Peter Saint-Andre | 1 Sep 2010 23:10
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AppsArea BoFs at IETF 79

Folks, if you would like to hold a birds-of-a-feather (BoF) session at
IETF 79, time is running short. The cutoff date is Monday, September 13:

http://www.ietf.org/meeting/cutoff-dates-2010.html#IETF79

Instructions are here:

http://www.ietf.org/iesg/bof-procedures.html

Alexey and I welcome BoF proposals -- feel free to send them directly to
your friendly Area Directors, or to this list for wider discussion.

Thanks!

Peter

--

-- 
Peter Saint-Andre
https://stpeter.im/
S Moonesamy | 2 Sep 2010 02:40
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Apps Area Review Team Report for August 2010

Hello,

The Applications Area Review Team provides semi-formal reviews of 
Internet-Drafts as a way to improve the quality of IETF 
specifications.  The members of the team are selected from the IETF 
community, especially from among active participants and recognized 
experts in the Applications Area.

The following reviews have been performed in August 2010:

  draft-gennai-smime-cnipa-pec-08 was reviewed by Dave Crocker.

Pending reviews:

  draft-ietf-netmod-dsdl-map-05 assigned to Aaron Stone
  draft-ietf-ecrit-lost-sync-08 assigned to Aaron Stone

Regards,
S. Moonesamy
On behalf of the Apps Review Team
http://www.apps.ietf.org/content/applications-area-review-team
Dave CROCKER | 5 Sep 2010 17:58

"organization's top level domain"

Folks,

Howdy.

I'm looking for a nomenclature suggestion...

RFC 2142 user the phrase "organization's top level domain".  This refers to the 
string that is delegated to the organization and provides the root of any 
sub-tree to the DNS that they create.  Around the world and around the DNS, this 
'root' will have two or more fields, such as bbiw.net or ucl.ac.uk.

An erratum has been filed on the phrase.  I take it as being a result of "top 
level domain" becoming entrenched to mean only the right-most field of a domain 
name. The stuff that is delegated from the root of the DNS.

The problem is that I do not know of an alternative name to use, when referring 
to the string that is delegated to an organization.  (And, no, I don not 
consider "string that is delegated to a domain" to be a candidate.)

I can't even think of one to suggest.

So I'm asking you folks what you recommend.

Thanks.

d/
--

-- 

   Dave Crocker
   Brandenburg InternetWorking
(Continue reading)

John C Klensin | 5 Sep 2010 18:43

Re: "organization's top level domain"

Dave,

I've occasionally used "enterprise primary domain" or
"organizational primary domain" in my writing, just to avoid the
use of "top-level".  I've also used some convolutions to
distinguish enterprise-managed domains from domains managed by
registries that serve many enterprises and that consist primary
or exclusively of delegation records and records needed to
support them, but that isn't quite the same thing and I've never
found crisp wording.  My recollection is that some folks in the
DNS community have used something like "all-delegation domains"
to refer to the next level up from what you are talking about,
but the term is not precisely accurate (given SOA records, glue,
etc.).

Also note that, if current ICANN plans continue, your "two or
more fields" requirement may soon be incorrect.  Under their
proposed model, nothing would prevent an organization that has
the needed operational capability and that is willing to spend
the money from acquiring a TLD and trying to put, e.g., MX
records in it.   The SMTP spec isn't happy about that idea, but
that is not a DNS issue and various specs that depend on SRV or
NAPTR records impose no such restrictions.   And, fwiw, one of
the few clear bits of DNS terminology (see below) is that what
you are referring to as a "field" is called a "label" and, as
far as I know, nothing else. 

I'd suggest raising this with the DNS Directorate (assuming it
is still functional) and/or the DNSOPS and DNSEXT WGs.  As you
probably know, there are periodic discussions about putting
(Continue reading)

Paul Hoffman | 5 Sep 2010 19:51

Re: "organization's top level domain"

At 12:43 PM -0400 9/5/10, John C Klensin wrote:
>I've occasionally used "enterprise primary domain" or
>"organizational primary domain" in my writing, just to avoid the
>use of "top-level".

Both of those seem good to me, for that very reason.

--Paul Hoffman, Director
--VPN Consortium
Peter Koch | 5 Sep 2010 20:23
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Re: "organization's top level domain"

Hi Dave, all,

> The problem is that I do not know of an alternative name to use, when 
> referring to the string that is delegated to an organization.  (And, no, I 

the text in the RFC doesn't meet today's terminology, but it also isn't
(any longer) a good fit for operational reality. There is no 1:1 mapping
between organisation and domain (at whatever level) and the hierarchy
in the domain name space doesn't necessarily meet or imply organisational
hierarchy.  Therefore, I think the best way to deal with the erratum is
to postpone it for an update of the RFC.

