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Neal Norwitz | 1 Feb 2008 06:42
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Re: Upcoming 2.5.2 release

On Jan 31, 2008 1:42 AM, Jesus Cea <jcea <at> argo.es> wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> Martin v. Löwis wrote:
> |> As current bsddb module maintainer, I was wondering if 2.5.2 will
> |> support BerkeleyDB 4.6 :-?.
> |
> | Maybe I'm misunderstanding the question - whom are asking?
> | If me - Python 2.5.2 will essentially do what the maintenance branch
> | does currently.
>
> I beg your pardon. My role is recent (a week) and I'm still learning my
> way thru procedures and conventions :-).
>
> Current bsddb module in 2.5.1 supports up to BerkeleyDB 4.5. There is
> support for 4.6 in trunk (future 2.6, I guess) and I'm working in a
> private branch at the moment, since I have no commit access to python
> repository. That private version is intented to be merged into python
> 2.6 by Greg, when time comes.

Note that db 4.6 might be the cause of some crashes on the buildbots:
  http://www.python.org/dev/buildbot/all/

I asked to have it disabled on one platform (sparc).  I haven't
checked the results and I'm not sure if Greg has either.  Greg checked
in a change to setup.py on trunk to disable 4.6 to see if the crashes
go away.

~5 buildbots had crashes in bsddb or related code with 4.6 before the
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Nicko van Someren | 1 Feb 2008 15:43
Subject: Re: Tracker marks my messages as spam :-)

Perhaps it has to do with the low signal to noise ratio of your  
messages...

	Nicko

On 31 Jan 2008, at 10:07, Jesus Cea wrote:

> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
>>>> This will be my last email today, I don't want to waste (more of)  
>>>> your
>>>> *valuable* time.
>
> http://bugs.python.org/issue1391
> http://bugs.python.org/msg61892
>
> - --
> Jesus Cea Avion                         _/_/      _/_/_/        _/_/_/
> jcea <at> argo.es http://www.argo.es/~jcea/ _/_/    _/_/  _/_/    _/_/  _/ 
> _/
> jabber / xmpp:jcea <at> jabber.org         _/_/    _/_/          _/_/_/_/_/
> ~                               _/_/  _/_/    _/_/          _/_/  _/_/
> "Things are not so easy"      _/_/  _/_/    _/_/  _/_/    _/_/  _/_/
> "My name is Dump, Core Dump"   _/_/_/        _/_/_/      _/_/  _/_/
> "El amor es poner tu felicidad en la felicidad de otro" - Leibniz
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux)
> Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
>
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Jaroslav Pachola | 1 Feb 2008 16:46
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Re: Upcoming 2.5.2 release

It would be very nice if http://bugs.python.org/issue1692335 fix was included 
in 2.5.2. The patch exists, have been tested, reviewed by Georg Brandl, who 
says he needs some other developer to review the patches (there is a separate 
patch for 2.6). Could please someone look at the issue and help get the 
problem fixed in 2.5.2.?

Regards,
Jaroslav Pachola
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Tracker | 1 Feb 2008 19:06
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Summary of Tracker Issues


ACTIVITY SUMMARY (01/25/08 - 02/01/08)
Tracker at http://bugs.python.org/

To view or respond to any of the issues listed below, click on the issue 
number.  Do NOT respond to this message.

 1680 open (+31) / 12172 closed (+21) / 13852 total (+52)

Open issues with patches:   434

Average duration of open issues: 759 days.
Median duration of open issues: 1045 days.

Open Issues Breakdown
   open  1656 (+30)
pending    24 ( +1)

Issues Created Or Reopened (52)
_______________________________

os.path.isabs documentation error                                01/25/08
CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue1933    created  giampaolo.rodola         

os.path.isabs documentation error                                01/25/08
CLOSED http://bugs.python.org/issue1934    created  giampaolo.rodola         

test_descr.py converted to unittest                              01/25/08
       http://bugs.python.org/issue1935    created  amaury.forgeotdarc       
       patch
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Jeffrey Yasskin | 1 Feb 2008 19:13
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Subject: Re: Tracker marks my messages as spam :-)

On Feb 1, 2008 6:43 AM, Nicko van Someren <nicko <at> nicko.org> wrote:
> Perhaps it has to do with the low signal to noise ratio of your
> messages...

That was a little uncalled for. Be polite.
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Gregory P. Smith | 1 Feb 2008 19:23
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Re: Upcoming 2.5.2 release


On 1/31/08, Christian Heimes <lists <at> cheimes.de> wrote:
Jesus Cea wrote:
> My guess is that 2.5 branch is still open to more patches than pure
> security/stability patches, so "backporting" BerkeleyDB 4.6 support
> seems reasonable (to me). If I'm wrong, please educate me :-).

I think you are wrong, sorry pal! DB 4.6 support is a new feature. New
features must land in the development version(s) of Python, that is
Python 2.6 and 3.0. You must change as less code as possible in Python
2.5 to fix a severe problem.

Christian

Actually in all past releaseXX-maint branches I have merged in support for compiling against a new version of BerkeleyDB.  Its not a feature, its just something you have to do to support compiling against a new library version.  Why is this ok?

* There are no API changes on the python module side.
* Binary releases of python for windows continue to be compiled against the same BerkeleyDB version that was used in the 2.5.0 release.

the combo of those two things keeps it sane to do this.

