.  Repetition

   ...

   Meaning:
     May repeat the preceding object, intermediate construct, or
     construct.

   Encoding:
     Three dots ("...").

"<TRACE>" is an intermediate construct; thus it is unambiguously
the item being repeated.

> If we want to be consistent with the other messages in the RFC it should be:
>
>    <TraceMonitor Message> ::= <Common Header> <MESSAGE_ID>
>                               <LOCAL_INTERFACE_ID>
>                               <TRACE> [<TRACE> ...]
>
> However the best representation would be:
>
>    <TraceMonitor Message> ::= <Common Header> <MESSAGE_ID>
>                               <LOCAL_INTERFACE_ID> <TRACE_LIST>
>
>    <TRACE_LIST> ::= <TRACE> [<TRACE_LIST> | ]
>
> Thanks,
> Vishwas
>
> On Fri, Oct 30, 2009 at 2:45 AM, Adrian Farrel <Adrian.Farrel <at> huawei.com> wrote:
>> Hi CCAMP,
>>
>> Can I please have your help in resolving an Erratum raised against the LMP
>> spec RFC 4207.
>>
>> You can see the full details at
>> http://www.rfc-editor.org/errata_search.php?rfc=4207&eid=167
>>
>> The essence of the question is: how many <TRACE> objects may be present on a
>> <TraceMonitor Message>?
>>
>> The BNF in section 4.1.1 currently implies just one. But the text could be
>> interpreted to man more than one.
>>
>>
>> While you are looking at this, can you say whether any other messages should
>> also allow more than one <TRACE> object?
>>
>> Many thanks,
>> Adrian
>> _______________________________________________
>> CCAMP mailing list
>> CCAMP <at> ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ccamp

Kind regards,
  Alfred Hönes.

--

-- 

+------------------------+--------------------------------------------+
| TR-Sys Alfred Hoenes   |  Alfred Hoenes   Dipl.-Math., Dipl.-Phys.  |
| Gerlinger Strasse 12   |  Phone: (+49)7156/9635-0, Fax: -18         |
| D-71254  Ditzingen     |  E-Mail:  ah <at> TR-Sys.de                     |
+------------------------+--------------------------------------------+

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Dieter Beller | 2 Nov 2009 15:41
Favicon

Re: RFC 4207 LMP Erratum

Hi Alfred,

could you please explain why multiple <TRACE> objects for a single
interface are needed? I fail to understand what the application is that
requires this.


Thanks,
Dieter

ah <at> TR-Sys.de wrote:
Vishwas Manral wrote:
Hi Adrian, I think the BNF format below is ambiguous as it does not tell which part is repeatetive (only trace or others too): <TraceMonitor Message> ::= <Common Header> <MESSAGE_ID> <LOCAL_INTERFACE_ID> <TRACE> ...
No! See Section 2.2.5 of RFC 5511, an RFC which expressly was targetted to codify "existing practice" (so it seems legitimate to apply it): 2.2.5. Repetition ... Meaning: May repeat the preceding object, intermediate construct, or construct. Encoding: Three dots ("..."). "<TRACE>" is an intermediate construct; thus it is unambiguously the item being repeated.
If we want to be consistent with the other messages in the RFC it should be: <TraceMonitor Message> ::= <Common Header> <MESSAGE_ID> <LOCAL_INTERFACE_ID> <TRACE> [<TRACE> ...] However the best representation would be: <TraceMonitor Message> ::= <Common Header> <MESSAGE_ID> <LOCAL_INTERFACE_ID> <TRACE_LIST> <TRACE_LIST> ::= <TRACE> [<TRACE_LIST> | ] Thanks, Vishwas On Fri, Oct 30, 2009 at 2:45 AM, Adrian Farrel <Adrian.Farrel <at> huawei.com> wrote:
Hi CCAMP, Can I please have your help in resolving an Erratum raised against the LMP spec RFC 4207. You can see the full details at http://www.rfc-editor.org/errata_search.php?rfc=4207&eid=167 The essence of the question is: how many <TRACE> objects may be present on a <TraceMonitor Message>? The BNF in section 4.1.1 currently implies just one. But the text could be interpreted to man more than one. While you are looking at this, can you say whether any other messages should also allow more than one <TRACE> object? Many thanks, Adrian _______________________________________________ CCAMP mailing list CCAMP <at> ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ccamp
Kind regards, Alfred HÎnes.

