Kevin Brew | 22 Oct 01:04 2003

LSMD?

So, what's happening with the LSMD project? has anything final come out of 
it as of yet?

I'm beginning a restructuring of loose-screws' database, and I'd like it to 
be as easily translated to an lsmd description as possible.  I've looked 
around and I can't seem to find a schema anywhere.

	--Kevin 

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mugendai | 22 Oct 01:23 2003

Re: OTS2 Annoyance.

I'de have to side with Tom on this one.  It's becoming easier and easier 
for people these days to forget that not everyone has an always on 
connection.  I personally HATE the idea of anything in my computer 
needing an internet connection to get online.
I have managed to never live where DSL exists.  And while I did live in 
two places that had cable, the last two I have lived in have had no form 
of high speed internet access.
Since like 95 when I first had some form of being able to download 
things from other people(back then it was BBS, and I hosted my own) I 
have been storing everything I ever get my hands on, I don't like going 
out and re-downloading anything.

I understand the idea behind NetLoadModule, but I think it would be 
better used as an optional thing.  I also like my modules loaded 
threaded, I dont like the rest of my theme stalling while popup loads 
icons etc...  not that it takes that long to load the icons.  But 
general things like that.

Any way it goes I haven't taken the time to read over OTS2.. so some or 
all of my opinions may be completly unfounded until I take the time to 
do so, and I think I am kinda in the mood for that right now.

Tom Russell wrote:

>The one thing about OTS2 that is really starting to piss me off is the fact that Omar states that modules
should not be included with the theme download, but left for NetLoadModule to download.
>
>Sorry, but where i use litestep themes, i don't have an internet connection (usually) - because i download
them onto my college network space then transfer them to my laptop over a network connection (i can't
access the internet through the network because our sysadmin guards proxy server details with his life,
(Continue reading)

Phil Varcoe | 22 Oct 04:44 2003
Picon

Theme release

Hi all.

I thought I'd mention a theme I have just released.
It is called PixOffice, based on a windowblinds skin of the same name by 
treetog.
It is OTS2 compliant.
It is a bar based format, keeping most of the desktop uncluttered.
It has some toggles and stuff, that hopefully work correctly with the 
scripting I included.

Although I have publicly released it, I wouldn't mind some feedback on the 
theme particularily on it's compliance with the OTS2 standard. If it needs 
tweaking I can always update the existing files I've already uploaded.

It is at several sites, Wincustomize is one I'll post a link to:

http://www.wincustomize.com/skins.asp?library=6

Thanks.
Phil

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Jon | 22 Oct 06:15 2003
Picon

Re: Theme release

Phil Varcoe wrote:

> Hi all.
>
> I thought I'd mention a theme I have just released.
> It is called PixOffice, based on a windowblinds skin of the same name 
> by treetog.
> It is OTS2 compliant.
> It is a bar based format, keeping most of the desktop uncluttered.
> It has some toggles and stuff, that hopefully work correctly with the 
> scripting I included.
>
> Although I have publicly released it, I wouldn't mind some feedback on 
> the theme particularily on it's compliance with the OTS2 standard. If 
> it needs tweaking I can always update the existing files I've already 
> uploaded.
>
> It is at several sites, Wincustomize is one I'll post a link to:
>
> http://www.wincustomize.com/skins.asp?library=6
>
> Thanks.
> Phil

You may want to check some of the evars make sure that they are all in 
quotes (") because I got a script error that it could not fins 
c:\documents (usually means that the $themedir$ or $personaldir$ aren't 
in qoutes at some point in the theme)

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(Continue reading)

Jon | 22 Oct 06:18 2003
Picon

Re: Theme release

Found it!

*mzScriptFile                   $ConfigDir$script.rc
*mzVarFile                      $ConfigDir$themevars.rc

should be

*mzScriptFile                   "$ConfigDir$script.rc"
*mzVarFile                      "$ConfigDir$themevars.rc"

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rabidcow | 22 Oct 07:37 2003
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Re: LSMD?


On Tue, 21 Oct 2003 19:04:32 -0400 Kevin Brew <cypress@...>
writes:
> So, what's happening with the LSMD project? has anything final
> come out of it as of yet?

I think there are now 3 different versions in use.  There's the one I
use, the one jesus_mjjg uses, and the one they are/will use for ls.net.

Mine'll probably have the most stuff in em, but will also be the most
difficult to create.

> I'm beginning a restructuring of loose-screws' database,
> and I'd like it to be as easily translated to an lsmd description
> as possible.  I've looked around and I can't seem to find a
> schema anywhere.

Em, give me a few days.  I just purchased a copy of xmlspy, so I can put
together a schema of what I'm using, and maybe that dtd that I promised
devilboi about a month ago. 

btw regarding categories, I've defined these for lsmd:
audio console comm datetime desktop display events exec games keyboard
metamodule meters misc network popup recyclebin remote script tasks text
tray vdm windows

If someone's got a better list of categories, I'll use them too.  I
expect most modules will fit into at least two of these ones.

