This is a list to study and discuss homeopathy and other healing modalities used with homeopathy

Who is this list for?:- any health professional who wishes to discuss and hopefully improve their Homoeopathy and Healing in a safe and friendly environment without the fear of ridicule Also for students who want to learn homeopathy but know the basics.
Who is this list not for?:-anyone who knows it all.
What level of experience is required?.To be using homeopathy as a healing modality  or studying to do so.
Does this list offer accreditation?:- NO. It is purely for discussion and the exchange of ideas in the furtherment of Homeopathic expertise.

• Posts on homeopathy and related subjects are fine. The list is more informal and close knit so it does not matter that an ocassional recipe for `nasi lemak' gets on it some time!
• . The posts should be courteous and polite, disgreements have to be conducted in a civilised manner as befits our professionlism. Name calling and personal remarks are not to be made.
• Try to edit the posts and do not keep sending the oldposts together with your reply as this can be burdensome to some on the list who have a limited storage space.
• This list is tolerant of all views , what is not tolerated is intolerance.
• The list moderators will not hesitate to take action against any list members who create disharmony or unpleasantness on this list and the action can be:
a)Your posts will be moderated, ie Your posts will not appear spontaneously but goes through a censor.
b) You could get sent to no post, ie you can get posts but cannot post to the list.
c) You can be unsubscribed and banned.

• This list is for the free DISCUSSION of all aspects of homoeopathy and healing ; the list moderators do not necessarily agree with or condone practices or opinions expressed by the subscribers."

Hi Suriya and any moderators--
I keep hearing what a bad idea Grouply is. But does this group have
any specific instruction that its members *not* join Grouply? If it's
as bad as I keep hearing, shouldn't group members be asked not to join
it--or have the risks been blown out-of-proportion?
Thanks,
Shannon

Hello Everybody
I must have missed the 'grouply' discussion and i couldn't find anything in the archive, but i did get one of these 'invitations' today and therefore researched a little online. Below is a post of the "Zappa group" on Yahoo that i find, says it all and here is the link for those who want to read more: http://www.mail-archive.com/zappa-list <at> yahoogroups.com/msg07126.html

Very obviously, the 'invitations' are coming from some group member, and most likely unknowingly. This member must have signed up to grouply before. so whoever it was, should do whatever it takes to clean his / her computer.
have a great day, ute

----- Original Message -----
From: Mark Martinez
To: Zappa-List <at> yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 12, 2008 12:35 PM
Subject: [Zappa-List] Beware! Spam! Grouply is not good!

Sorry if this has been posted before but it needs to be repeated.
An online group called "Grouply" asks you to register as someone on
this group has "invited" you. Don't do it!!! It requires you to give
them your yahoo id and then it takes complete control of your yahoo
account and starts spamming everyone in your address book. It is
relentless and will make a lot of enemies for you.

Here is a copy of the email I received, again:
______________________________________________

Hi Nandana,

It is in Germany.

But in most cases it does not show the "classical" picture described
in the homeopathic literature.

If you are interested in the case you describe below ask the mother to
check for peeling on the palms of the hands and soles of the feet
*after recovery*. If that happens, it confirms the diagnosis.

Whatever the blood etc may show: have the child tested for possible
effects on the kidneys off and on after recovery.

Regards

Luise

On Tue, 24 Mar 2009, Nandana T Pai wrote:

> Namaskar all,
>
>
> Is scarlet fever still prevalent? My nephew had got fever last day
> with slight throat pain - he was given Bell ( prescribed from the symptoms
> via phone) - later he has red patch in face and behind ear and on neck.
>
> So was refereed to Homoeopathic dr near by - and was diagnosed to have
> Scarlet fever. She told the eruption was typical but blood result
> did not show marked leucocytosis as in bacterial infection and ESR
> was also normal - add told that may be due to the timely
> administration of Bell.
>
>
> the mail is not for medicine i just wanted to know if the disease is
> still prevalent .
>
>
> Thanks
>
> Nandana
> _______________________________________________
> Homeopathy Mailing List
> homeopathy <at> homeolist.com
> http://lists.homeolist.com/mailman/listinfo/homeopathy
>

