Proposed change to RT code

I was working with the RT code, and found that the present set-up does
not allow changing the RT time-scale while the sim is running.  If you
change the value of _e.rel_speed in the current setup, the simulation
will either wait several seconds to resume, or run events as fast as
possible (no real-time synch) until the clock 'catches up' with the
current real-time.

I have a gui with the option of watching the sim in real time, and a
slider to compress the sim-time.  I wanted to change the slider as the
sim runs and have the sim speed up or slow down immediately.  The
following diff shows my changes to SimulationRT.py (version 1.71) to
make this happen.  In short, I keep track of rtlast and stlast, the last
timw periods at which the sim and rt were synchronized.  In _e._nextev I
use rtlast and stlast to calculate the real-time delay until the next
event to run.

Here is a udiff of the changed SimulationRT:

--- SimulationRT.py Wed Jun 14 14:28:24 2006
+++ SimulationRT1_71_rcr.py Tue Dec 12 11:57:28 2006
@@ -119,14 +119,19 @@
 False=0
 condQ=[]

+## Utility functions for real-time functionality
 if sys.platform=="win32":  #take care of differences in clock accuracy
     wallclock=time.clock
 else:
     wallclock=time.time
-rtstart=wallclock()

Re: Proposed change to RT code

Bob,
This sounds like a great improvement. Let me test it. If I may, I will
include it in a future version of SimPy, giving you due credit, of course.

We are currently busy finalizing version 1.8, so your improvement may have
to wait till 1.8.1.

Doing anything with SimPy?

Regards,

Klaus

> -----Original Message-----
> From: simpy-users-bounces <at> lists.sourceforge.net
> [mailto:simpy-users-bounces <at> lists.sourceforge.net] On Behalf Of 
> RCRamsdell <at> gldd.com
> Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2006 7:08 PM
> To: simpy-users <at> lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: [Simpy-users] Proposed change to RT code
> 
> I was working with the RT code, and found that the present set-up does 
> not allow changing the RT time-scale while the sim is running.  If you 
> change the value of _e.rel_speed in the current setup, the simulation 
> will either wait several seconds to resume, or run events as fast as 
> possible (no real-time synch) until the clock 'catches up' with the 
> current real-time.
> 
> I have a gui with the option of watching the sim in real time, and a 
> slider to compress the sim-time.  I wanted to change the slider as the 

Re: Proposed change to RT code

Bob,
I tested it and it works beautifully (not that I ever doubted that :=) ).

I will try to put the change it into SimPy version 1.8, but I may have to
postpone it to 1.8.1.

Regards,

Klaus

> -----Original Message-----
> From: simpy-users-bounces <at> lists.sourceforge.net 
> [mailto:simpy-users-bounces <at> lists.sourceforge.net] On Behalf 
> Of RCRamsdell <at> gldd.com
> Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2006 7:08 PM
> To: simpy-users <at> lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: [Simpy-users] Proposed change to RT code
> 
> I was working with the RT code, and found that the present 
> set-up does not allow changing the RT time-scale while the 
> sim is running.  If you change the value of _e.rel_speed in 
> the current setup, the simulation will either wait several 
> seconds to resume, or run events as fast as possible (no 
> real-time synch) until the clock 'catches up' with the 
> current real-time.
> 
> I have a gui with the option of watching the sim in real 
> time, and a slider to compress the sim-time.  I wanted to 
> change the slider as the sim runs and have the sim speed up 
> or slow down immediately.  The following diff shows my 

FW: Potential legal problem??

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FW: Potential legal problem??

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Re: FW: Potential legal problem??

With SimPy's prior use of the term, it's hard to see that MathWorks could 
have a valid infringement case.  However, valid or not, MathWorks probably 
has a big enough war chest to cause trouble if they choose to do so.

