-----Original Message-----
From: stecla1-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org
Sent: Mon, 22 Apr 2013 09:58:35 -0500
To: linuxham-hHKSG33TihhbjbujkaE4pw@public.gmane.org
Subject: Re: [linuxham] Re: fldigi and eqsl.cc

 

John,
David,

I just did some more testing.
It doesn't matter where the CRLF is in the string. middle or end is the same result. It is not logged at eqsl.
If the carriage return is inside the <EQSL:[bla bla bla]> it doesn't work either.

John, I just tested your macro and it works great.
However it ONLY WORKS if the eqsl configuration tab in fldigi has no carriage returns in it.

Steve
KK4NNH

On Apr 22, 2013, at 9:17 AM, "John Wiener" <jawod-rDkNP/OoUoU@public.gmane.org> wrote:

> tnx fer QSO <NAME>, 73, Have fun and good DX to you. eQSL is auto
> <ZDT> <CALL> de <MYCALL> sk <EQSL><LOG><CLRLOG><RX>

 

  I think the single biggest problem I'm seeing here is taking things in order.  If you're a linux newbie, your task is not to learn how to do radio tasks on a Raspberry Pi.  Your task is to learn Linux.  Forget the Pi, start by learning linux.  How it works.  Why it works.  Why it is the way it is.  Learn it on a virtual machine, a dual-booted machine, a dedicated machine, or on the Pi itself, it doesn't matter.  To a degree that matters to the newcomer, they're all the same.  Learn one of the eleventy flavors of linux, AT&T System V, or FreeBSD.  Again, to the raw newbie, it doesn't matter, they're essentially the same.  But start by learning linux before you worry about what you're going to *DO* with linux.  Only then is there a point in learning how to solve specific problems.  Like packet radio networking.  Or interfacing hardware to the Pi.

  Much of the discussion to date goes something like this:

  "How do I get to the supermarket to buy beer?"

  "Drive north down Elm Street, turn right on Mulberry, and it's on your left.  Here, you can borrow my car, but it's a 5-speed, can you drive a stick?"

  "I've only ever ridden a bicycle, can you teach me how to drive?"

  Nothing whatsoever wrong with that.  Nothing.  Zero.  We all started there.  But there's a progression of steps that need to be followed.  Learn how to steer.  How to shift.  How to buy gas.  What the laws are.  How to navigate streets.  How to deal with other drivers.  Rights-of-way.  Those are all tasks that need to be learned before you attack the problem of buying your beer.  Learn to drive before you worry about making trips to the store.

  You also need to understand who you're asking questions of.  If you ask Michael Schumacher how to turn left, you'll get a discussion involving traction, tire temperature, humidity, mass, speed, and strategy for blocking the guy behind you while you're doing all of this.  If you ask my 16-year-old son (who just learned to drive in the last few months), you'll get an answer that involves slowing down, looking for traffic, and turning the steering wheel carefully to the left while keeping an eye on the other cars in the intersection.  My son's answer will be far more useful to a non-driver than Michael Schumacher's.  Not because Michael is a pretentious ass or is unwilling to help, but because he learned to drive so long ago and drives at a completely different level than most that all of those low-level tasks have been abstracted to the point that not only does he not realize he's even doing them, he'd probably have trouble explaining the details and remembering what it was like to learn it.  And so it is with the expert Unix/Linux/BSD user answering questions from the most basic beginner.  To him, "edit this file" is akin to telling a typical driver to "turn left".  The fact that he doesn't explain each vi keystroke to the beginner is not arrogance, it's that it never even occurs to him that this is a skill, as it's long been pushed to his subconscious skill set.

  There are plenty of mentors here.  There are plenty of people who are more than willing to help.  I am one of them.  But bear in mind that who you ask (ie, how many years of experience) will affect the answers you receive, and the assumptions made about what is and is not automatic for you.  How you ask will equally affect the answers.  Here's an example:

Q:  "How do I add an alias for a host so I don't have to keep typing the IP address?"

And here's a series of answers I might give, depending on the assumptions I make about your skillset (and/or how you ask the question, and/or how long I have available to type the response):

A:  "Stick it in DNS." or maybe "Stick it in hosts."

A:  "Add it to /etc/hosts"

A:  "Edit your /etc/hosts file and put it at the bottom in the same format as the entries already there."

A:  "Open a terminal make sure you have nano installed.  Type 'which nano' and see if you get a result.  If you don't, type 'sudo apt-get install nano', then enter your password and answer 'y' to the question (if there is one).  Then type 'sudo nano /etc/hosts'.  When the file opens, use your down arrow key until you get to the bottom of the file..."  (you can see how this would go on for about two more pages).