--
One thought to all who, free of doubt,
So definitely know what's true:
2 and 2 is 22 -
and 2 times 2 is 2
==========> ICQ yinyang 96391801 <==========

On Mar 25, 2009, at 5:00 PM, giniellis <at> juno.com wrote:

>
>> Is scarlet fever still prevalent?
> <snip>
>> the mail is not for medicine i just wanted to know if the
>> disease
> is
>> still prevalent .
>
>
> It is not a matter of whether scarlet fever is "prevalent" or not.
> Scarlet fever is an allergic like reaction (sensitivity) to *group A
> streptococcus bacteria* toxin.

It's nothing to do with allergy.
Scarlet fever is an infectious disease, and very contagious indeed -
(It's what killed my mom's baby brother and nearly killed her as a
toddler).

The organism involved in Scarlet fever is Strreptococcus pyogenes, a
group A strep which is hemolytic and which produces an erythrogenic
toxin.
Most bacteria that cause infectious disease, produce some sort of
nasty toxin/s.
For example whooping cough organism produces the toxin to cause
coughing, bordetella produces one that burns the lungs or bronchi
with strong alkali, and scarlet fever produces toxins that damage red
cells.

None of this has anything at all to do with allergic reactions, which
are responses of a skewed immune system, to prior foreign protein - a
totally different issue.

Strep throat and Scarlet Fever are separate infections caused by
different (but the same family of) bacteria.

> Not everyone who gets group A strep
> bacteria will also have scarlet fever

Nobody who gets one disease has a different one

> UNLESS they are sensitive
> (allergic) to the "A strep" toxin..

A meaningless statement.
People who get strep throat will have strep throat infection. SOME of
the characteristics of strep throat are similar looking to those of
Scarlet Fever but it is NOT Scarlet Fever. The bacteria for each are
in the same family but are separate organisms.
Saying they are the same is like comparing the common cold to an A
stain flu. Same family, very different severity of illness. Scarlet
Fever affects the whole body not just the throat.

People who get Scarlet Fever will have their red cells broken by
toxins produced by the specific bacteria associated with the illness,
and will have the usual symptoms of it - especially if they are very
young, when it can be a life threatening infection.

> The *A streptococcus bacteria*

Research shows that this is not a single bacteria (as you will find
in national library of medicine research or in textbooks of medicine
or microbiology) but a category of bacteria each of which has
specific toxin producing capability and causes an associated disease.

> is
> contagious but the scarlet fever reaction to the toxin,

Every infectious disease involves the body's response to toxin, made
by a micro-organism.
It is the microbe that goes from one individual to another to cause
infection.
Scarlet fever is EXTREMELY contagious.

> in and of itself

you mean the broken blood cells do not spread?

> ,
> can not be spread to others, therefore is not what I would call
> "prevalent".

Prevalence has to do with how common it is, not how easily it spreads.
In 1900 Scarlet Fever killed 10 in 100,000 people per year in USA.
That was the same death rate as for measles and whooping cough.
So it is an equally nasty disease as those others.

The death rate is now near zero (for all three) , but that does not
tell us how often it occurs - just that it is better under control
than used to be the case. One report from CDC shows 338 cases of
Scarlet Fever in Taiwan bet Jan and Apr 2006, and the previous year
the figure was 309, so prevalence there is rising. I did not find
USA prevalence on a quick search.
Scientists also believe the S pyogenes of Scarlet Fever today is
somewhat less virulent than it was when it killed so many people in
epidemics of Scarlet Fever in the days when my mother was a child.

Namaste,
Irene
--
Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom.
P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.
www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.)
"Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it."

•  2
  New Members

On Mar 26, 2009, at 12:47 PM, tnewman <at> everestkc.net wrote:

> Interesting. Is there some reason why it would be less contagious
> now than it used to be?

