From Pycon organizers, a request

Laura Creighton <lac <at> strakt.com>
From Pycon organizers, a request
2003-11-01 15:24:37 GMT

Should I tell them that we are coming?

Laura

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Return-Path: pycon-organizers-bounces <at> python.org
Delivery-Date: Wed Oct 29 08:17:41 2003
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 2003 18:07:55 -0800
From: "Brett C." <bac <at> OCF.Berkeley.EDU>
To: sholden <at> holdenweb.com
Subject: Re: [Pycon-organizers] Call for Papers

Steve Holden wrote:
> The Call for Papers must go out this week, and I will be pre-announcing
> the registration URL at the same time (Trevor: please make sure there's
> an attractive "real soon now" page - maybe webmaven can help with
> graphics id required?). Can all pycon-organizers please make their
> suggestions in the next day or two?
> 
> We should include a list of general topics as well as perhaps some
> specific suggestions for papers that we would like to see included in
> the schedule.
> 

I would love to here someone present on PyPy.  Are how about Numarray 
and how that will be different from Numeric?  This then segues into 
scientific uses of Python.  Educational uses of Python is always nice.

OK, that is all the dribble from my brain at the moment.

Re: LLVM and PyPy

> > We already have the capability of doing function-at-a-time code
> > generation: what is basic-block at a time generation used for?  How do you
> > do global optimizations like register allocation?
>
> It is central to Psyco, the Python just-in-time specializer
> (http://psyco.sourceforge.net) whose techniques we plan to integrate with
> PyPy.  Unlike other environments like Self, which collects execution profiles

Ok, makes sense.

> > That would be great!  We've tossed around the idea of creating C bindings
> > for LLVM, which would make interfacing from other languages easier than

> Well, as the C++ API is nice and clean it is probably simpler to bind it
> directly to Python.  We would probably go for Boost-Python, which makes C++
> objects directly accessible to Python.  But nothing is sure about this; maybe

Ok, I didn't know the boost bindings allowed calling C++ code from python.
In retrospect, that makes a lot of sense.  :)

> driving LLVM from LLVM code is closer to our needs.  Is there a specific
> interface to do that?

Sure, what exactly do you mean by driving LLVM code from LLVM?  The main
interface for executing LLVM code is the ExecutionEngine interface:
http://llvm.cs.uiuc.edu/doxygen/classExecutionEngine.html

There are concrete implementations of this interface for the JIT and for
the interpreter.  Note that we will probably need to add some additional
methods to this class to enable all of the functionality that you need

Re: [LLVMdev] Re: LLVM and PyPy

Hello Chris,

On Sun, Nov 02, 2003 at 10:56:34AM -0600, Chris Lattner wrote:
> > driving LLVM from LLVM code is closer to our needs.  Is there a specific
> > interface to do that?
> 
> Sure, what exactly do you mean by driving LLVM code from LLVM?

Writing LLVM code that contains calls to the LLVM framework's compilation
routines.  Sorry if this is a newbie question, but are we supposed to be able
to use all the classes like ExecutionEngine from LLVM code produced by our
tools (as opposed to by the C++ front-end) ? Or would that be a real hack ?

In other words, can we write a JIT in LLVM code ? I understand this is not
what you have in mind for Java, for example, where you'd rather write the JIT
*for* but not *in* LLVM code.  In PyPy we are considering generating different 
versions of the low-level code:

The first is a regular Python interpreter (I), similar to the general design
of interpreters written in C.  It is the direct translation of the Python
source code of PyPy.

Now consider a clever meta-interpreter (M) that interprets (I) with as
argument an input user program (P) in Python.  Note that we include the user
program's runtime arguments in (P).  Using feed-back, (M) could specialize (I)
to some partial information about (P); a typical choice is the user code and
the type of the user variables, but in general it is a more dynamic part of
(P).  Now consider (M) itself and specialize it statically for its first
argument (I) for optimization.  The result is efficient low-level code that
can dynamically instrument and compile any user program (P).  This efficient

Re: [LLVMdev] Re: LLVM and PyPy

> On Sun, Nov 02, 2003 at 10:56:34AM -0600, Chris Lattner wrote:
> > > driving LLVM from LLVM code is closer to our needs.  Is there a specific
> > > interface to do that?
> >
> > Sure, what exactly do you mean by driving LLVM code from LLVM?
>
> Writing LLVM code that contains calls to the LLVM framework's compilation
> routines.

