Dominic Williams | 1 Apr 01:07 2005
Picon

Re: Motivation to Complete Stories


Hi Ron,

 >> Accountability and responsibility feel like opposite
 >> forces to me. I think.
 >
 > Please tell us more about this feeling. They feel
 > different to me, but not opposing. To me ...

To me, responsibility means being asked and trusted to
achieve something, in whatever way I (we) see fit.

If "accountable" means "able to render account", then
I feel that in addition to getting the job done, I (we)
need to take measures (such as tracking) to provide
not only the desired result, but an account of what
we've been up to.

I have two issues with that. One is that it feels like
extra work, so I'm wondering whether it's not
something we could leave out and still deliver great
software. The other is that I'm wondering why someone
would be wanting that information. Possibilities that
spring to mind, e.g. to suggest better uses of one's
time, strike me as the opposite of trust and
responsibility.

 >   A team is "self-accountable" when they work in a
 >   way that gives them the ability to check up on how
 >   they did compared to how they predicted they'd
(Continue reading)

yahoogroups | 1 Apr 01:20 2005

Re: Chandler Architecture


From: "Dale Emery" <dale.at.dhemery.com <at> yahoogroups.at.jhrothjr.com>
To: "XP Yahoo Group" 
<extremeprogramming.at.yahoogroups.com <at> yahoogroups.at.jhrothjr.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2005 4:58 PM
Subject: [XP] Chandler Architecture

>
> Hi all,
>
> I've wanted a good, free PIM for quite some time, so I was
> delighted, two or three years ago, to hear about the initiation
> of the Chandler project:
> http://www.osafoundation.org/Chandler_Compelling_Vision.htm
>
> I've been less than delighted about the news since then, and
> about the pace of the project.  Here's the latest, from Mitch
> Kapor, about release 0.5:
> http://blogs.osafoundation.org/mitch/000894.html
>
> Several things struck me.  Years after project inception, the key
> project driver is still saying, "PEASE NOTE IT'S NOT READY FOR
> REGULAR USE YET. NOT READY YET. NOT. (Am I afraid of this point
> being missed?)"
>
> Combine that with this bullet item about what Release 0.5 provides:
>
>> # New improved sharing architecture.
>
> This implies that there was a previous sharing architecture.  So
(Continue reading)

banshee858 | 1 Apr 01:22 2005
Picon

Re: All this talk on accountability


> 
> Opened my copy this morning for the first time, guess what 
> was the first word I saw, in the mind-map on the inside cover...
> 
Thank you for the correction; "accountable" is in the inside cover. 
Apparently, I have it wrong - that is one of the key concepts Kent
wishes people to take from XP2E.  

Reflecting on my original post and some of Kent's comments recently, I
still fail to see where parties other than developers are held
accountable.   

- If the customer is mad that the development team did not deliver
because they choose the wrong stories, when is the customer held
accountable for their selection? 

- If the development team did not deliver what the customer wanted
because the customer did not understand the concepts of velocity or
yesterday's weather, when is the customer held accountable for not
doing their homework?

If I am going to be accountable, then it is only fair that equal
parties opposite to me are accountable for their actions as well. 

Carlton 

To Post a message, send it to:   extremeprogramming <at> eGroups.com

To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: extremeprogramming-unsubscribe <at> eGroups.com
(Continue reading)

Dominic Williams | 1 Apr 01:22 2005
Picon

Re: Motivation to Complete Stories


Dave Rooney wrote:

 > When discussions on our team reach a point like this,
 > my lack of patience usually asserts itself with a
 > comment such as, "Can we just develop some bloody
 > software?!!"  Navel-gazing isn't a bad thing when
 > practiced in moderation.

We could just develop some bloody, as you say,
software, and not give a toss about:

1) what Kent Beck is actually suggesting
2) how people understand XP

Or we could try and get to the bottom of it, learn
something, and contribute to XP not being so frequently
misunderstood.

To me, this is the most interesting topic for months. I
devote a lot of time and energy promoting XP and
helping people adopt it. I'm concerned when there is
something I don't understand, something likely to be
misconstrued, or at the possibility that Kent Beck is
diverging from my own convictions, especially as he has
asserted ownership of the definition of XP.

Regards,

Dominic Williams
(Continue reading)

Dominic Williams | 1 Apr 01:27 2005
Picon

Re: Motivation to Complete Stories


Steve Bate wrote:

> I'm hearing a lot of fear in this thread about being accountable 
> in situations where developers and management don't have a good
> relationship. It seems to me that the fear is that the management
> will use accountability as a stick to beat the programmers. It
> may give the management too much authority and an unfair advantage
> in whatever ongoing power struggle exists between development and
> management.

There may be some of that.

Personally I would add two other fears (or concerns, anyway):

1) that a focus on accountability might upset the balance of 
a good, trustful relationship.

2) that accountability might be superfluous (and therefore 
an effort towards accountability might be wasteful).