Hi Tracy,

I do not know for sure, can only speculate on options:

It may be that the organism is less prevalent and that we thus see
very few cases. Over time, most infectious diseases seem to wax and
wane, sometimes being prevalent, other times being less so.
Flu is also that way for example - we had the 1918 flu pandemic and
have not had another pandemic since then though we have had ordinary
flu epidemics with A-strain flu since then. So it may just be natural
waxing and waning.
This is why for example Taiwan is being watched as the Scarlet Fever
there is on the increase.

It may be that we just are recording one disease in place of several,
and that for example strep throat is so similar in initial symptoms
to Scarlet Fever - and relatively common these days - that some
people who get it, may have a natural immunity to "anything similar"
thus having some resistance to scarlet fever. (Follows the principles
of homeopathy.) Or maybe they had scarlet fever in such a mild form
it was assumed strep. Maybe there is more than we think.

Then too, Strep throat these days spreads easily - so thagt IS very
contagious still - and is often "resistant" to antibiotics, meaning
that antibiotics are not suppressing it, so that instead it has to
heal naturally, leaving the person with natural resistance. That
resistance would be to similar diseases

Any or all of these factors and others might be involved in our not
seeing Scarlet Fever as often as previously - and also in it seeming
to spread less easily (presumably due to increased resistance to it
and/or less virulence currently as it mutates over time).

I do not know which factors are at work...
Take your pick?
It's my take on it.

Namaste,
Irene
--
Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom.
P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.
www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.)
"Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it."

•  2
  New Members

On Mar 26, 2009, at 10:27 AM, giniellis <at> juno.com wrote:

> <<It's nothing to do with allergy.
> Scarlet fever is an infectious disease, and very contagious indeed -
> (It's what killed my mom's baby brother and nearly killed her as a
> toddler).>>
>
>
> I understand what you are saying... I stand corrected.
> This is my experience with this disease. My son has had scarlet fever
> two times (ages 5 & 16). No one else in the family or school got it.

So they must have had some sort of resistance to it then? (See my
answer to tracy for my speculation on this)
>

> My son's doctor had only treated 2 other cases in
> his 25 years (one case being the other student at our school the year
> before).

Aha - actual statistics in one area. It *does* suggest a lack of ease
of contagion these days compared to when there were major outbreaks
and deaths. Also - it is worst in the youngest members of the
population. So school going kids have developed a general exposure/
defence to the strep FAMILY of bacteria.
My mom and her baby brother were pre-school, in a small town.

> My father also had scarlet fever as a child - he had no details except
> the sxs exactly like my son (he said everyone got scarlet fever in
> those
> days).

It spread fast yes.

> I've known strep throat to be extremely contagious because I
> worked in an elementary school - but I didn't see that with scarlet
> fever.

I suspect there is a connection there.... one may cause resistance to
the other?

Namaste,
Irene
--
Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom.
P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.
www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.)
"Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it."

•  2
  New Members

On Mar 26, 2009, at 7:35 AM, Cheryl Overley wrote:
> How long ago did your mother contract Scarlet fever?

In 1919 or 1920. She was 2 yrs old and had Scarlet Fever. She was
told not to go into the new baby's room as he would get sick too. But
she just had to see her new baby brother - and he contracted the
illness and died.

> The reason I ask is because in every case I've treated or merely
> witnessed, only one family member's come down with the disease. I
> wonder how much is a "that was then this is now" type of thing.

Hard to say.
Virulence and/or resistance can change with mutations and other
influences.

>> In 1900 Scarlet Fever killed 10 in 100,000 people per year in USA.
>> That was the same death rate as for measles and whooping cough.
>> So it is an equally nasty disease as those others.
>
> I've never experienced those diseases as particularly nasty.