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The IESG | 2 Nov 2009 15:52
Picon
Favicon

Last Call: draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-dppm (Label Switched Path (LSP) Dynamic Provisioning Performance Metrics in Generalized MPLS Networks) to Proposed Standard

The IESG has received a request from the Common Control and Measurement 
Plane WG (ccamp) to consider the following document:

- 'Label Switched Path (LSP) Dynamic Provisioning Performance Metrics in 
   Generalized MPLS Networks '
   <draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-dppm-10.txt> as a Proposed Standard

The IESG plans to make a decision in the next few weeks, and solicits
final comments on this action.  Please send substantive comments to the
ietf <at> ietf.org mailing lists by 2009-11-23. This last call is longer 
than usual to encompass the time of the face-to-face IETF meeting.

Exceptionally, comments may be sent to iesg <at> ietf.org instead. In either
case, please retain the beginning of the Subject line to allow
automated sorting.

The file can be obtained via
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-dppm-10.txt

IESG discussion can be tracked via
https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/pidtracker.cgi?command=view_id&dTag=17157&rfc_flag=0

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Alfred Hönes | 2 Nov 2009 16:40
Picon

Re: RFC 4207 LMP Erratum

Dieter,

Your message almost has been scrubbed as spam at our provider,
because of the lack of 'normal' content.  ("HTML-only" is one
of the most efficient criteria in spam filtering today!)
However, I have managed to 'de-HTLMize' the message ...   :-)

> Hi Alfred,
> could you please explain why multiple <TRACE> objects for
> a single interface are needed? I fail to understand what the
> application is that requires this.
> Thanks,
> Dieter

First of all, I would like to refer you to the public errata report,
which -- you might have observed -- is almost 4(!) years old:

http://www.rfc-editor.org/errata_search.php?rfc=4207&presentation=records

I apologize for not having the time to fully re-read RFC 4207 now,
due to current overload, but I hope that the reasoning presented in
the Errata Report in 2005 is still valid.  I do not recall all the
details, but I'm quite sure it had not been based on specific
application scenarios, but rather on lack of consistency with other
parts of the RFC.  Please check and let me know if something's
wrong there.  If there indeed are good arguments against the
conclusion in the Errata Note, the quoted other parts of the RFC
might need reconsideration/clarification instead.

In short: either _all_ parts of the RFC should use plural for
TRACE object(s) in a TraceMonitor Message, or _none_.

Below, I have attached the original report once sent to the
authors of RFC 4207, which did not solicit a response those days
and has been entered later into the new RFC Errata database
by busy beavers at the RFC-Ed...

Kind regards,
  Alfred Hönes.

-- 

+------------------------+--------------------------------------------+
| TR-Sys Alfred Hoenes   |  Alfred Hoenes   Dipl.-Math., Dipl.-Phys.  |
| Gerlinger Strasse 12   |  Phone: (+49)7156/9635-0, Fax: -18         |
| D-71254  Ditzingen     |  E-Mail:  ah <at> TR-Sys.de                     |
+------------------------+--------------------------------------------+

--------  begin forwarded message  --------

> From: <ah <at> TR-Sys.de>
> To: jplang <at> ieee.org, dimitri.papadimitriou <at> alcatel.be
> Cc: rfc-editor <at> rfc-editor.org
> Message-Id: <200512201701.SAA26759 <at> TR-Sys.de>
> Date: Tue, 20 Dec 2005 18:01:34 +0100 (MEZ)
> Subject: RFC 4207 (LMP SDH Test)

Hello,

I've been stuck in an apparent inconsistency in the recently
published RFC 4207 authored by you.

RFC 4207 defines the syntax of the TraceMonitor message in Section
4.1.1, on page 6.
Similarly, the TraceMonitorAck and TraceMonitorNack Messages are
specified in Sections 4.1.2 and 4.1.3, respectively, on page 8.