As Martin pointed out, I already merged that trivial change in to release25-maint a while back.

That said, BerkeleyDB 4.6.x has proven to be a bit of an unstable release from Oracle so I'm considering modifying setup.py to disable linking against that version by default.  I'll be reviewing buildbot results this weekend.  As already mentioned by Neal i've disabled 4.6 support in trunk to watch the buildbots.  I'll go over the results this weekend to make a decision on whether or not python's setup.py should default to allowing itself to link against 4.6.x or not in hopes of avoiding people filing bugs against us for what is ultimately Oracle's problem.

-Greg

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Steve Holden | 1 Feb 2008 19:37
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Subject: Re: Tracker marks my messages as spam :-)

Jeffrey Yasskin wrote:
> On Feb 1, 2008 6:43 AM, Nicko van Someren <nicko <at> nicko.org> wrote:
>> Perhaps it has to do with the low signal to noise ratio of your
>> messages...
> 
> That was a little uncalled for. Be polite.

I don't believe it was at all impolite: It was a literal observation of 
a relevant phenomenon. Jesus's email that started this thread used 1305 
characters to simply say

"This will be my last email today, I don't want to waste (more of) your
*valuable* time."

a message of 89 characters. By anyone's standards that's a low S/N 
ratio. Even without the digital signature overhead it is still 89 
characters from a total of 648 ... it's quite possible that's why his 
messages are being misinterpreted.

regards
  Steve
--

-- 
Steve Holden        +1 571 484 6266   +1 800 494 3119
Holden Web LLC              http://www.holdenweb.com/

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Guido van Rossum | 1 Feb 2008 20:04
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Subject: Re: Tracker marks my messages as spam :-)

No. The message Jesus added to the tracer was, in its entirety:

""" 	
Oracle confirms the issue. They will provide a patch.
"""

That's just small, but has a high S/N ratio. The contents of Jesus'
email has nothing to do with this issue.

On Feb 1, 2008 10:37 AM, Steve Holden <steve <at> holdenweb.com> wrote:
> Jeffrey Yasskin wrote:
> > On Feb 1, 2008 6:43 AM, Nicko van Someren <nicko <at> nicko.org> wrote:
> >> Perhaps it has to do with the low signal to noise ratio of your
> >> messages...
> >
> > That was a little uncalled for. Be polite.
>
> I don't believe it was at all impolite: It was a literal observation of
> a relevant phenomenon. Jesus's email that started this thread used 1305
> characters to simply say
>
> "This will be my last email today, I don't want to waste (more of) your
> *valuable* time."
>
> a message of 89 characters. By anyone's standards that's a low S/N
> ratio. Even without the digital signature overhead it is still 89
> characters from a total of 648 ... it's quite possible that's why his
> messages are being misinterpreted.
>
> regards
>   Steve
> --
> Steve Holden        +1 571 484 6266   +1 800 494 3119
> Holden Web LLC              http://www.holdenweb.com/
>
>
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--

-- 
--Guido van Rossum (home page: http://www.python.org/~guido/)
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Nicko van Someren | 1 Feb 2008 23:49
Subject: Re: Tracker marks my messages as spam :-)

On 1 Feb 2008, at 18:37, Steve Holden wrote:

> Jeffrey Yasskin wrote:
>> On Feb 1, 2008 6:43 AM, Nicko van Someren <nicko <at> nicko.org> wrote:
>>> Perhaps it has to do with the low signal to noise ratio of your
>>> messages...
>>
>> That was a little uncalled for. Be polite.
>
> I don't believe it was at all impolite: It was a literal observation  
> of
> a relevant phenomenon. Jesus's email that started this thread used  
> 1305
> characters to simply say
>
> "This will be my last email today, I don't want to waste (more of)  
> your
> *valuable* time."
>
> a message of 89 characters. By anyone's standards that's a low S/N
> ratio. Even without the digital signature overhead it is still 89
> characters from a total of 648 ... it's quite possible that's why his
> messages are being misinterpreted.

Exactly.  I by no means meant to suggest that the quality of the  
content was low, only that it was lost in a morass of padding which  
might confuse a spam filter.  Sorry if my comment was misconstrued.

	Nicko

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Mark Dickinson | 1 Feb 2008 23:52
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Python on non IEEE-754 platforms: plea for information.

A request for information:

What non IEEE 754 platforms exist that people care about running Python 2.6, Python 3.0 and higher on?

By non IEEE 754 platform, I mean a platform where either the C double is not the usual 64-bit IEEE floating-point format, or where the C double is IEEE format but the platform deviates in major ways from the IEEE 754 specification.  There are a few places (mostly in mathmodule.c, cmathmodule.c, floatobject.c, longobject.c) where it's not clear that the code behaves correctly on non-IEEE platforms, and I'm finding it difficult to determine how broken (or not) it is without having a clear idea of what possible unusual floating-point formats might come up.

The major non-IEEE floating-point formats that I know of, on big iron, are the VAX, Cray and IBM formats;  I believe anything else is too old to worry about.  Is this true?  The IBM format is particularly troublesome because it's base 16 instead of base 2 (so e.g. multiplying a float by 2 can lose bits), but it appears that recent IBM machines do both IBM format and IEEE format floating-point.  I assume that the S-390 buildbots are using the IEEE side---is this true?

At the other end of the spectrum are embedded devices and cellphones.  Here I have no idea what the situation is at all---any information would be valuable.

Mark


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