I was in hospital with whooping cough at age 18 months and again at
age 4. (I was vaccinated against it).
I almost did not make it. To this day I remember the doctors over me
in the hospital, telling me to try to breathe deeper and giving my
mother my dire prognosis. I'm 60 so that was also a few moons ago

<< Is your opinion of their nastiness based mostly on the statistics
and your family history of maybe a century ago or are you also seeing
folks hit hard by the disease today?>>

I work in veterinary homeopathy so I have no real picture of this
from my work.
I AM seeing some increases in the Bordetella bronchiseptica bacteria
(same family as Bordetella pertussis = whooping cough) in both
animals and people, for what that is worth. Maybe different members
of an infectious organism family are more prevalent or virulent at
different times in history. MOST cases of Bord-b in cats and people
(also sheep) are being missed by both doctors and vets, as they are
not familiar with the symptoms. In people it is a debilitating
walking pneumonia, and in cats and sheep it is a silent killer
pneumonia which builds up alkali in the lungs, burning them away.
Cats occasionally have a cough now and then that looks like a
hairball attempt but without the hairball (actually an attempt to
cough out painful lungs). Three months later they mysteriously drop
dead overnight. THIS is extremely contagious among cats and sheep -
less so with people unless immune compromised.
Kittens have 100% death rate, and after 6 months it is 50%
- ......though homeopathy can prevent or fix it.
Gene mapping shows the Bord-B organism and the whooping cough one
differ in ONE gene only! he Bord-b one makes alkali to burn lungs/
bronchi, and the whooping cough toxin causes the repetitive cough.

> If you're seeing bad cases today I'd like to puzzle out differences
> in our client base to see what's really going on. I'm in Upper
> Midwest (dry freezing winters) and I think you're in the Pacific
> Northwest (cold damp winters.)

Well, we are still having snow here, and the sidewalk outside is
under 4 foot of snow still. (We got 96 inches of snow in three weeks
from 17 Dec to New Year, in weather that was minus 6 with 45 mph
winds, and with 32 inches in a single night at the start.)
We are further north than any other USA city in the contiguous
states. I'm in Spokane which is not so much Pacific Northwest as
"Inland" Northwest. The climate is very harsh, always windy so lots
of wind-chill. It's sunnier than PNW, but in no way as mild or rainy.
I lived in Davenport, IA in the 70s, and here is not that different
except more wind here, and more darkness due to being so far North.

> My client population skews heavily towards young and healthy
> families. There are lots of La Leche League/birth center folks
> (natural health minded folks nursing children into their third and
> forth year), lots of fresh local produce consumed (CSA members,
> localvores, organic gardeners, raw food enthusiasts, etc.) with
> rich supportive social networks (various types of intentional
> community, working together for positive social change, etc.) and
> very little vaccine and antibiotic use.

We are next door to Idaho (20 mins away by car) where the school
child vaccination rate is lowest in the nation. (Good for them,
though it has more to do with lack of funds to force it than with
philosophy!) This is a poor economic area. Spokane also has the
highest illness rates in the world for chronic diseases ranging from
MS to cancer. (Probably related to latitude and being too cold to
ever get sun on the skin for Vit D). Chronic Disease prevalence is
why the MS research centre is here, along with other research centres
and a plethora of hospitals - even though it is a relatively small
city - pop 200,000. In fact the next door city is called Medical Lake
as it is mainly hospitals.

> It might be that the nastiest forms killed or sent folks to bed so
> quickly it didn't spread well while the milder strains got much
> more established by having carriers go to market, work, school, etc.

