Ralph Oborn | 1 Jan 2008 01:13
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Re: stoves and fuels

On 12/31/07, James D. Marco <jmarco1 <at> twcny.rr.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Ralph,
> Yes, I picked up a couple that had been burned
> and "split". Normally, a stake (or a knife point) will
> puncture the container. After burning the temper out
> of the tin, stomping them flat works fine. (You can
> stand on one before burning it, though.) Is that what
> you were referring to?
> My thoughts only . . .
> jdm

Naw I was worried about there being some fuel left in the pressurized
container when it was placed in the fire.
I had flashbacks of mushroom clouds from my misspent youth.

Puncture first with a knife and it should be safe.

Ralph

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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lighttrailfood | 1 Jan 2008 03:05
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Re: stoves and fuels

Thanks for all the input.

Yes, it was the JMT north lake / south lake Evolution Loop in the High
Sierra. And yes I did have a lot of extra fuel at trails end. We did
the trip in 5 days but we had planned for 6 days. I had close to 1#
of fuel left over.

The stove that I use is Don Johnston's Photon Stove with a nice
windshield. I actually bought it from Don several years ago. It take
me ~2 oz of fuel for a pot of water (~4 cups for the 2 of us). Wind
can easily run it up to 4 oz. The Photon stove frequently vapor locks
when filling it. It is also a real bother when I under estimate the
fuel required to boil water and I have to add fuel and the stove is
still hot.

The math that I am trying to get is how much fuel does it take for the
Giga stove to boil an equal amount of water? The real question here I
guess is how many pots of water does one get out of a snow peak
container.

Here in CA the wood stoves are illegal in so many places that I would
not even bother with it.

BTW I do have an old Hank Roberts mini stove which I gave up due to
getting tired of all the empty fuel containers packed out. For that
matter I still have a svea 123 (buzz bomb) in the garage that my Pop
and I use to use in the 60's...yikes those things are dangerous!!!!

Be well,

Jack

--- In BackpackingLight <at> yahoogroups.com, "belcherjd" <BelcherJD <at> ...>
wrote:
>
> --- In BackpackingLight <at> yahoogroups.com, "Jack Young"
> <auctionjack <at> > wrote:
> > evolution loop last summer I was carrying about 4# of fuel.
> > Wwhat stove are you currently using and are
> > you happy with it? I am looking at the Snow Peak Giga Power Stove
> with Piezo.
> > Be well,
> > Jack
>
> Jack
> I don't know which evolution loop you refer too, but I'm guessing it
> is a 55 mile hike in the southern JMT and you did not say how long you
> took to hike it. Therefore I can only say that 4# of fuel seems like
> over kill.
>
> Most of the time I use one of my Pepsi can or Cat stoves (of which I
> have lots to choose from) and I love them.
> I've posted pics under "Jon's cat stove"
>
> I have found, for me, that after 20 meals the weight of fuel sends me
> to use my Snow Peak Giga Power Stove with peizo which I like very much
> ... great stove and have never had a problem with it.
>
> A meal for me generally means boiling three cups of water which I can
> easily do on 1 oz of fuel with 40 degree water using a simplified cat
> stove.
>
> I prefer to use the alcohol stoves mostly due to the fact that there
> is nothing to break down and leave you with no stove to use ....
> Although, I have never had a stove leave me High and Cold in 50 years
> of packing.
>
> I also have an old style Sierra Wood stove that I like alot. It weighs
> 1# and there is no fuel to carry for unlimited boiled water or fish
> frying.
> Two problems with the wood stove:
> 1. it is very dirty and I need a seperate stuff sack to keep the pot
> from getting EVERYTHING else black.
> 2. I live just north of Seattle and on a seven day hike it's most
> likely that atleast two of those days will be raining and cool.
> Neither problem insurmountable but still a consideration.
> If I'm going with 3+ people in August and want lots of cooking time
> then the wood stove is a very light weight way to go.
>
> 'til later
> Jon
>

