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Chris McCormick | 1 May 2006 03:21
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Re: PDDP meeting?

On Sun, Apr 30, 2006 at 12:58:32PM -0400, Mathieu Bouchard wrote:
> On Tue, 25 Apr 2006, David Powers wrote:
> 
> > How can one do object-oriented PD (there are at least some parallels),
> > and how might that differ from other approaches?
> 
> First you have to avoid those who say that PD is only for music and/or 
> video; they can't put the word "application" or "program" on a patch or a 
> set of patches, it has to be called "patches".
> 
> Second you have to avoid those who say PD isn't object-oriented and
> especially those who think that you should not use anything that "looks" 
> too object-oriented because it wouldn't fit the "dataflow paradigm", 
> whatever that is.
> 
> Third is a rule for OOP in general, in any language: the final goal is
> never to make a program "more OOP", it's to make a program better, by any 
> "paradigm" necessary.

Fourth, watch out for communists, who are all out to get you.

> paint a complete picture, no matter which programming language it is being
> asked about, even though I think that Pd has more holes than almost all 
> programming languages.

So why are you still using it?

Best,

Chris.
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Will Hurt | 1 May 2006 03:41
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Pd-0.39.2-extended-test3 error404

hi,

im unable to download the extended-test3 for linux.

its not in here:

http://idmi.poly.edu/pdlab/

thanks, will

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Nicolas Montgermont | 1 May 2006 04:38
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Re: dfx and flext external problem.

Hi,

we are a écrit :
also, i'm having trouble compiling flext. after following the install
and build directions from both the official and CVS version i get this
error...

tom <at> localhost ~/programsSRC/flext $ bash build.sh pd gcc
make -f ./buildsys/gnumake-sub.mak PLATFORM=lnx RTSYS=pd COMPILER=gcc
BUILDPATH=./buildsys/ PKGINFO=package.txt BUILDCLASS=flext
USRCONFIG=config.txt USRMAKE=build/gnumake-lnx-gcc.inc
TARGETMODE=release TARGETTYPE=single _build_
make[1]: Entering directory `/home/tom/programsSRC/flext'
g++ -c -msse -mfpmath=sse -ffast-math -DNDEBUG -O2 -march=pentium-m -pthread -fPIC -DFLEXT_EXPORTS -DFLEXT_SYS=2
-I/home/tom/programsSRC/pd-0.39-2/src/src source/flbase.cpp -o
pd-linux/release-single/flbase.opp
source/flbase.cpp:28:22: g_canvas.h: No such file or directory
It seems that your pd source folder is not well declared : -I/home/tom/programsSRC/pd-0.39-2/src/src
The PDPATH definition in flextdir/buildsys/config-lnx-pd-gcc.txt must point on the pd folder instead of the pd/src one.

Best regards,

Nicolas



--
Nicolas Montgermont - PhD Student
Laboratoire d'Acoustique Musicale
11 rue de Lourmel
75015 Paris - France
Tel. (+33) 01 53 95 43 31
Fax. (+33) 01 45 77 16 59
w3 : www.lam.jussieu.fr/src/Membres/Montgermont 
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Hans-Christoph Steiner | 1 May 2006 07:55
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Re: thoughts on manuals


The [comment] object has better fonts, but doesn't seem to work on  
Windows at the moment.

.hc

On Apr 30, 2006, at 12:24 PM, adam wrote:

>
> Is there any way to get better font handling? that would also  
> improve the
> readability a lot.
>
> adam
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Adam Hyde
> ~/.nl
>
> selected projects
> http://www.xs4all.nl/~adam
>
> the streaming suitcase
> http://www.streamingsuitcase.com
>
> r a d i o q u a l i a
> http://www.radioqualia.net
>
> Free as in 'media'
> email : adam <at> xs4all.nl
> mobile : + 31 6 186 75 356 (Netherlands mobile)

________________________________________________________________________ 
____

"Terrorism is not an enemy.  It cannot be defeated.  It's a tactic.   
It's about as sensible to say we declare war on night attacks and  
expect we're going to win that war.  We're not going to win the war  
on terrorism."
                                     - retired U.S. Army general,  
William Odom