\ Steve

Klaus Muller wrote:
> For background information: we added SimEvents synchronization constructs to SimPy on 5 September
2004. 
> 
> MathWorks advertised SimEvents 1 for the first time in November 2005.    
> 
> Klaus Muller
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* Klaus Muller [mailto:kgmuller <at> xs4all.nl]
> *Sent:* Monday, December 18, 2006 3:08 PM
> *To:* 'simpy-users <at> lists.sourceforge.net'
> *Subject:* FW: Potential legal problem??
> 
> All:
> Bob brought up a worrying issue here.
>  
> What do you all think? Do/could we have a problem here?
>  
> Klaus Muller
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* The Helmbolds [mailto:helmrp <at> yahoo.com]
> *Sent:* Monday, December 18, 2006 12:47 PM
> *To:* Klaus Muller
> *Cc:* Tony Vignaux
> *Subject:* RE: Potential legal problem??
> 
> Yes, the terms are not identical. But that does not mean we can escape 
> trademark infringement suits and judgments.
>  
> For example, I surely would be the target of a trademark infringement 
> suit -- and surely would lose it -- if I were to market a beverage 
> called "KokaKola". I doubt that the difference in spelling between that 
> and "Coca-Cola" would make much difference.
>  
> Even if instead I used "KokaKola" as the name for a nifty computer 
> program, I'm sure the Coca-Cola company would still come after me for 
> infringement. And they very probably would win in court. Even they lost, 
> they would appeal ... and appeal ... and appeal ... .
>  
> Legal things get dicey. Some issues may depend on the specific date 
> that MathWorks registered their "SimEvents" trademark, and the specific 
> date you first used the term "SimEvent". But, of course, you did not 
> register it as a trademark. And then things may depend on the specific 
> provisions of GPL, or whatever SimPy is licensed as. 
>  
> Sorry for the trouble this may cause. Hope I'm dead wrong and that there 
> really is no problem here. 
> 
> 
> */Klaus Muller <kgmuller <at> xs4all.nl>/* wrote:
> 
>     Bob,
>     maybe this is a problem, maybe not. SimEvent is a component, not a
>     system, and in SimPy, we use the term SimEvent, not SimEvent_s_*.*
>     ** 
>     *Klaus*
> 
>         ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>         *From:* The Helmbolds [mailto:helmrp <at> yahoo.com]
>         *Sent:* Monday, December 18, 2006 11:17 AM
>         *To:* Klaus Muller
>         *Cc:* Tony Vignaux
>         *Subject:* Potential legal problem??
> 
>         As I am not a lawyer, I do not know whether the following is a
>         potential legal problem or not.
>          
>         In searching the web for glossaries on simulations, I stumbled
>         across a listing for SimEvents(TM). It is a discrete event
>         simulation system marketed by The MathWorks (the same outfit
>         that markets MATLAB). I was struck by the similarity in names.
>         Are we infringing on their trademark every time we refer to
>         SimEvents in the SimPy context? I don't know. 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 

--

-- 
Steven H. Rogers, Ph.D., steve <at> shrogers.com
Weblog: http://shrogers.com/weblog
"He who refuses to do arithmetic is doomed to talk nonsense."
-- John McCarthy

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Re: FW: Potential legal problem??

"Klaus Muller" <kgmuller <at> xs4all.nl> writes:

> What do you all think? Do/could we have a problem here?

I am _definitely_ not a lawyer, and you may want to consult one
experienced in such areas, but there's reason to think you _may_ be
okay.  I _think_ one can have the same trademark as another, as long as
the uses aren't confusing.  For example, I think there was an Opel
Vectra (a car) and an HP Vectra (a PC); it's unlikely you'd confuse the
two.

Bill  
--

-- 
Bill Harris                      http://facilitatedsystems.com/weblog/
Facilitated Systems                              Everett, WA 98208 USA
http://facilitatedsystems.com/                  phone: +1 425 337-5541

Re: FW: Potential legal problem??

Another thought is to contact the Free Software Foundation.  They could 
provide some information and possibly recommend an intellectual property 
lawyer.  They may know of some that provide advice to open source projects 
on a pro bono basis.

Trademark cases seem to be highly individual.  There's a new startup called 
IntellaSys that's developing a multi-core processor for embedded 
applications.  The original name was IntelaSys, and they added the second 
'l' at Intel's request to reduce the similarity in names.  Sometimes it 
doesn't take much of a change to make people happy, and we don't even know 
if MathWorks is unhappy yet.

\ Steve

Bill Harris wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> "Klaus Muller" <kgmuller <at> xs4all.nl> writes:
> 
>> What do you all think? Do/could we have a problem here?
> 
> I am _definitely_ not a lawyer, and you may want to consult one
> experienced in such areas, but there's reason to think you _may_ be
> okay.  I _think_ one can have the same trademark as another, as long as
> the uses aren't confusing.  For example, I think there was an Opel
> Vectra (a car) and an HP Vectra (a PC); it's unlikely you'd confuse the
> two.
> 
> Bill  
> - -- 
> Bill Harris                      http://facilitatedsystems.com/weblog/
> Facilitated Systems                              Everett, WA 98208 USA
> http://facilitatedsystems.com/                  phone: +1 425 337-5541
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.4.3 (MingW32)
> Comment: For more information, see http://www.gnupg.org
> 
> iD8DBQFFh2b83J3HaQTDvd8RAgKxAJ92orBfn1Guf0zUb5cjfwwQUqM3AACfeABC
> X9VmtIk36cvFgBWBF+oPSZU=
> =v0UH
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

--

-- 
Steven H. Rogers, Ph.D., steve <at> shrogers.com
Weblog: http://shrogers.com/weblog
"He who refuses to do arithmetic is doomed to talk nonsense."
-- John McCarthy

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Re: FW: Potential legal problem??

