Charles Kibby | 1 Feb 2006 02:55
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Re: Ron Mueck


My gut feeling is that interesting as it may be to see a cold dumb plastic 

lifelike naked representation of ourselves many times larger than life that 

does not necessarily make it art.

It is probably worth pushing this just a little further, given that 40 or 50

or maybe more years ago artists invented the idea that anything could be art

if they said it was. There were howls of protest initially but we all got 

used to it, I for one now find myself seriously questioning whether the 

simplistic idea has finally run out puff.

Clive,  I respect your opinion but I must respectfully take issue with you
on this one (God knows that too much passes for Art Worth Taking Seriously
in these days of cultural inflation) ......the sculptures are indeed
ultra-realistic and an exercise in technique, but the simple choice of scale
elevates them above the level of mere absolute reproduction.  This is such a
great question to raise, because artists of the Western persuasion have been
struggling with this one since the early Renaissance, when technique finally
caught up with perception, at least for a while.   The simple choice of
scale is the primary element of these pieces, the rest is secondary.  Though
I haven't actually experienced them in person, I can well imagine from the
images that they would cause me to re-examine my own perception and
preconceived notion of what sculpture ought to be....

(Continue reading)

Bob Hackett | 1 Feb 2006 03:11
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Re: Ron Mueck

> My gut feeling is that interesting as it may be to see a cold dumb plastic
>
> lifelike naked representation of ourselves many times larger than life
that
>
> does not necessarily make it art.

Let me see if I have this right.Stone,must be art.Plastic,can`t be art.Does
that pretty well sum it up?
Now there`s nothing quite as cold as stone to most people,we have sayings
such as"heart of stone" and "dumber than a box of rocks" to express how we
feel about stone in general and yet we still go to museums and such to view
the larger than life,mostly naked "art" of centuries past rendered in marble
and other stone.
So what is it we`re not getting I wonder.

It`s not the material that makes it art it`s the artist.

Welcome to the dinner party Charles.

Bob

 
VisualThinker7 | 1 Feb 2006 03:57
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Re: Ron Mueck

Is it art if someone reproduces the shape of an animal or human  in stone or 
bronze? 

At one time you could see Generals Grant and Sherman on horseback. Are the  
equestrian statues of them art? Theyu're just representations of very  prosaic 
things. 

How about images of Mary holding Jesus, either as an infant or after his  
death, as in the pieta? We marvel at how realistic the work is. Since it's just  
an image of human beings, in stone rather than on paper or canvas, is it art?  
It's more like illustration, craftsmanship. 

 
John Halter | 1 Feb 2006 04:03
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Re: standing block stability

Hello Norman,

I still like the idea of working the stone on its side.  At least while 
roughing out.  Maybe making a small model of the sculpture would help you 
keep perspective on the stone.

How about this for an "out of the box" idea.  Years ago, when I worked with 
a seismic engineer to prevent warehouse racks from falling over during an 
earthquake, he designed a system bracing the racks at the top instead of the 
conventional method of anchoring them into the floor.  He felt the floor 
anchors were very prone to failure from any torque put on them.  So what if 
you embed an eyebolt centered on the top of your stone and then built a 
large inexpensive A-frame (like a homemade gantry crane) around it?  Then 
ran a short chain from the eyebolt to the A-frame to hold the top of the 
stone from shifting.  If the A-frame was large enough, it should give you a 
steady support and an unencumbered work area.  I'm not an engineer, so I 
sure some others in the group could speak to the practicality of this idea.

John Halter
halter@...

 
John Halter | 1 Feb 2006 04:11
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Re: standing block stability

Hello again Norman,

Just read my last post to you and not sure I was very clear.  Basically I'm 
suggesting you might get stability from suspending  the stone from some kind 
of beam located above it.

John Halter
halter@...

 
Jim Cosgrove | 1 Feb 2006 05:55
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Re: standing block stability]


Hi gang,

Suspending the stone may not be such a great idea and I'm sure that's 
not what John refered to.
However, stabilizing the stone from above will certainly work, if it is 
kept from moving in at least three directions, with four being the best 
and by strong chain or beams, not rope which could stretch or break.
The shorter the distance vertically from the top of your stone to the 
supports the better, cuts down on stress in the chain. 

Select the 'breaking strength' of the chain or even rope by trippling (or more) the 
weight of the stone you're working on to be safe. So if all but one 
breaks, the load can safely be stopped from crushing the poor sculptor.

good luck friend,

Jim Cosgrove

                               
 Jim's Soapstone Carvings and Sculptures
 http://www3.sympatico.ca/ve3jji

 
John Halter | 1 Feb 2006 05:11
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Re: standing block stability]

You're right Jim, I didn't mean to suspend (or lift) the stone, only to 
provide support (or tension) from above.

John Halter
halter@...

 
Jim Cosgrove | 1 Feb 2006 06:34
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Re: standing block stability]

Ok John I understand your,

It's just that if by chance the stone tips over far enough, the top 
supports, beams, ropes or chains whatever will need to support the 
weight of the piece so it is better to be safe than a sorry sculptor.

Jim Cosgrove

                               
 Jim's Soapstone Carvings and Sculptures
 http://www3.sympatico.ca/ve3jji

John Halter wrote:

You're right Jim, I didn't mean to suspend (or lift) the stone, only to 
provide support (or tension) from above.

John Halter
halter@...

 
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Building on clay

Hello, 
         Have been asked to construct a dry stone retaining wall, 
dimensions of half metre base and one metre high around 25 metres 
long. 
The ground on which it will sit consists of around 6 inch of soil, 2 
inch of sub-soil and then about 7 ft of clay, at least.  What kind of 
problems, and I am assuming somehow that there could be problems, can 
I 
expect with clay. 

Hi Charlie,
Sorry... I can't respond through the list.  I'm not sure where you 
live (or are constructing your retaining wall), but I can give you some 
basics that will pretty much work anywhere.  I'm in New England USA, 
and our winter frost can really toss stones around without all 
precautions.  I am also uncertain as to your relative skill level of 
dry building.  In many climates, clay, is a regular hell-raiser.  It's 
sort of the wildcard of the foundation world, so you want to take 
precautions.  Nevertheless, if you stick with your plan of building a 
foundation depth of half the ultimate height of your wall, you should 
be just fine.  The trick will be in putting together that foundation.  
In the old days we would start our foundation anywhere from 1/4 to 1/2 
in depth of the height depending on the soil composition, and in many 
cases our foundation would simply be to start the wall below ground.  
Around here there always seems to be plenty of field stones, and 
byproduct stones, with which to build.  

Although I still hand cut my stone with featherwedges/wedges and 
shims/feathers and wedges and stone axes of different weights,  I do 
use a couple modern short-cuts for foundations as well as some 
(Continue reading)

VisualThinker7 | 1 Feb 2006 12:08
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Building on clay

There seems to be some confusion there. The foundation WIDTH is 1/2  meter - 
1/2 the height of the wall, that is NOT the foundation depth. 

Or did I misunderstand the whole thread? 

 

Gmane