Peter Morville | 1 Jan 2011 12:54

Re: [Sigia-l] Anyone suggest a better global list?

As a practicing information architect, I'd have to agree with Skot. Designers and developers have
absorbed the basic skills of IA, but there remain many environments where people who specialize in
strategic and/or tactical IA are required. I focus primarily on strategic IA and find myself having to
refer some really good work to others, because I can't meet demand.

At the same time, I believe the emergence of cross-platform, multi-channel, (ubiquitous, pervasive,
ambient) experiences is opening up a whole new set of challenges for information architects and other
mapmakers. In the next 5-10 years, we will need to create a new set of "basic skills" for designers and
developers to absorb.

This will require discussion, so I'm pleased to see that sigia has survived into 2011. Happy New Year!

Peter Morville
President, Semantic Studios
http://semanticstudios.com/
http://findability.org/

On Dec 31, 2010, at 3:16 PM, Skot Nelson wrote:

> I disagree with the premise that it's been absorbed, but acknowledge that a basic skill set may have and
that for many organizations that "basic" skill set suffices.
> 
> Project management should never have been it's own discipline. It's a skill set, but there are times when a
dedicated project manager is appropriate.
> 
> Similarly designers need to be aware of usability and information architecture concepts, but there are
still Many times when a dedicated usability position may be important.
> 
> --
> Skot Nelson
(Continue reading)

James Aylett | 1 Jan 2011 14:58
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Re: [Sigia-l] Anyone suggest a better global list?

On 31 Dec 2010, at 20:16, Skot Nelson wrote:

> Project management should never have been it's own discipline. It's a skill set, but there are times when a
dedicated project manager is appropriate.

This is an interesting assertion that I completely disagree with :-) Further, I think that the opposite
opinion has better (and more hopeful) parallels with this discussion of IA.

Various people have talked about the basic skills of IA now being expected in designers. Similarly, the
basic skills of project management should always have been expected of everyone except the very
inexperienced. However when you move beyond the basic, you get into levels of knowledge of a skill base
that require specialists. I think this is what makes a discipline exist; everyone can get a basic
grounding in a range of different skill sets, then get deep grounding in a smaller number. You bring
together a cross-discipline team based on the shape of your problem. If you're building a tiny system that
simply accepts comments but passes them onto another system for processing, you may not need an IA
specialist, and similarly if you're working with a small co-located team, without heavy ext
 ernal dependencies, suppliers and so on, you may not need a dedicated project manager. Similarly with any
other discipline (some companies need logistics experts, or pilots).

Of course, this doesn't necessarily answer the question as to why this list went quiet. Perhaps it's that by
driving the complexity of problems that are referred to actual IAs up, combined with an increase in the
number of problems that need /some/ IA but without a suitable increase in the number of professional IAs,
people's minds are being swamped with the work they're doing, and there's less time available for
distilling that work into ideas and stories that can help others? Many counterbalancing forces, and
maybe they aren't quite balanced at the moment.

I'd say there's also something to the argument that at the basic levels, so much stuff has been experimented
with, researched and discussed that people don't feel a need to share yet another story about how they did
what their professional instinct is telling them to do. It may take a while longer for learnings from the
more complex stuff that is being done to emerge. It takes time to reflect on what you've discovered so that
(Continue reading)

Laurie Gray | 1 Jan 2011 15:54
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Re: [Sigia-l] Anyone suggest a better global list?

Just curious, by show of digital hands, are readers more generalist or specialist? And, are they happy
there, or do they feel the need to move in the other direction for whatever reason?

I suspect the answer is that there are more generalists than specialists, and that people are ok with where
they are.

I am a UX generalist in my current consultancy role (which also includes light PM activities) and it's
serving me well - I see no reason to change. My background knowledge allows me to operate on a daily basis
with ease, making questions/referrals when I need assistance. This allows me to specialize in other,
non-ux areas. The issue becomes interesting, though, when we look at how to train junior staff and take
into consideration what they should know to operate at a basic level. How to condense over a decade of
experience into key points in a way that's consumable in a reasonable period of time?