That said, there are some recommendations in there that were good ideas at the
time but are out of sync with today's practice or the IETF's scope of
influence (see section 3; also mail addresses at "ra.net" are no longer
deliverable).  I'd suggest to declare this RFC "Historic" and, assuming enough
interest and momentum, work towards a BCP that deals with those remaining
mailboxes which are of importance today.

-Peter
Manger, James H | 6 Sep 2010 04:47

Re: "organization's top level domain"

Dave,

Another phrase could be an "organization's domain immediately below a public suffix", where a public
suffix is defined by referring to http://publicsuffix.org/. That isn't a short catchy phrase, but at
least the "public suffix" portion is well defined.

--
James Manger

-----Original Message-----
From: apps-discuss-bounces <at> ietf.org [mailto:apps-discuss-bounces <at> ietf.org] On Behalf Of Dave CROCKER
Sent: Monday, 6 September 2010 1:58 AM
To: Apps Discuss
Subject: [apps-discuss] "organization's top level domain"

Folks,

Howdy.

I'm looking for a nomenclature suggestion...

RFC 2142 user the phrase "organization's top level domain".  This refers to the
string that is delegated to the organization and provides the root of any
sub-tree to the DNS that they create.  Around the world and around the DNS, this
'root' will have two or more fields, such as bbiw.net or ucl.ac.uk.

An erratum has been filed on the phrase.  I take it as being a result of "top
level domain" becoming entrenched to mean only the right-most field of a domain
name. The stuff that is delegated from the root of the DNS.

(Continue reading)

Andrew Sullivan | 6 Sep 2010 15:52

Re: "organization's top level domain"

On Sun, Sep 05, 2010 at 12:43:39PM -0400, John C Klensin wrote:
> found crisp wording.  My recollection is that some folks in the
> DNS community have used something like "all-delegation domains"
> to refer to the next level up from what you are talking about,
> but the term is not precisely accurate (given SOA records, glue,
> etc.).

That's why we use the term "delegation-centric" as opposed to
"all-delegation".  Even a delegation-centric domain will likely have A
records, for glue.

> NAPTR records impose no such restrictions.   And, fwiw, one of
> the few clear bits of DNS terminology (see below) is that what
> you are referring to as a "field" is called a "label" and, as
> far as I know, nothing else. 

Yes.

> I'd suggest raising this with the DNS Directorate (assuming it
> is still functional) and/or the DNSOPS and DNSEXT WGs.  As you
> probably know, there are periodic discussions about putting
> together a document to specify and clarify all of the sloppy
> terminology that surrounds the DNS --the question you ask is by
> no measure the worse case.  I don't think the effort is going
> anywhere, but perhaps someone is keeping a list of concepts that
> need standard terminology and rigorous definitions some day. 

We tried to do that, in dnsext, about the time that I was asked to
serve as co-chair.  Indeed, I think part of the reason for appointing
a co-chair and semi-reviving the WG was because of the potential work
(Continue reading)

Andrew Sullivan | 6 Sep 2010 15:55

Re: "organization's top level domain"

On Mon, Sep 06, 2010 at 12:47:26PM +1000, Manger, James H wrote:
> Dave,
> 
> Another phrase could be an "organization's domain immediately below a public suffix", where a public
suffix is defined by referring to http://publicsuffix.org/. That isn't a short catchy phrase, but at
least the "public suffix" portion is well defined.
> 

Please, no!  In my (quite ornery, on this topic) opinion, the list at
publicsuffix.org is a miserable hack that is doomed to failure and is
wrong in principle.  I've made that rant before, however, so I won't
repeat it here.  And even if you liked the publicsuffix stuff, it's
completely wrong for these purposes.

A

--

-- 
Andrew Sullivan
ajs <at> shinkuro.com
Shinkuro, Inc.
Claudio Allocchio | 6 Sep 2010 16:40
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apps-team review of draft-das-mipshop-andsf-dhcp-options


I have been selected as the Applications Area Review Team reviewer for 
this draft (for background on apps-review, please see 
http://www.apps.ietf.org/content/applications-area-review-team).

Please resolve these comments along with any other Last Call comments you 
may receive. Please wait for direction from your document shepherd or AD 
before posting a new version of the draft.

Document: draft-das-mipshop-andsf-dhcp-options
Reviewer: Claudio Allocchio (GARR, Italian Research and Academic Network)
Review Date: 2010-09-06
IETF Last Call Date: 2010-08-09 (?)
IESG Telechat Date: 2010-09-09

Summary: This draft has not any specific Application Area issues (use of 
XML, date/time format, URIs, Internationalization conformance, IDNA, 
etc.), hence fro this point of view it is ready for publication as 
Proposed Standard.

Major Issues: None.

Minor Issues:

- section 2: maybe I'm just overconcerned with clarity, but I would 
rephrase the second senctence and schema repeating "IPv4 address" instead 
of only "IP address(es)"

The Option begins with an option code followed by a length and one
or more IPv4 addresses. The option layout is depicted below:
(Continue reading)


Gmane