Joan | 4 Oct 2008 13:44
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Updated catalan translation

Hi,

I attached the updated Catalan translation of Kino.

Regards,
Joan
Attachment (ca.po.tar.gz): application/x-gzip, 21 KiB
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Andreas Volz | 6 Oct 2008 21:16

Bluebox effects?

Hello,

is it possible with Kino to use a "BlueBox" effect? That means I record
someone in front of a blue box and then merge it into another scene
that I've recorded before.

If not, do you know a tool (for Linux) that is able to do this?

regards
Andreas

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Dan Sawyer | 6 Oct 2008 21:28

Re: Bluebox effects?

Andreas - 

That would be the "bluescreen" effect - more properly known as "color
keying."

OpenMovieEditor can do this if you have some patience, as can Blender.
There's also a little Java app that can do it, but I forget the name
right now.  You can find more info on this in my LinuxJournal articles
on the topic, listed on the publications page at www.jdsawyer.net

Good luck!
-Dan Sawyer

On Mon, 2008-10-06 at 21:16 +0200, Andreas Volz wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> is it possible with Kino to use a "BlueBox" effect? That means I record
> someone in front of a blue box and then merge it into another scene
> that I've recorded before.
> 
> If not, do you know a tool (for Linux) that is able to do this?
> 
> regards
> Andreas
> 
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Mads Bondo Dydensborg | 6 Oct 2008 22:05
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Re: Bluebox effects?

mandag 06 Oktober 2008 skrev Andreas Volz:
> Hello,
> 
> is it possible with Kino to use a "BlueBox" effect? That means I record
> someone in front of a blue box and then merge it into another scene
> that I've recorded before.

Yes, fx, transition, blue or green chroma key.

Regards

Mads

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CJ Kucera | 7 Oct 2008 16:59

Re: Apply video effects over time?

CJ Kucera wrote:
> > Is there any way to do that, apart from manually plugging in each step?
> 
> Ah, and of course, a few hours after I give up and post to the list, I
> start finding out about keyframes.  I think I'm good to go on this,
> then.  Thanks regardless!

Actually, now that I've actually had the time to start playing around
with this, I see that it's not actually doing what I'd hope it would.  I
can add any number of keyframes to a short period of video, but there's
no interpolation done between the keyframes.  When the rendered video
gets to the next keyframe, which has some varying values for brightness
and gamma, the changes just happen suddenly, starting at that frame.  I
can't seem to get the app to make the transition a smooth one.  Is there
something else I need to be doing to get that to work?  Or will I just
need to use something more powerful like kdenlive, as some other folks
have suggested?

Also, on a semi-related note, it appears that once I've added in some
keyframes, they're often "stuck" in the GUI until I quit and restart.  A
few times now I've had these phantom keyframes which can't be removed
with the keyframe-remove button.  In general the keyframe GUI isn't the
easiest to work with; it would be nice to have some markers on the scrub
bar so that you can easily see where your keyframes are.  I've found the
"next/prev keyframe" buttons to be of not a lot of use, too.

-CJ

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Dan Dennedy | 7 Oct 2008 19:25
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Re: Apply video effects over time?

On Tue, Oct 7, 2008 at 7:59 AM, CJ Kucera <pez <at> apocalyptech.com> wrote:
> CJ Kucera wrote:
>> > Is there any way to do that, apart from manually plugging in each step?
>>
>> Ah, and of course, a few hours after I give up and post to the list, I
>> start finding out about keyframes.  I think I'm good to go on this,
>> then.  Thanks regardless!
>
> Actually, now that I've actually had the time to start playing around
> with this, I see that it's not actually doing what I'd hope it would.  I
> can add any number of keyframes to a short period of video, but there's
> no interpolation done between the keyframes.  When the rendered video
> gets to the next keyframe, which has some varying values for brightness
> and gamma, the changes just happen suddenly, starting at that frame.  I
> can't seem to get the app to make the transition a smooth one.  Is there
> something else I need to be doing to get that to work?  Or will I just
> need to use something more powerful like kdenlive, as some other folks
> have suggested?

Of the effects that use keyframes, the Levels filter is the only one
that does not interpolate. I did this intentionally because in a
correction tool like this, interpolation is not generally that
interesting. It is more interesting to have precise control and more
convenient to not have to set artificial keyframes to suppress
interpolation. If you just need to animate brightness, perhaps the
Fade In or Fade Out, but yeah, that's not gamma.

> Also, on a semi-related note, it appears that once I've added in some
> keyframes, they're often "stuck" in the GUI until I quit and restart.  A
> few times now I've had these phantom keyframes which can't be removed
> with the keyframe-remove button.  In general the keyframe GUI isn't the
> easiest to work with; it would be nice to have some markers on the scrub
> bar so that you can easily see where your keyframes are.  I've found the
> "next/prev keyframe" buttons to be of not a lot of use, too.