Regards,

Dominic Williams
http://www.dominicwilliams.net

----

To Post a message, send it to:   extremeprogramming <at> eGroups.com

(Continue reading)

Colin Putney | 1 Apr 01:24 2005
Picon

Re: Re: Continuous Integraton and the database


Jeff Grigg wrote:

> --- "banshee858" <cnett858 <at> h...> wrote:
> 
>>I don't think losing data is the issue (however that is
>>important), the objection comes from how do we maintain
>>the SQL script used to create the database automatically?
>>[...]
> 
> Sounds to me like your teammates are effectively trying to treat the 
> Continuous Integration database schema, in the database, as part of 
> the "source configuration" (or source code) for the system.  That is, 
> it's impossible to build and deploy the system without it.

And actually, thinking about it that way has an interesting effect. On 
that part of the source code, it gives you *truly* continuous 
integration. You're updating the entire team's view of the source, in 
real time, as you make changes.

Colin

To Post a message, send it to:   extremeprogramming <at> eGroups.com

To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: extremeprogramming-unsubscribe <at> eGroups.com

ad-free courtesy of objectmentor.com 
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
(Continue reading)

Phlip | 1 Apr 01:34 2005
Picon

ANN: MiniRubyWiki 1.0.0


Agilistas:

A robust, full-featured, and installable MRW is now here:

    http://rubyforge.org/projects/minirubywiki

The wiki has a one-click launcher, and can transclude acceptance test
resources in an efficient and streamlined interface.

The wiki also has the most advanced emergent features available in
wikidom. You can import raw text or html into wiki pages, execute
commands to populate wiki pages, and you ran run, organize, and
annotate thousands of pages of test resources. This wiki has been used
in production to constrain all the and characters levels of a large
video game.

This page shows the tests in action:

    http://www.c2.com/cgi/wiki?MiniRubyWiki

This page describes growing a test fixture from scratch, and plugging
it into the Wiki:

    http://flea.sourceforge.net/gameTestServer.pdf

To view all that, on a Win32 platform, extract this file: 

    http://rubyforge.org/frs/download.php/3748/MiniRubyWiki-1-0-0.zip 

(Continue reading)

Jeff Grigg | 1 Apr 01:37 2005
Picon

Re: Continuous Integraton and the database


> --- Jeff Grigg wrote:
>> [...] your teammates are effectively trying to treat the
>> Continuous Integration database schema, in the database,
>> as part of  the "source configuration" (or source code)
>> for the system.  That is, it's impossible to build and
>> deploy the system without it.

--- Colin Putney <cputney <at> w...> wrote:
> And actually, thinking about it that way has an interesting
> effect. On that part of the source code, it gives you *truly*
> continuous integration. You're updating the entire team's
> view of the source, in real time, as you make changes.

...until you learn that the non-DB source code is changed in 
developer "sandboxes" -- so there's no way to coordinate "check-ins" of 
related database and corresponding non-DB source changes.   ... "Ouch!" 
when it hits you -- IE: broken builds.   ;->

To Post a message, send it to:   extremeprogramming <at> eGroups.com

To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: extremeprogramming-unsubscribe <at> eGroups.com

ad-free courtesy of objectmentor.com 
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/extremeprogramming/

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
(Continue reading)

Dominic Williams | 1 Apr 01:36 2005
Picon

Re: Fixed price contracts


Ron, Alistair, Kent,

Here's what I /actually wrote/:

 >> fixed-scope, fixed-cost contracts, which I think we
 >> agree are not well adapted to XP (or indeed to
 >> building up a good spirit in which to move forward).

In other words, that fc/fs is not the context in which
most benefits of XP will be reaped, nor in which the
spirit of XP will be most likely to prevail.

I never said XP/Agile was not adapted to fc/fs.

Having learned and practiced XP for four years
exclusively on fc/fs projects, I wholeheartedly agree
that XP is still the best way (I know) to get even
those projects done.

Regards,

Dominic Williams
http://www.dominicwilliams.net

----

To Post a message, send it to:   extremeprogramming <at> eGroups.com

To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: extremeprogramming-unsubscribe <at> eGroups.com
(Continue reading)

Dominic Williams | 1 Apr 01:42 2005
Picon

Re: Motivation to Complete Stories


Mr. Beck,

 > Ron,
 >
 > Do you ever get rug burns from flip-flopping this fast?

For me, this really takes a lot of credibility out many
of the things you write (about respect and
communication, for example).

Dominic Williams
http://www.dominicwilliams.net

----

To Post a message, send it to:   extremeprogramming <at> eGroups.com

To Unsubscribe, send a blank message to: extremeprogramming-unsubscribe <at> eGroups.com

ad-free courtesy of objectmentor.com 
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/extremeprogramming/

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
    extremeprogramming-unsubscribe <at> yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
(Continue reading)


Gmane