Laurie

Laurie Gray
Producer Practice Lead / Senior Visualization Designer, OneSpring

On Jan 1, 2011, at 8:58 AM, James Aylett <james <at> tartarus.org> wrote:

> On 31 Dec 2010, at 20:16, Skot Nelson wrote:
> 
>> Project management should never have been it's own discipline. It's a skill set, but there are times when
a dedicated project manager is appropriate.
> 
> 
> This is an interesting assertion that I completely disagree with :-) Further, I think that the opposite
opinion has better (and more hopeful) parallels with this discussion of IA.
> 
> Various people have talked about the basic skills of IA now being expected in designers. Similarly, the
(Continue reading)

Paola Kathuria | 1 Jan 2011 16:45
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Re: [Sigia-l] Anyone suggest a better global list?

Laurie Gray wrote:
> Just curious, by show of digital hands, are readers more generalist or
> specialist? And, are they happy there, or do they feel the need to move
> in the other direction for whatever reason?

I think I must be a generalist.

I've worked for my own small (2-3 people) Internet companies
for the last 15 years, specialising in database-backed web sites;

we each quickly found our strengths in projects. However, we knew
we couldn't do it all and so we hired expertise as needed.

I've always found it hard to explain what I do - I have called
myself a web architect, web producer and web developer. I did the
requirements definition including site structure, high-level page
prototypes, database design, programming, testing, documentation,
training and project management.

I hired people to create wireframes, the graphic design and HTML
page templates with CSS stylesheets. My colleagues did the
web server configuration, database optimisation and anything AJAXy.

We've decided to go back to contracting for a year. I've realised
that by picking and choosing my involvement in projects, I do not
neatly fit into any hire-able role - without direct wire-framing
experience, I'm not considered an IA and most PHP/MySQL contracts
require JavaScript.

I suspect that the answer to whether one is a generalist or
(Continue reading)

Susan Doran | 4 Jan 2011 00:24
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Re: [Sigia-l] Anyone suggest a better global list?


hi 

Figured I'd chime in too re: experience w/this list.

I have subscribed on and off for many years.

The last stint was 2006-2008.  And I just rejoined in Dec 2010.  I've gotten my juice elsewhere.

So--Ziya was a pain in the ass. Flooding the Box with responses to every single post. High-handed,
arrogant, insulting, long-winded (I'm often guilty of the latter).

Ziya was a "bully"---in terms of how much space s/he took up, presumed authority, ham-handed
bull-in-a-china-shop disrespectful approach, unwillingness to listen or "connect" with other
people---a deafening know-it-all bullhorn---and sheer exhausting volume.  I wrote to ASIS about
stepping in at that time because Ziya unchecked would likely undermine the community. ASIS didn't take
steps---understandably, they had every right to make a choice about whether to intervene.  

I have studied collaborative leadership and decision-making---and have run and convened more than a
dozen community projects of varying size and complexity (not online). And it's a known phenomenon, and
one I've witnessed many times, when a particularly loud, large, needy, or aggressive presence is allowed
to dominate, that one presence will, in fact, drive out some of the most talented and interested original
members. Because it's no longer fruitful or fulfilling to participate.  It's no longer a community of
equals. 

The way around it (in the non-online world, at least) is to have robust process agreements the group comes up
with and and signs off on, and if someone is transgressing the group's agreements, eventually they can't participate.

There were other posters (some posting to this thread) who also were obnoxious, snarky, insulting,
dismissive, unnecessarily combative, and basically not looking to the long-term health and well-being
(Continue reading)

Skot Nelson | 4 Jan 2011 01:06

Re: [Sigia-l] Anyone suggest a better global list?

Well said Susan. (I *did* read I through to the end.)

--
Skot Nelson

skot <at> penguinstorm.com

twitter. penguinstorm

On 2011-01-03, at 15:24, Susan Doran <susandoran <at> hotmail.com> wrote:

> 
> hi 
> 
> Figured I'd chime in too re: experience w/this list.
> 
> I have subscribed on and off for many years.
> 
> The last stint was 2006-2008.  And I just rejoined in Dec 2010.  I've gotten my juice elsewhere.
> 
> So--Ziya was a pain in the ass. Flooding the Box with responses to every single post. High-handed,
arrogant, insulting, long-winded (I'm often guilty of the latter).
> 
> Ziya was a "bully"---in terms of how much space s/he took up, presumed authority, ham-handed
bull-in-a-china-shop disrespectful approach, unwillingness to listen or "connect" with other
people---a deafening know-it-all bullhorn---and sheer exhausting volume.  I wrote to ASIS about
stepping in at that time because Ziya unchecked would likely undermine the community. ASIS didn't take
steps---understandably, they had every right to make a choice about whether to intervene.  
> 
> I have studied collaborative leadership and decision-making---and have run and convened more than a
(Continue reading)

Skot Nelson | 4 Jan 2011 05:48

Re: [Sigia-l] Anyone suggest a better global list?