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adam | 1 May 2006 07:59
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Re: thoughts on manuals

Perhaps it might be worth considering trying another template option with some images and fonts? 

adam

..on Mon, May 01, 2006 at 07:55:53AM +0200, 
Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
> 
> The [comment] object has better fonts, but doesn't seem to work on  
> Windows at the moment.
> 
> .hc
> 
> On Apr 30, 2006, at 12:24 PM, adam wrote:
> 
> >
> >Is there any way to get better font handling? that would also  
> >improve the
> >readability a lot.
> >
> >adam
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >Adam Hyde
> >~/.nl
> >
> >selected projects
> >http://www.xs4all.nl/~adam
> >
> >the streaming suitcase
> >http://www.streamingsuitcase.com
> >
> >r a d i o q u a l i a
> >http://www.radioqualia.net
> >
> >Free as in 'media'
> >email : adam <at> xs4all.nl
> >mobile : + 31 6 186 75 356 (Netherlands mobile)
> 
> 
> ________________________________________________________________________ 
> ____
> 
> "Terrorism is not an enemy.  It cannot be defeated.  It's a tactic.   
> It's about as sensible to say we declare war on night attacks and  
> expect we're going to win that war.  We're not going to win the war  
> on terrorism."
>                                     - retired U.S. Army general,  
> William Odom
> 

-- 

Adam Hyde
~/.nl

selected projects
http://www.xs4all.nl/~adam

the streaming suitcase
http://www.streamingsuitcase.com

r a d i o q u a l i a
http://www.radioqualia.net

Free as in 'media'
email : adam <at> xs4all.nl
mobile : + 31 6 186 75 356 (Netherlands mobile)

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Rich E | 1 May 2006 09:07
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fluid~.pd_darwin ...needs fluidsynth framework

Hello, sorry if this is a worn out topic.  I know Frank doesn't use macs, and I don't much either, but I need to get this external running on one for an upcoming class assignment/performance.  Basically, flext and fluidsynth are compiled on OSX 10.3.9, and the fluid~.pd_darwin building starts, but it cannot locate the frameowrk Fluidsynth.  I cannot find any reference to this framework, and all that I can find installed from the build is a binary fluidsynth and a libfluidsynth.a in /usr/local/lib.  Can anyone who has gotten this to build explain what I must do? 

Also, I posted about the fluid~ external in linux a while ago, and while I never got the external to compile, I found a working binary that works fantastically.  Its not in the repository any more though..

Anyhow, thanks

Richie

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Frank Barknecht | 1 May 2006 11:42
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Re: fluid~.pd_darwin ...needs fluidsynth framework

Hallo,
Rich E hat gesagt: // Rich E wrote:

> Hello, sorry if this is a worn out topic.  I know Frank doesn't use macs,
> and I don't much either, but I need to get this external running on one for
> an upcoming class assignment/performance.  Basically, flext and fluidsynth
> are compiled on OSX 10.3.9, and the fluid~.pd_darwin building starts, but it
> cannot locate the frameowrk Fluidsynth.  I cannot find any reference to this
> framework, and all that I can find installed from the build is a binary
> fluidsynth and a libfluidsynth.a in /usr/local/lib.  Can anyone who has
> gotten this to build explain what I must do?

I really don't know Macs, so this may be totally offf, but I think
there may be an issue with fluidsynth on Mac not building a framework
or something like that. I think, in this case you may also be able to
use the "-l" linker option instead of "-framework". You can edit the
file: "build/gnumake-mac-gcc.inc" in the fluid directory to try to use
the library by replacing this: 

LIBS += -framework Fluidsynth

with this: 

LIBS += -lfluidsynth

the try to compile again with 
$ cd fluid
$ /PATH/TO/flext/build.sh pd gcc build

If this works, then please tell me and I will change the file in the
CVS accordingly. 

Ciao
--

-- 
 Frank Barknecht                 _ ______footils.org_ __goto10.org__

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Mathieu Bouchard | 1 May 2006 16:36
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Re: PDDP meeting?