Another option to add to the speculation I did earlier

> I know many folks who just thought they were just treating a really
> bad sore throat at home until afterwards the peeling starts. The
> rash preceding the peeling can differ greatly in intensity and
> duration so some haven't even noticed it. Perhaps my clients are
> getting far milder expressions than the scientists you mention are
> seeing today because they're not using antipyretics or antibiotics
> with the sore throats,

I would give that credence except that in 1919/1920 when it was
killing all the smallest youngsters where my mom lived, they were a
town days of riding from the nearest other one and had no such things
as antibiotics and antipyretics. Whatever Irish home remedies my
grandmother could plan and whatever the local very elderly doc at the
time for the tiny town knew, was all they had. Mostly they fought the
fever, but not with any modern medicines - I could not find what
remedies they did have. It's hard to know a lot of detail from then
though I tried to investigate. My mom was always traumatized by
"having killed her baby brother" as she saw it. I can not even
imagine how it felt to be blamed for a death when she was 2 and was
very sick herself. Someone no doubt said something without thinking
during the trauma of losing a baby. It was her intense trauma from it
that had me trying to find out what I could. But the little town was
over a nasty mountain from the next place, and 85 miles on horseback
or by horse and buggy over a steep pass - a very different world from
today.

Namaste,
Irene
--
Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom.
P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.
www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.)
"Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it."

•  2
  New Members

My mother (UK) had scarlet fever around the same time.

Jane

----- Original Message -----
From: "Irene de Villiers" <furryboots <at> icehouse.net>
To: <beyondhomeopathy <at> yahoogroups.com>; "homeo list"
<homeopathy <at> homeolist.com>
Sent: Friday, March 27, 2009 10:48 AM
Subject: beyondhom !