> I found a graph I did at the time... http://bit.ly/e7F9zj
> 
> You can see that while discussion volume (if not diversity of voices)
> continued, that list nonetheless was being decimated behind the scenes.

Nice graph. It'd be interesting to see Ziya's posts alone graphed as another line to see if the decline
related to that specific volume. I gather that's not the case.

> The noisy individual left soon after, and there was no one left to fill the
> vacuum. 

I've been accused of being obnoxious and talking too much on occasion. I'm up for the challenge! :)
--
Skot Nelson
skot <at> penguinstorm.com

	"In anything at all, perfection is finally attained not when
	 there is no longer anything to add, but when there
	 is no longer anything to take away."
	      -- Antoine de Saint-Exupéry, Wind, Sand and Stars

------------
2011  IA Summit
March 30 - April 3, 2011
Pre Conference Seminars: March 30-31
IA Summit: April 1-3
Hyatt Regency Convention Center
Denver, CO 
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eric scheid | 4 Jan 2011 06:04
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Re: [Sigia-l] Anyone suggest a better global list?

On 4/1/11 10:24 AM, "Susan Doran" <susandoran <at> hotmail.com> wrote:

> I have studied collaborative leadership and decision-making---and have run and
> convened more than a dozen community projects of varying size and complexity
> (not online). And it's a known phenomenon, and one I've witnessed many times,
> when a particularly loud, large, needy, or aggressive presence is allowed to
> dominate, that one presence will, in fact, drive out some of the most talented
> and interested original members. Because it's no longer fruitful or fulfilling
> to participate.  It's no longer a community of equals.

I've seen it twice now, and was wondering if it was just coincidence or
something more arguable.

e.

------------
2011  IA Summit
March 30 - April 3, 2011
Pre Conference Seminars: March 30-31
IA Summit: April 1-3
Hyatt Regency Convention Center
Denver, CO 
-----
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*Plain text, please; NO Attachments

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eric scheid | 4 Jan 2011 06:05
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Re: [Sigia-l] Anyone suggest a better global list?


On 31/12/2010, at 2:39, Skot Nelson <skot <at> penguinstorm.com
<mailto:skot <at> penguinstorm.com> > wrote:

> That Ziya occasionally stirred up positive discussion was more an accidental
> side effect of the sheer volume of posts than through intent.

Indeed.

Disagreement and criticism are both virtue neutral, in the same way fire is
neither good nor evil. Disagreement can be done in a way that builds and
strengthens a community, and it can be done in a way which fractures,
exhausts, and destroys a community.

FWIW, I've seen other lists die the same way: one hyperactive participant
posts voluminously, obnoxious as all get out, with various defenders
supporting free speech ... and slowly the variety of voices thins out. I was
administrator of one list that went that way, and was thus privy to the list
of subscribers. I graphed the subscriber numbers a few months later and the
decline was quite dramatic and undeniable.

I found a graph I did at the time... http://bit.ly/e7F9zj

You can see that while discussion volume (if not diversity of voices)
continued, that list nonetheless was being decimated behind the scenes.

The noisy individual left soon after, and there was no one left to fill the
vacuum. 

e.
(Continue reading)

eric scheid | 4 Jan 2011 06:06
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[Sigia-l] the role of IAs in Data Journalism?

There's rising interest in a new form of journalism, one which has been
named Data Journalism. This is where journalists delve deep into massive
amounts of data and find the stories about the data. The UK Guardian has
been doing this with the Afghan war logs, those cables, UK health data, etc.

(This is distinct from Computer Aided Journalism which has been around for a
time in that while CAJ is about finding stories _within_ a mass of data, DJ
is about finding the stories _about_ the data.)

So .. massive amounts of data, various forms of taxonomies and indices,
various degrees of data purity, ... sounds like the kind of thing IAs get
involved into. And yet there's nary any discussion of Data Journalism in the
various IA venues. 

My question is what role can IAs have in these activities?

e.

------------
2011  IA Summit
March 30 - April 3, 2011
Pre Conference Seminars: March 30-31
IA Summit: April 1-3
Hyatt Regency Convention Center
Denver, CO 
-----
When replying, please *trim your post* as much as possible.
*Plain text, please; NO Attachments

Searchable Archive at http://www.info-arch.org/lists/sigia-l/
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Gmane