On Mon, 1 May 2006, Chris McCormick wrote:
> On Sun, Apr 30, 2006 at 12:58:32PM -0400, Mathieu Bouchard wrote:
> > paint a complete picture, no matter which programming language it is being
> > asked about, even though I think that Pd has more holes than almost all 
> > programming languages.
> So why are you still using it?

The trick is to use Pd for its advantages, not for its inconvenients.

> > Third is a rule for OOP in general, in any language: the final goal is
> > never to make a program "more OOP", it's to make a program better, by 
> > any "paradigm" necessary.
> Fourth, watch out for communists, who are all out to get you.

I'd rather have you reply with interesting ideas, but I can deal with
flames too. It's sort of disappointing, though.

 _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ...
| Mathieu Bouchard - tél:+1.514.383.3801 - http://artengine.ca/matju
| Freelance Digital Arts Engineer, Montréal QC Canada

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Martin Peach | 1 May 2006 18:35
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Re: osc objects

Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
> I have to say that I really think that tcp and udp objects should be  
> bidirectional.  TCP and UDP sockets are, so the objects should  
> represent that.  I've done quite a bit of network programming with Pd  
> and I never use [netsend]/[netreceive].  I always use [netserver]/ 
> [netclient] because of the bidirectional connection and the client  
> management of the [netserver].
> 

OK, it looks like basically the same modifications are needed to change 
[netserver] and [netclient] to byte mode from pd message mode as I did 
with [netsend] and [netreceive]. Will have a go.

Martin

> I think the "server" aspect could be a separate object.  I think the  
> socket objects should represent just the sockets, and how the sockets  
> work.
> 
> .hc
> 
> ________________________________________________________________________ 
> ____
> 
> "Information wants to be free."
>                                      -Stewart Brand
> 
> 
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Martin Peach | 1 May 2006 23:16
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Re: osc objects

Mathieu Bouchard wrote:
> On Fri, 28 Apr 2006, Martin Peach wrote:
> 
>>Mathieu Bouchard wrote:
>>
>>>bidi connections are nice, so let's merge the send/receive parts together:
>>>net/tcpsocket
>>>net/udpsocket
>>
>>But we don't have midisocket, just midiin and midiout, and it's easier to
>>patch that way.
>>For instance I'm using OSC to talk to microcontrollers on one port but they
>>reply on another. To me it makes more sense to have separate send and receive
>>objects
> 
> 
> You gotta be kidding. A lot of protocols that Pd could support require a
> bidirectional connection. That is, you can't find a version of the
> protocol that works by first establishing a socket one way and then
> connecting back the other way. It wouldn't work in masquerading IP
> situations either.

Oh I see...I was thinking you could just make an abstraction with 
tcpsend and tcpreceive in the same patch and it would work just like a 
bidirectional socket, but I probably didn't think far enough...I'm no 
good at chess either...

In my own selfish way I am using [udpsend] and [udpreceive] in a single 
patch as separate objects. I have pd sending messages to several micros 
on a subnet, with one [udpsend] for each connection; the micros can then 
reply to a single [udpreceive] on the same or a different port number. 
The protocol is just OSC over udp and it works fine for me. I use an OSC 
message like: /replyto/ 9999 so I can tell each micro to talk back on an 
arbitrary port. So as I said, to me it makes more sense to have separate 
objects. For other applications it doesn't. I'll work on [netclient] and 
[netserver] for those, when I can.

> 
> DesireData is going to have those byte-based sockets for sure. The
> client-server protocol of Pd itself is bidi, and I believe a user ought to
> be able to do the same! This means that i want one class for both send and
> receive.
> 
> 
>>tcpreceive accepts multiple incoming connections (maximum is set by a #define
>>in the code but it could be a creation argument if needed), and updreceive
>>accepts any messages sent to its port number. Both also output the ip address
>>of the source of each incoming message.
> 
> 
> But receive is reserved for servers, and servers are reserved for 
> receiving, while sending is reserved for clients, and clients can only 
> send. Why?

Why what?

Martin

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