  They're all right answers, they're all useful answers, they come from different sources and are targeted at different skill sets.  The first answer is akin to "Down the street on the left."  The last answer is "Let me teach you how to drive."  There's only so many hours in a day for hobbies, and just like every newbie doesn't have infinite time to learn linux, every expert doesn't have infinite time to teach it to you.  But there is undoubtedly a middle ground.  Take a little responsibility.  Buy a book on Linux.  Forget you're trying to do ham radio networking, and learn to use the tool between you and that goal first, before you try to use it.  Like any power tool, there's a learning curve.  I, and many others are here to help you along the way.  But learning Linux is work.  Hard work.  But very rewarding work.  Once you're on your way to knowing this tool, you can solve more and more problems more and more easily.  My 16-year-old installed Linux for the very first time on his laptop yesterday.  He installed Mint (a derivative of Ubuntu, which in turn is a derivative of Debian).  As of today, he's got the system updated to the very latest code, has installed dropbox, chrome, and some other tools, and has synced his iPod to it, and is playing flash games, all with nothing for references other than google.  It's not rocket surgery, it just takes some time and effort.

  So please, ask your questions.  But be patient with the answers.  Technical answers are not meant to be arrogant or condescending.  It's much more likely that they're just calibrated to the wrong level of skill.  And please please please, make it a goal to learn the tool before you worry about what you're going to build with that tool.  You'll be much happier.  We'll help you get there.  But it does take time and effort.

On Fri, Apr 19, 2013 at 6:59 AM, w4jpa <abjarvis-Wuw85uim5zDR7s880joybQ@public.gmane.org> wrote:

 

The Cambridge guys were harking back to the late 70's when Sinclair wanted every kid to have computer and built his little Z80 based. membrane keyboard thingy that used the TV as a monitor - and it worked. We had a couple of generations of hackers (in the good sense) in the UK. And all this was augmented by the "BBC" computer later. But today the real system knowledge of entrants to computer science classes seems pretty dismal - hence their original build of 10,000 was for these folks. But then we hams (and about a million others) wanted said device. I love it. Best hack I've had in years
G4JPA / W4JPA

--- In Raspberry_Pi_4-Ham_RADIO-hHKSG33TihhbjbujkaE4pw@public.gmane.org, "Stephen" <squirrox <at> ...> wrote:
>
>
> Hi Guys,
>
> I find it quite interesting that the guys that designed the Pi targeted the UK educational community so that kids could learn computer science. However I fear that LINUX is too complicated for most teachers to teach or most kids to learn. We shall see.
>
> I think it is very sound advice to start off with something simpler, more Novice Licence style then graduate to LINUX when you are comfortable with taking on a new adventure. Personally I like the Arduino for learning with. There is a huge amount of information on projects available on the internet. The Arduino does not use an operating system, which IMHO is perfect for the majority of ham applications, as your programs directly interface with the hardware. There are quite a few Ham apps available for things like Beacons, Keyers, WSPR.
>
> I also like the Ti MSP430 Launchpad very much. But for a beginner only with the Energia software environment as the Ti Development tools are large and complex to understand without experience. All Energia does is make it possible to program the MSP430 Launchpad as if it were an Arduino.
>
> So, my advice is to learn to walk before you can run. So :-
>
> Get a copy of a small and very friendly book called "Getting started with Arduino" by Masssimo Banzi published by O'Reilly, it will be the best $12.99 you have ever spent on a book.
>
> Get an Arduino board from somewhere like here https://www.sparkfun.com/products/11286
>
> and work through the book. Then take a look at some of the work other people have done with such a simple set up. One nice beginners project is to hook up a GPS RX and an LCD display so you can display the time and location.
>
>
> This should give you enough of a "feel" fro the subject to then approach more complex systems like the Pi.
>
> Thats it from me on the subject.
>
> 73s from a cold England,
>
> Steve G0XAR
>
>

> --- In Raspberry_Pi_4-Ham_RADIO-hHKSG33TihhbjbujkaE4pw@public.gmane.org, "MattB" <mbrauer <at> > wrote:
> >
> > Nicely put, Ray.
> >
> > I think that this frustration with Linux among hams was probably inevitable. In a lot of ways, the tasks and experiments that hams want to pursue require the HARDEST parts of Linux. It needs to be remembered that Linux, like Unix, was designed to be a multi-user operating system, with a high premium on facilitating application development. It was not intended as a hobbyist platform the way the Arduino was, for example.
> >
> > Many of us take for granted a lot of the basic infrastructure of Linux. We learned about programming through Kernighan and Ritchie's excellent book "The Unix Programming Environment" (still relevant for Linux!), and it's sort of second nature in a way that Windows and OSX are not.
> >
> > Even so, the complexities of system programming are difficult enough that many of us who know Linux well still have to exert some effort to get something like the TNC-X working correctly. The main advantage that we have is that we don't second-guess ourselves on the basics of the filesystem and OS generally.
> >
> > I think that those that are new to the Pi should ask themselves what their goals are. If it's to learn Linux, then I'd recommend backing off from the project of integrating the TNC-X, and going back to basics. I happen to think that this is a useful project in and of itself.
> >
> > If you're more interested in hardware projects, I'd suggest moving to the Arduino or (my favorite) the MSP430a (available for something like $4.50, shipping included.) There is a lot that can be accomplished with these platforms, and they're really better for real-time applications anyway.
> >
> > If you're determined to make the Pi work for your hardware application, just know that the road is long and requires some patience, and that there are a large number of intermediate steps to take and skills to master along the way. Take it slow, and take it easy on yourself.
> >
> > Good luck!
> >
> > -73-
> > Matt KC2O
> >
>

--
-=jeff=-