-rabidcow
(Continue reading)

mugendai | 22 Oct 08:43 2003

Lets talk OTS2(anyone intrested in OTS2, I beg of you, please read)

I knew there was a reason I was putting off reading up on the OTS2 
standards, aside from the fact that I was busy.
And one of the biggest pieces of the I don't like OTS2 is 
NetLoadModule's forced usage.  Of course there is the option of not 
being OTS2 complient, but I would like to comply with it, without being 
forced to force the user to get their modules off the web via 
NetLoadModule.  I'm not saying I dislike NetLoadModule, I think its 
concept is quite good, and I have no qualms with using it, however, I 
don't want to force the user to get their modules using it.

First of all, Threadedness.  Theme makes should have the option to load 
their modules using the standard threading method, if they want all 
their modules loading at the same time, and in different threads, this 
should be up to them.  However I do have to applaud the idea that 
NetLoadModule loads each in order, but in seperate threads, which allows 
for some things that werent previously possible with the older threading 
method.
I don't like the idea of my computer needing an internet connection to 
get the modules.
I don't want to put down NetLoadModule, I think it is a great idea, but 
I also think that it is something that the user should decide whether 
they want to use or not.  I have never been a fan for instance of 
downloader installers, I.E. you go to update windows update it downloads 
an installer that downloads the files.  I don't like those, and users 
shouldnt be forced to use this sort of a thing.
Another problem brought by NLM is it forces the theme developer to use 
ONLY the modules on the website.  What happens to module developers who 
are using beta's, or people they give those modules too, or anyone using 
specially modded or made modules that they dont want on the website?

(Continue reading)

Christian Buffin | 22 Oct 09:39 2003
Picon

Re: LSMD?

> > So, what's happening with the LSMD project? has anything final
> > come out of it as of yet?
> I think there are now 3 different versions in use.  There's the one I
> use, the one jesus_mjjg uses, and the one they are/will use for ls.net.
> Mine'll probably have the most stuff in em, but will also be the most
> difficult to create.

Well actually, there are two versions in use: the one RabidCow uses and the
ls.net one.
The ls.net DTD has been done by Tres´ni (based loosely on MrMidi's one) I
think, and needs some additions imo.
I merely use what has been done by other people (be it RabidCow, Tres´ni, or
MrMidi a long time ago).

> > I'm beginning a restructuring of loose-screws' database,
> > and I'd like it to be as easily translated to an lsmd description
> > as possible.  I've looked around and I can't seem to find a
> > schema anywhere.
>
> Em, give me a few days.  I just purchased a copy of xmlspy, so I can put
> together a schema of what I'm using, and maybe that dtd that I promised
> devilboi about a month ago.

Here's a version of the ls.net DTD (though I know Tres´ni has already
changed a few things).
http://users.skynet.be/fa052720/temp/lsdoc_dtd.txt

One thing I really do appreciate about RabidCow's schema is the "section"
part for commands and bangs, that enables the docs to have a structure with
divisions, making them much more readable (he, at leat, will know what I'm
(Continue reading)

rabidcow | 22 Oct 09:51 2003
Picon

Re: Lets talk OTS2(anyone intrested in OTS2, I beg of you, please read)


On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 01:43:58 -0500 mugendai <mugendai@...> writes:

...a lot more than omar ;)

> I have never been a fan for instance of downloader installers, I.E.
> you go to update windows update it downloads an installer that
> downloads the files.  I don't like those, and users shouldnt be
> forced to use this sort of a thing.

Me neither really, oddly I love the concept when it's my own
implementation :)

But how do you give the user a choice without negating the benefits of
NLM or having two copies of every theme?  Most web sites that offer this
sort of network installer have a second version that includes everything
for, eg, installing on multiple computers at a site.

> Another problem brought by NLM is it forces the theme
> developer to use ONLY the modules on the website.  What
> happens to module developers who are using beta's, or
> people they give those modules too, or anyone using 
> specially modded or made modules that they dont want on
> the website?

IMO development betas that are not publicly released should not be used
in publicly available themes, and any module that requires custom hacking
to the dll needs to be redesigned.

Still, this is easier to deal with than giving the user a choice, since
(Continue reading)

mugendai | 22 Oct 10:43 2003

Re: Lets talk OTS2(anyone intrested in OTS2, I beg of you, please read)


>But how do you give the user a choice without negating the benefits of
>NLM or having two copies of every theme?  Most web sites that offer this
>sort of network installer have a second version that includes everything
>for, eg, installing on multiple computers at a site.
>
>  
>
Actually, the idea is more so to give the themer and the distributer, 
who may be the same person, the choice.
As an example, I dont hav emy theme on any site, and I have atleast one 
module that was given to me that will never be found on a site, and a 
modified popup2 that doesnt leak, but you also wont find on any site.
I have a couple people I send the theme to when I update it, and the 
OTS2's current arcitecture leaves me high and dry if I wanna update to OTS2.

>
>IMO development betas that are not publicly released should not be used
>in publicly available themes, and any module that requires custom hacking
>to the dll needs to be redesigned.
>
>Still, this is easier to deal with than giving the user a choice, since
>the themer will know if it's not available ahead of time.
>  
>
Yea, but what will the themer do?  There isnt even a deffinition for 
including a module that isnt found on the website.
Also, the theme doesn't necciserily have to be publicly available, I.E. 
me again with giving it to a couple friends, including the needed 
modules, I have no qualm with them redownloading the modules from me.  
(Continue reading)


Gmane