Bill,
Thank you for input. You may be right.

Klaus 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Bill Harris [mailto:bill_harris <at> facilitatedsystems.com] 
> Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2006 5:14 AM
> To: Klaus Muller
> Cc: simpy-users <at> lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: Re: [Simpy-users] FW: Potential legal problem??
> 
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> "Klaus Muller" <kgmuller <at> xs4all.nl> writes:
> 
> > What do you all think? Do/could we have a problem here?
> 
> I am _definitely_ not a lawyer, and you may want to consult 
> one experienced in such areas, but there's reason to think 
> you _may_ be okay.  I _think_ one can have the same trademark 
> as another, as long as the uses aren't confusing.  For 
> example, I think there was an Opel Vectra (a car) and an HP 
> Vectra (a PC); it's unlikely you'd confuse the two.
> 
> Bill
> - -- 
> Bill Harris                      http://facilitatedsystems.com/weblog/
> Facilitated Systems                              Everett, WA 98208 USA
> http://facilitatedsystems.com/                  phone: +1 425 337-5541
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.4.3 (MingW32)
> Comment: For more information, see http://www.gnupg.org
> 
> iD8DBQFFh2b83J3HaQTDvd8RAgKxAJ92orBfn1Guf0zUb5cjfwwQUqM3AACfeABC
> X9VmtIk36cvFgBWBF+oPSZU=
> =v0UH
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> 
> 

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Re: FW: Potential legal problem??

Steve,
Thank you for your inputs. I will contact the FSF with a request for
help/advice.

We can of course consider renaming SimEvent in future releases. My concern
is for the users - they would have to do a global rearch and replace in
their SimPy scripts. I could have the interpreter generate advisory messages
like "SimEvent replaced by xxx -- please, change your script" to help users
of SimEvent with existing versions. 

Before making such change, we will poll the SimPy community.

Klaus 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: simpy-users-bounces <at> lists.sourceforge.net 
> [mailto:simpy-users-bounces <at> lists.sourceforge.net] On Behalf 
> Of Steven H. Rogers
> Sent: Tuesday, December 19, 2006 3:01 PM
> To: 'Simpy-Users List'
> Subject: Re: [Simpy-users] FW: Potential legal problem??
> 
> Another thought is to contact the Free Software Foundation.  
> They could provide some information and possibly recommend an 
> intellectual property lawyer.  They may know of some that 
> provide advice to open source projects on a pro bono basis.
> 
> Trademark cases seem to be highly individual.  There's a new 
> startup called IntellaSys that's developing a multi-core 
> processor for embedded applications.  The original name was 
> IntelaSys, and they added the second 'l' at Intel's request 
> to reduce the similarity in names.  Sometimes it doesn't take 
> much of a change to make people happy, and we don't even know 
> if MathWorks is unhappy yet.
> 
> \ Steve
> 
> Bill Harris wrote:
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > Hash: SHA1
> > 
> > "Klaus Muller" <kgmuller <at> xs4all.nl> writes:
> > 
> >> What do you all think? Do/could we have a problem here?
> > 
> > I am _definitely_ not a lawyer, and you may want to consult one 
> > experienced in such areas, but there's reason to think you _may_ be 
> > okay.  I _think_ one can have the same trademark as 
> another, as long 
> > as the uses aren't confusing.  For example, I think there 
> was an Opel 
> > Vectra (a car) and an HP Vectra (a PC); it's unlikely you'd confuse 
> > the two.
> > 
> > Bill
> > - -- 
> > Bill Harris                      
> http://facilitatedsystems.com/weblog/
> > Facilitated Systems                              Everett, 
> WA 98208 USA
> > http://facilitatedsystems.com/                  phone: +1 
> 425 337-5541
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> > Version: GnuPG v1.4.3 (MingW32)
> > Comment: For more information, see http://www.gnupg.org
> > 
> > iD8DBQFFh2b83J3HaQTDvd8RAgKxAJ92orBfn1Guf0zUb5cjfwwQUqM3AACfeABC
> > X9VmtIk36cvFgBWBF+oPSZU=
> > =v0UH
> > -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> 
> 
> --
> Steven H. Rogers, Ph.D., steve <at> shrogers.com
> Weblog: http://shrogers.com/weblog
> "He who refuses to do arithmetic is doomed to talk nonsense."
> -- John McCarthy
> 
> 
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> -----------
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