I admit there is a flaw where the location of a key frame is saved as
a floating poin, which creates is a mismatch with the actual frame
location. I have also thought about putting markers on the scrub bar.
Even though active development on Kino has ceased, I will see what I
can do to improve this because it really is buggy. Maybe I can add an
interpolate option to the levels filter as well.

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CJ Kucera | 8 Oct 2008 05:57

Re: Apply video effects over time?

Dan Dennedy wrote:
> Of the effects that use keyframes, the Levels filter is the only one
> that does not interpolate. I did this intentionally because in a
> correction tool like this, interpolation is not generally that
> interesting. It is more interesting to have precise control and more
> convenient to not have to set artificial keyframes to suppress
> interpolation. If you just need to animate brightness, perhaps the
> Fade In or Fade Out, but yeah, that's not gamma.

Ah, okay, that makes sense.  I should be able to cope.  How hard would
it be to code up interpolation for that filter?  Logically it doesn't
sound difficult; perhaps I'll take a look at the code to see if it's
something I could just bang together myself.  Then again, if Kino's not
really being developed anymore, I may be better off with something else
anyway...  Regardless, thanks for the reply!

FWIW, I was looking for that functionality because I'm editing up a
video where the camera tends to go back and forth between a bright,
sunny outdoors scene to inside a tent which is much darker, and the
camera itself couldn't compensate for it because the interior scenes
were still pretty backlit.  Gamma seems to be the 'easiest' way to
correct for that, and I had been hoping to have some gradual changes
instead of just a hard cut.

> Even though active development on Kino has ceased, I will see what I
> can do to improve this because it really is buggy. Maybe I can add an
> interpolate option to the levels filter as well.

If you don't mind, of course.  If you consider the project pretty much
at a standstill, I wouldn't want to suddenly barge in here and dictate
what you should be working on.  :)  I can certainly cope if the
functionality's simply not present.

Thanks again,

CJ

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elliott-brennan | 8 Oct 2008 15:43
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Re: Apply video effects over time

Hi there,

About keyframes...would you mind point me in the 
correct direction as to the information/technique 
you found?

Much appreciated.

Patrick

pez <at> apocalyptech.com wrote:
 >I'm wondering if it's possible to apply a video 
effect so that it
applies over a period of time, instead of instantly.

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Dan Dennedy | 8 Oct 2008 18:27
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Re: Apply video effects over time

On Wed, Oct 8, 2008 at 6:43 AM, elliott-brennan
<elliottbrennan <at> gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi there,
>
> About keyframes...would you mind point me in the
> correct direction as to the information/technique
> you found?

http://www.kinodv.org/help/keyframing

The same information is also available within the application help
(F1), which is context-sensitive. It will not know you want to know
you want help on key frames, but it does know you are in FX and takes
you to a topic on FX, where the topic on keyframing is conveniently
within reach (hint: under Choose a Video Effect).

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elliott-brennan | 9 Oct 2008 00:36
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Re: Apply video effects over time

Hi CJ,

Thanks for the detailed explanation. I'm going to 
check it would and I'll get back to you either way.

Many thanks for taking the time. Much appreciated.

Regards,

Patrick

CJ Kucera wrote:
>> About keyframes...would you mind point me in the correct direction as to 
>> the information/technique you found?
> 
> Sure, they're mostly just pieced together from a couple of errant lines
> hidden in the online Kino manual...  Just select the clip you want to
> work on, then go the FX tab and select a video filter you want to use.
> Not all of the filters support keyframes, so if you wanted to play
> around with it, I guess just choose Levels for now, since I know that
> that works (though it doesn't actually do interpolation, as you may have
> noticed if you're following that thread).
> 
> Once you've chosen Levels, you should be able to change the various
> values there if you want; you'll notice that the position marker on the
> scrub bar at the bottom is all the way at the beginning of the clip.  If
> you move the position marker to somewhere else on the scrub bar, you'll
> see the Levels controls grey out so you can't use them, but the little
> minus-sign button to the right of the scrub bar should have turned into
> a plus sign.  If you press that, it'll add in a keyframe, and you should
> be able to put in a new set of Levels values.
> 
> Then if you move the position marker again, you can add some more
> keyframes.  As I mentioned earlier in the thread, it looks like the
> keyframe behavior in Kino is somewhat buggy, and removing keyframes once
> you've put them in place isn't always possible, so if something seems
> "stuck" in there, you'll probably have to quit the application and go
> back in.
> 
> Anyway, make sense?
> 
> -CJ
> 

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