Oh, I see.  :)

> Sorry if this is a newbie question, but are we supposed to be able to
> use all the classes like ExecutionEngine from LLVM code produced by our
> tools (as opposed to by the C++ front-end) ? Or would that be a real
> hack ? In other words, can we write a JIT in LLVM code ?

This is not something that we had considered or planned to do, but there
is no reason it shouldn't work.  LLVM compiled code follows the same ABI
as the G++ compiler, so you can even mix and match translation units or
libraries.

> I understand this is not what you have in mind for Java, for example,
> where you'd rather write the JIT *for* but not *in* LLVM code.

Well, that's sort-of true. You can ask Alkis for more details, but I think
that he's writing the Java->LLVM converter in Java, which will mean that
the converter is going to be compiled to LLVM as well.  He's doing this
work in the context of the Jikes RVM.

> In PyPy we are considering generating different versions of the

Question from an old friend of mine ....

My friend Geoff Collyer just read the PyPy proposal.

He said this:

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To: lac <at> strakt.com
Subject: Re: PyPy
From: Geoff Collyer <geoff <at> collyer.net>
Date: Wed, 5 Nov 2003 17:26:22 -0800
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It appears that compiler theory has advanced quite a bit while I
wasn't looking.  How much of what you propose has already been
implemented at least once?  How much of the rest (unimplemented) is
covered by existing compiler theory?

------- End of Forwarded Message

Introducing Richard Emslie

Dear PyPy-bakers,

how do I write a nice introduction? Here a try...

Last time in Charleroix, I met Richard Emslie, right
before my Stackless talk. He was quite interested
and later implemented auto-scheduling for SLP 3.0.

He is working for the Dublin department of a larger
reinsurance company, which makes heavy use of Python.

Last week, I was invited to Dublin as a consultant,
in order to do training for them on how to build
Python, extensions and GUIs under Windows. It was
a very pleasant experience, both the department and
working with Richard.

There is a lot of interest to see PyPy succeed, and
he may be sent to the next PyPy sprint, which I
would appreciate very much. Richard is new to PyPy,
but very interested and learning quickly. He has
tough knowledge of Python and knows C very well,
working under Linux most of the time.

Still I'm not sure how to do a nice introduction,
but that's all, folks. I'll leave the rest to Richard.

cheers - chris

--

-- 

Annotations

Hello everybody,

Just got an AnnotationHeap class in a shape that starts to look right. See
pypy.translator.annheap.

This is part of implementing doc/translator/annotation.txt.  Anybody
interested in joining the effort is welcome to #pypy 

A bientot,

Armin.

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from comp.lang.python.announce -- Helix encryption

This might be interesting to use as a pypy performance test, if we
can get the python version acceptably fast. 

------- Forwarded Message

From: "James Makela" <jamesm249 <at> comcast.net>
Newsgroups: comp.lang.python.announce
Subject: ANN: xhelix encryption/authentication module
    There was recently an article named "Helix: Fast Encryption and
Authentication" by Niels Ferguson and Bruce Schneier, published in the Nov
2003 issue of Dr Dobbs Journal.  In it was a module written in python to
implement this encryption method.  This module works very well, but is too
slow to be used in any practical application.
    xhelix is a python C extension implementing Helix encryption and
authentication.  It is used in the same way as the Helix module descibed in
the article, but runs many, many times faster.

The project resides at:
    http://sourceforge.net/projects/xhelix/

The current version is 1.0 and is released under LGPL

if you have any questions, mailto:
    jamesm249 <at> users.sourceforge.net

- -- 
http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-announce-list

        Support the Python Software Foundation:

Re: from comp.lang.python.announce -- Helix encryption

Hello Laura,

On Sun, Nov 16, 2003 at 06:40:51PM +0100, Laura Creighton wrote:
> This might be interesting to use as a pypy performance test, if we
> can get the python version acceptably fast.

Could be.  I tried Psyco on it, but it doesn't do better than 2x the plain
Python speed.  This is because this module does unsigned 32-bit arithmetic
using longs.  Well I could enhance Psyco to try and encode longs in a single
unsigned 32-bit machine word if they fit...  The result would certainly be 
quite fast.

But anyway I guess that's not what you had in mind; we could try to
genpyrex-ify the module.  Would probably need some tweaking in the Python 
source, but could be interesting to try indeed.

A bientot,

Armin

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