While the former specifies a single <TRACE> object to appear
in a TraceMonitor message, the latter specs uses wording like
"all of the TRACE Objects in a TraceMonitor message" or
"TRACE object value(s)".

IMHO, it makes much sense to indeed allow multiple TRACE Objects
(with different trace types, but all related to a single Interface)
in a single TraceMonitor Message.

To resolve the inconsistency, I therefore propose to submit an
Errata Note for RFC 4207 aimed at adapting the syntax specified
in section 4.1.1 to the remainder of the specification:

------ cut here ------

RFC 4207, in Section 4.1.1, near the bottom of page 6, specifies:

           [...]  The format of the TraceMonitor message is as
  follows:

   <TraceMonitor Message> ::= <Common Header> <MESSAGE_ID>
                              <LOCAL_INTERFACE_ID> <TRACE>

It should say:

           [...]  The format of the TraceMonitor message is as
  follows:

   <TraceMonitor Message> ::= <Common Header> <MESSAGE_ID>
                              <LOCAL_INTERFACE_ID>
                              <TRACE> ...

------ cut here ------

If you agree with this Errata Note, please forward your consent
to the RFC-Ed.

[Note:
 I purposely have inserted the additional line break to emphasize
 that the repetition is to be applied to <TRACE> only; and I have
 used the more conventional style of repetition indication, '...',
 not the ABNF (RFC 4234) style "1*<TRACE>", to remain consistent
 in style with the basic LMP specification (RFC 4204) and because
 there is no ref. to RFC 4234 in RFC 4207.
 You might wish to change these details however, if you prefer.
]

Best regards,
  Alfred Hönes.

--

-- 

+------------------------+--------------------------------------------+
| TR-Sys Alfred Hoenes   |  Alfred Hoenes   Dipl.-Math., Dipl.-Phys.  |
| Gerlinger Strasse 12   |  Phone: (+49)7156/9635-0, Fax: -18         |
| D-71254  Ditzingen     |  E-Mail:  ah <at> TR-Sys.de                     |
+------------------------+--------------------------------------------+

--------  end forwarded message  --------

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Dieter Beller | 2 Nov 2009 17:47
Favicon

Re: RFC 4207 LMP Erratum

Alfred,

this message is formatted as plain text message ;-)

If the issue is:
> In short: either _all_ parts of the RFC should use plural for
> TRACE object(s) in a TraceMonitor Message, or _none_.
>   
I would advocate *all singular*, i.e., there's exactly one TRACE object in a
TraceMonitor Message and not multiple.

Thanks,
Dieter

ah <at> TR-Sys.de wrote:
> Dieter,
>
> Your message almost has been scrubbed as spam at our provider,
> because of the lack of 'normal' content.  ("HTML-only" is one
> of the most efficient criteria in spam filtering today!)
> However, I have managed to 'de-HTLMize' the message ...   :-)
>
>   
>> Hi Alfred,
>> could you please explain why multiple <TRACE> objects for
>> a single interface are needed? I fail to understand what the
>> application is that requires this.
>> Thanks,
>> Dieter
>>     
>
> First of all, I would like to refer you to the public errata report,
> which -- you might have observed -- is almost 4(!) years old:
>
> http://www.rfc-editor.org/errata_search.php?rfc=4207&presentation=records
>
> I apologize for not having the time to fully re-read RFC 4207 now,
> due to current overload, but I hope that the reasoning presented in
> the Errata Report in 2005 is still valid.  I do not recall all the
> details, but I'm quite sure it had not been based on specific
> application scenarios, but rather on lack of consistency with other
> parts of the RFC.  Please check and let me know if something's
> wrong there.  If there indeed are good arguments against the
> conclusion in the Errata Note, the quoted other parts of the RFC
> might need reconsideration/clarification instead.
>
> In short: either _all_ parts of the RFC should use plural for
> TRACE object(s) in a TraceMonitor Message, or _none_.
>
> Below, I have attached the original report once sent to the
> authors of RFC 4207, which did not solicit a response those days
> and has been entered later into the new RFC Errata database
> by busy beavers at the RFC-Ed...
>
>
> Kind regards,
>   Alfred HÎnes.
>
>   

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