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msoliver33 | 1 Jan 2008 04:29
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Gloves

Hey all. Not really a "new" member. More a reader than a typer and I've
enjoyed having this as an excellent resource. So, thanks to all. My
question is regarding gloves. Live here in NW arkansas and most of my
backpacking is done along the OHT. In the winter it can dip from 20-30
but with the wind and humidity it sure feels colder at times. Looking
for some LIGHT easily maneuverable gloves to keep my digits toasty.
I've been contemplating seal skinz just becuase they appear the the
best for moving my fingers around, lighting my stove, setting up camp,
and messing with backpack straps, etc. Also they claim to
be "waterproof". Anyone have any thoughts? Thanks for the help.

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Cara Lin Bridgman | 1 Jan 2008 08:15

Re: stoves and fuels

BOOM!

That's why my husband always attacks the empties with his pocketknife
can-opener.

CL

Ralph Oborn wrote:
> On 12/31/07, James D. Marco <jmarco1 <at> twcny.rr.com> wrote:
> < snip>
> I usually pack out an empty after burning it.
> <snip>
>
> Anybody but me see a potential problem with this? :]
>
> Ralph

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Patronio | 1 Jan 2008 08:56
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Re: stoves and fuels

I have to say the same thing about the Snow Peak Gigapower. I think it is an
excellent little stove. The igniter works fine, after two years of heavy
usage.
J.

**************************************
See AOL's top rated recipes
(http://food.aol.com/top-rated-recipes?NCID=aoltop00030000000004)

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Brian Lewis | 1 Jan 2008 09:38

RE: Re: stoves and fuels

"The real question is how much fuel does it take to boil a pot of water,
right? Because your use per day may vary greatly form my use, right?
Depending upon how many times
we brew-up. So how many pots of water on average do you boil a day including
food and coffee/tea and meals?"

FWIW, I go with cold breakfast and lunch, and heat something less than a
liter per day typically for dinner.

However, I think there are more variables. The water I heat up is already
filtered, so I don't typically boil it --- depending on what I cook.
Sometimes I might simmer, but often I just want the water hot enough to be
adequate for rehydrating and warming whatever meal I'm using it with. If
it's an off-the-shelf freeze dried meal, then "hot" is good enough, I don't
need to get it to a rolling boil. This naturally impacts fuel use.

One issue --- a minor issue, but perhaps measurable over a longer trip ---
is how much extra fuel an alcohol stove user burns to be sure the water gets
hot enough. Perhaps this varies with stove design, dunno. I have a
brasslight alcohol stove, and while in theory I can blow it out and pour
back excess, in practice I try to put in just enough to heat my water with
maybe a little more to make sure I don't have to light the stove a second
time. Hence I might use a fraction of a fluid ounce more than I really
need each time. With a cannister stove, you can shut the sucker precisely
when you want, wasting no fuel.

I still go with the alcohol stove crowd. Can be a little more fiddly and
take a little more time, but unless I'm doing a faily long unresupplied
stretch, my overall stove + fuel weight averages out lower.

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John Karpinski | 1 Jan 2008 16:45
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Re: stoves and fuels

Understanding that there are many variables in this discussion that make it difficult to put
numbers that can be compared, here is my 2 cents.

I've used an alcohol stove for all of my 3-season backpacking for years.
My 1 liter pot, windscreen, stove and 28 fluid-oz plastic fuel container weigh 9 oz. With
the exception of the stove weigh could be trimmed from all of these.

If I solo I use 1.5 oz of alcohol/day. This gets me coffee and oatmeal in the AM and a
hydrated dinner with tea in the PM. (.75 oz of alcohol will boil 16 oz of water)

For a 7 day hike I use 10.5 oz alcohol. Averaging the diminishing weight over the 7 days
equals 6 oz/day/person.

Add that to my 9 oz "base weight" means I carry an average of 15 oz/day/person to meet
my cooking needs.

