what is the difference between butane, isobutane, propane. . . or anything that ends with "pane" in its name? Which one performs better under cold situations (upper sierra nevada, for example).
Thanx,
J.

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Good Ralph.
        I might note that as the number of carbons go up, there is a
greater tendancy to become solid, to form branchings and usually
with more heat at room temps.
        My thoughts only . . .
                 jdm
 


At 11:30 AM 2/1/2010, you wrote:

what is the difference between butane, isobutane, propane. . . or anything that ends with "pane" in its name? Which one performs better under cold situations (upper sierra nevada, for example).
Thanx,
J.
 
 
Warning Organic Chemistry lecture dump   :]
 
 

Chemically they are linked carbon atoms with hydrogen.

A carbon atom likes to for four bonds with other molecules (in this case hydrogens or other carbons)

 

These are the easy “straight chain” carbon molecules (called alkanes):

Methane        1 carbon, 4 hydrogens        CH4

Ethane           2 carbons, 6 hydrogens      C2H6

Propane         3 carbons, 8 hydrogens      C3H8  

Butane           4 carbons, 10 hydrogens    C4H10

Pentane         5 carbons, 12 hydrogens    C5H12

Hexane          6 carbons, 14 hydrogens    C6H14

Heptane, Octane….etc.

 

If they are branched they are called iso alkanes  (iso-propane) with slightly different boiling points.

 

If one of the hydrogens is replaced by an oxygen and a hydrogen it is called an alcohol

 

 

In general the longer the chain, the lower the boiling point and the higher the pressure in a container.

 

Propane takes the strength of a steel bottle to pressurize, butane can be pressurized in a plastic Bic lighter, pentane is a liquid at room temperature.

 

The problem at cold temperatures is the boiling point of butane is about -1° C, so below that temp is stays a liquid

 

When burned properly they produce water and carbon dioxide.

 

There is a lot more info here (look under physical properties:

 

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alkane


Ralph

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--- In BackpackingLight <at> yahoogroups.com, Patronio <at> ... wrote:
>
> what is the difference between butane, isobutane, propane. . . or anything
> that ends with "pane" in its name? Which one performs better under cold
> situations (upper sierra nevada, for example).
> Thanx,
> J.
>
The best one for cold conditions is the isobutane/propane mix. I know that Jetboil, Brunton and MSR sell these canisters. Its generally a 80/20 mix.

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Hi Ed,
I'm fairly sure you meant "multiple" vitamins, meaning one that has
many different vitamins in one tablet. When hiking, it's possible that you won't get all the nutrients you need daily, especially if you are consuming lots of dehydrated or freeze dried foods and very few if
any fresh foods.

This may not be terribly important if you're just on a weekend hike, but when thru-hiking for months at a time, many hikers will take vitamin supplements to be sure they get enough vitamins. When I was on the Appalachian trail many on the long-distance hikers were eating a "Flintstone" children's chewable vitamins daily, probably because they were tasty. And on the PCT I recently met thru-hikers who were using "gummy" children's chewable vitamins, again probably because
they taste good.
Best, Don L.

ed_rodriguez52 <at> ... wrote:
>
> How would or does taken a militia vitamins help in a thru hike. Do they just supplement your daily needs? Any thoughts or input. Thanks

>

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Ok thanks Don you answer my question. Wasn't sure what the body needed over a long period of time. Will buy some for my JMT this year.

Sent on the Sprint® Now Network from my BlackBerry®

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Yes, indeed thanks for the Organic Chemistry post Ralph. I might add that some of my winter camping friends have put a handwarmer in the hollow underneath their canister to fool it into thinking it's in a warmer environment. The danger with doing this is that you often overexcite the canister by getting it too warm and then it will "spit out" fuel in unpleasantly uncontrollable larger amounts than you were hoping for.

I usually leave the area when they do this. I haven't heard of any canisters actually going "BOOM!" under this sort of overstimulation, but that remains something that should concern anyone who tries this!
Best, Don L.

>
> Good Ralph.
> I might note that as the number of carbons go up, there is a
> greater tendancy to become solid, to form branchings and usually
> with more heat at room temps.

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Hope you have a great time on the JMT, Ed, it's one of the world's great backpacks! We'd be happy to have you post a trip report when you come back from it.
Best, Don L. Moderator

ed_rodriguez52 <at> ... wrote:
>
> Ok thanks Don you answer my question. Wasn't sure what the body needed over a long period of time. Will buy some for my JMT this year.

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Coleman canisters are 70% butane and 30% propane.

Jerry

http://www.backpackgeartest.org/: the most comprehensive interactive gear
reviews on the planet.

-----Original Message-----
From: BackpackingLight <at> yahoogroups.com
[mailto:BackpackingLight <at> yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of li1ricky
Sent: Monday, February 01, 2010 08:09
To: BackpackingLight <at> yahoogroups.com
Subject: [BackpackingLight] Re: New question about an old issue

--- In BackpackingLight <at> yahoogroups.com, Patronio <at> ... wrote:
>
> what is the difference between butane, isobutane, propane. . . or anything

> that ends with "pane" in its name? Which one performs better under cold
> situations (upper sierra nevada, for example).
> Thanx,
> J.
>
The best one for cold conditions is the isobutane/propane mix. I know that
Jetboil, Brunton and MSR sell these canisters. Its generally a 80/20 mix.

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