>
> On Mar 26, 2009, at 7:35 AM, Cheryl Overley wrote:
>> How long ago did your mother contract Scarlet fever?
>
> In 1919 or 1920. She was 2 yrs old and had Scarlet Fever. She was
> told not to go into the new baby's room as he would get sick too. But
> she just had to see her new baby brother - and he contracted the
> illness and died.
>
>> The reason I ask is because in every case I've treated or merely
>> witnessed, only one family member's come down with the disease. I
>> wonder how much is a "that was then this is now" type of thing.
>
> Hard to say.
> Virulence and/or resistance can change with mutations and other
> influences.
>
>>> In 1900 Scarlet Fever killed 10 in 100,000 people per year in USA.
>>> That was the same death rate as for measles and whooping cough.
>>> So it is an equally nasty disease as those others.
>>
>> I've never experienced those diseases as particularly nasty.
>
> I was in hospital with whooping cough at age 18 months and again at
> age 4. (I was vaccinated against it).
> I almost did not make it. To this day I remember the doctors over me
> in the hospital, telling me to try to breathe deeper and giving my
> mother my dire prognosis. I'm 60 so that was also a few moons ago
>
> << Is your opinion of their nastiness based mostly on the statistics
> and your family history of maybe a century ago or are you also seeing
> folks hit hard by the disease today?>>
>
> I work in veterinary homeopathy so I have no real picture of this
> from my work.
> I AM seeing some increases in the Bordetella bronchiseptica bacteria
> (same family as Bordetella pertussis = whooping cough) in both
> animals and people, for what that is worth. Maybe different members
> of an infectious organism family are more prevalent or virulent at
> different times in history. MOST cases of Bord-b in cats and people
> (also sheep) are being missed by both doctors and vets, as they are
> not familiar with the symptoms. In people it is a debilitating
> walking pneumonia, and in cats and sheep it is a silent killer
> pneumonia which builds up alkali in the lungs, burning them away.
> Cats occasionally have a cough now and then that looks like a
> hairball attempt but without the hairball (actually an attempt to
> cough out painful lungs). Three months later they mysteriously drop
> dead overnight. THIS is extremely contagious among cats and sheep -
> less so with people unless immune compromised.
> Kittens have 100% death rate, and after 6 months it is 50%
> - ......though homeopathy can prevent or fix it.
> Gene mapping shows the Bord-B organism and the whooping cough one
> differ in ONE gene only! he Bord-b one makes alkali to burn lungs/
> bronchi, and the whooping cough toxin causes the repetitive cough.
>
>> If you're seeing bad cases today I'd like to puzzle out differences
>> in our client base to see what's really going on. I'm in Upper
>> Midwest (dry freezing winters) and I think you're in the Pacific
>> Northwest (cold damp winters.)
>
> Well, we are still having snow here, and the sidewalk outside is
> under 4 foot of snow still. (We got 96 inches of snow in three weeks
> from 17 Dec to New Year, in weather that was minus 6 with 45 mph
> winds, and with 32 inches in a single night at the start.)
> We are further north than any other USA city in the contiguous
> states. I'm in Spokane which is not so much Pacific Northwest as
> "Inland" Northwest. The climate is very harsh, always windy so lots
> of wind-chill. It's sunnier than PNW, but in no way as mild or rainy.
> I lived in Davenport, IA in the 70s, and here is not that different
> except more wind here, and more darkness due to being so far North.
>
>> My client population skews heavily towards young and healthy
>> families. There are lots of La Leche League/birth center folks
>> (natural health minded folks nursing children into their third and
>> forth year), lots of fresh local produce consumed (CSA members,
>> localvores, organic gardeners, raw food enthusiasts, etc.) with
>> rich supportive social networks (various types of intentional
>> community, working together for positive social change, etc.) and
>> very little vaccine and antibiotic use.
>
> We are next door to Idaho (20 mins away by car) where the school
> child vaccination rate is lowest in the nation. (Good for them,
> though it has more to do with lack of funds to force it than with
> philosophy!) This is a poor economic area. Spokane also has the
> highest illness rates in the world for chronic diseases ranging from
> MS to cancer. (Probably related to latitude and being too cold to
> ever get sun on the skin for Vit D). Chronic Disease prevalence is
> why the MS research centre is here, along with other research centres
> and a plethora of hospitals - even though it is a relatively small
> city - pop 200,000. In fact the next door city is called Medical Lake
> as it is mainly hospitals.
>
>> It might be that the nastiest forms killed or sent folks to bed so
>> quickly it didn't spread well while the milder strains got much
>> more established by having carriers go to market, work, school, etc.
>
> Another option to add to the speculation I did earlier
>
>> I know many folks who just thought they were just treating a really
>> bad sore throat at home until afterwards the peeling starts. The
>> rash preceding the peeling can differ greatly in intensity and
>> duration so some haven't even noticed it. Perhaps my clients are
>> getting far milder expressions than the scientists you mention are
>> seeing today because they're not using antipyretics or antibiotics
>> with the sore throats,
>
> I would give that credence except that in 1919/1920 when it was
> killing all the smallest youngsters where my mom lived, they were a
> town days of riding from the nearest other one and had no such things
> as antibiotics and antipyretics. Whatever Irish home remedies my
> grandmother could plan and whatever the local very elderly doc at the
> time for the tiny town knew, was all they had. Mostly they fought the
> fever, but not with any modern medicines - I could not find what
> remedies they did have. It's hard to know a lot of detail from then
> though I tried to investigate. My mom was always traumatized by
> "having killed her baby brother" as she saw it. I can not even
> imagine how it felt to be blamed for a death when she was 2 and was
> very sick herself. Someone no doubt said something without thinking
> during the trauma of losing a baby. It was her intense trauma from it
> that had me trying to find out what I could. But the little town was
> over a nasty mountain from the next place, and 85 miles on horseback
> or by horse and buggy over a steep pass - a very different world from
> today.
>
> Namaste,
> Irene
> --
> Irene de Villiers, B.Sc AASCA MCSSA D.I.Hom/D.Vet.Hom.
> P.O. Box 4703 Spokane WA 99220.
> www.angelfire.com/fl/furryboots/clickhere.html (Veterinary Homeopath.)
> "Man who say it cannot be done should not interrupt one doing it."
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> The Healing of Humanity is our ultimate goal.
> The opinions expressed by posters on this list are the responsibility of
> the poster and do not reflect the opinion of the owner.Suggestions given
> on the list are not to be taken as prescriptions.Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>

----------------------------------------------------------

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 8.0.238 / Virus Database: 270.11.30/2025 - Release Date: 03/26/09
20:05:00

•  2
  New Members