If I go with a hiking buddy (which is more likely) the average drops to 10.5 oz/day/person
because the base weight stays the same and only the alcohol use doubles.

It would be interesting to try to compare similar calculations with a canister user.
Anyone interested?

John Karpinski

> "The real question is how much fuel does it take to boil a pot of water,
> right? Because your use per day may vary greatly form my use, right?
> Depending upon how many times
> we brew-up. So how many pots of water on average do you boil a day including
> food and coffee/tea and meals?"
>
> FWIW, I go with cold breakfast and lunch, and heat something less than a
> liter per day typically for dinner.
>
> However, I think there are more variables. The water I heat up is already
> filtered, so I don't typically boil it --- depending on what I cook.
> Sometimes I might simmer, but often I just want the water hot enough to be
> adequate for rehydrating and warming whatever meal I'm using it with. If
> it's an off-the-shelf freeze dried meal, then "hot" is good enough, I don't
> need to get it to a rolling boil. This naturally impacts fuel use.
>
> One issue --- a minor issue, but perhaps measurable over a longer trip ---
> is how much extra fuel an alcohol stove user burns to be sure the water gets
> hot enough. Perhaps this varies with stove design, dunno. I have a
> brasslight alcohol stove, and while in theory I can blow it out and pour
> back excess, in practice I try to put in just enough to heat my water with
> maybe a little more to make sure I don't have to light the stove a second
> time. Hence I might use a fraction of a fluid ounce more than I really
> need each time. With a cannister stove, you can shut the sucker precisely
> when you want, wasting no fuel.
>
> I still go with the alcohol stove crowd. Can be a little more fiddly and
> take a little more time, but unless I'm doing a faily long unresupplied
> stretch, my overall stove + fuel weight averages out lower.
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

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Kirk Wasson | 1 Jan 2008 17:21

Re: Gloves

Great subject for this group to discuss.
I have a drawer full of gloves and just bought a new pair in New York
the other day(fleece dress gloves for work). Glove obsession? No, it
is hard to find the perfect glove for all occasions.
Backpacking in cold weather, I usally wear my fleece gloves with the
finger tips exposed. A mitten flap folds over to cover my fingers.
These were cheap gloves that I have sewn back together several times.
Not very durable but warm even when wet. I also always carry a pair of
Mechanics gloves. The finger material is thinner but allows you to use
you fingers for basic tasks. They are also good for climbing and when
doing trail work or campsite restoration. Have been on the OHT many
times even this time of year and keeping hands warm is important. Kirk

--- In BackpackingLight <at> yahoogroups.com, "msoliver33" <msoliver33 <at> ...>
wrote:
>
> Hey all. Not really a "new" member. More a reader than a typer and
I've
> enjoyed having this as an excellent resource. So, thanks to all. My
> question is regarding gloves. Live here in NW arkansas and most of my
> backpacking is done along the OHT. In the winter it can dip from 20-
30
> but with the wind and humidity it sure feels colder at times. Looking
> for some LIGHT easily maneuverable gloves to keep my digits toasty.
> I've been contemplating seal skinz just becuase they appear the the
> best for moving my fingers around, lighting my stove, setting up
camp,
> and messing with backpack straps, etc. Also they claim to
> be "waterproof". Anyone have any thoughts? Thanks for the help.
>

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Russ Drake | 1 Jan 2008 17:47
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Re:Gloves

I would recommend looking at some running gloves. I have a pair of Brooks running gloves that feel cool when you first put them on but after a few minutes they are warm. You don't want something that is going to make your hands too warm and sweat.

Just my .02 worth

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Nate | 1 Jan 2008 19:41
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Wood stoves

I have been reading the threads on stoves and I am wondering about
wood. What is the appeal of a wood burning stove? Assuming you want
to cook over wood, why have a stove to do it? You can just build a
campfire. I am assuming that if you can use a wood stove in your
area, you would also have a small campfire.

To me, it seems that the weight of the stove itself wouldn't be worth
it if you can just cook over a fire.

Nate

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