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Yoshiki Ohshima | 1 Jan 2008 08:01
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Re: [Vm-dev] Re: Unix VM path encodings

  Andreas,

> Odd. Checking the latest OLPC image I have access to (etoys2.3-1867) 
> there is nothing I can see that would deal properly in the image with 
> non-ascii file names on Unix. LanguageEnvironment still returns "self 
> currentPlatform class fileNameConverterClass" which won't use an UTF-8 
> converter anywhere. So unless I'm missing something it probably 
> shouldn't work on OLPC. Maybe try it with some "real" UTF-32 names?

  Ah, you are right.  the code wasn't the way I remember it should be.
Latin1Environment (which should be called WesternEuropeanEnvironment)
flieNameConverterClass should be a bit more elaborated (or just
returning UTF8TextConverter).

-- Yoshiki
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Herbert König | 1 Jan 2008 15:58
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Re: Fireworks

Hello Alexander,

thanks a lot, I'll try to learn from it and change a few things.
AL> Close to/After the beginning of 2008 it might be a good time for an
AL> (ugly) but fun hack! ;)

AL> The project can be loaded into a 3.9 image.

These .st also work in 3.7 and 3.8. Just file them in and in a
Workspace do: FireworksAnimation start.

Had to change Rocket>>die to use Float>>pi as 3.7 and 3.8 don't have
Float>>twoPi though the constant Twopi is defined in Float.

AL> PS: This is the result of some fun hours of hacking, but shouldn't be
AL> looked at closely! After all this should be much nicer in kedama!

With you kind permission I'll look at it anyway :-)) It's small and cute
and I believe I can understand it with little effort. Looks like a fun
target to practise my (barely existing) refactoring skills.

Thanks again.

AL> PPS: Use Alt-. to stop it

Cheers

Herbert                            mailto:herbertkoenig <at> gmx.net
Attachment (Fireworks.zip): application/x-zip-compressed, 2988 bytes
(Continue reading)






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kemal asad-syed
 | 
1 Jan 2008 20:08






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re: Re: etoys tutorial






ok i guess i miss understood what Make your own Etoy meant.
i am still not able to see any tutorial in 
http://www.squeakland.org/whatis/tutorials.html

Make your own Etoy.
i guess now this is just an empty work-space. to practice but no tutorial.
i am looking on a tutorial on how to use a morph i built into something like an Etoys. particularly i would like to know how to make my own bricks so it shows in the miscellaneous category.

how to make a flap where i could put all my morphs for later use an instantiation a little like the suply flap but with my own stuff.
to be more clear i want to draw a car "suv".
teach it to "roll over" show the "roll over" method as a tile for the "suv" toys. create a flaps with all my "rebuilt cars".

i feel quite lost with my current understanding of squeak . is my design even feasible.
thanks for any help. so far i have tried to track down how the rectangle Morph was build but i haven't yet grasp the concepts from the code .


Kemal





On Jan 1, 2008 1:00 PM,  <squeak-dev-request <at> lists.squeakfoundation.org> wrote:

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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: etoys tutorial (subbukk)

   2. Fireworks (Alexander Lazarevic')
   3. Re: GridBag (Brian Brown)
   4. [ANN] Logging api (Keith Hodges)
   5. Re: [ANN] Logging api (Keith Hodges)
   6. AddMiorph causes VM coma? (Jerome Peace)

   7. Re: Squeak and composite desktop (beryl/compiz) (Igor Stasenko)
   8. Re: [ANN] ICal occurrence API (Philippe Marschall)
   9. Re: GridBag (Blake)
  10. Re: GridBag (Brian Brown)
  11. Re: GridBag (Blake)

  12. Re: [Vm-dev] Re: Unix VM path encodings (Yoshiki Ohshima)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Mon, 31 Dec 2007 18:03:24 +0530
From: subbukk <
subbukk <at> gmail.com>
Subject: Re: etoys tutorial
To: squeak-dev <at> lists.squeakfoundation.org
Message-ID: <
200712311803.24801.subbukk <at> gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;  charset="utf-8"

On Sunday 30 December 2007 5:50 pm, kemal asad-syed wrote:
> I am trying to have a look to the
> tutorial : *Make your own Etoy

> of the page
> http://www.squeakland.org/index.html
> the project opens in my browser with the plugin but i just get an empty
> white screen once it is loaded.

> *
> how it should be ?
What you are seeing is the World - empty until you fill it up with objects. If
you scroll down the page, you will see the Navigator flap along the bottom
left corner, Click on "Escape Browser" to switch to full screen mode. The

default language is Deutsche. Use the "World" button in Navigator to change
the language.

Have fun,
Subbu


------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Mon, 31 Dec 2007 16:37:56 +0100

From: Alexander Lazarevic' <Alexander <at> Lazarevic.de>
Subject: Fireworks
To: squeak-dev <at> lists.squeakfoundation.org

Message-ID: <47790CD4.7070104 <at> Lazarevic.de>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15

Close to/After the beginning of 2008 it might be a good time for an

(ugly) but fun hack! ;)

The project can be loaded into a 3.9 image.

http://www.lazarevic.de/download/squeak/fireworks.002.pr


This should also work, but no guaranties...

http://squeakland.org/project.jsp?http://www.lazarevic.de/download/squeak/fireworks.002.pr


Cheers (in every sense),
   Alex :D

PS: This is the result of some fun hours of hacking, but shouldn't be
looked at closely! After all this should be much nicer in kedama!
PPS: Use Alt-. to stop it



------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Mon, 31 Dec 2007 10:13:24 -0700
From: Brian Brown <rbb <at> techgame.net>
Subject: Re: GridBag
To: The general-purpose Squeak developers list

        <squeak-dev <at> lists.squeakfoundation.org>
Message-ID: <05EB0741-B988-4BDC-8199-F37F1F15781B <at> techgame.net
>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

You can take a look at this: http://www.squeaksource.com/GuidedLayout.html


- Brian

On Dec 29, 2007, at 3:22 PM, Blake wrote:

> Hello, All:
>
>       I note that here:
>
> http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/282

>
>
> a suggestion was made for a GridBagLayout (a way to fix columns and
> rows). I don't actually see one in Squeak however.
>
>       Has anyone done this? Or is there another (good) way to constrain

> layouts to a fixed number of columns and rows?
>
>       ===Blake===
>

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------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Mon, 31 Dec 2007 18:41:20 +0000
From: Keith Hodges <
keith_hodges <at> yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: [ANN] Logging api
To: The general-purpose Squeak developers list
        <
squeak-dev <at> lists.squeakfoundation.org>
Message-ID: <477937D0.40705 <at> yahoo.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

Hello all, and happy new year,


There are three Logging packages for Squeak that I know of.

1. SimpleLog
2. Toothpick
3. LogEngine
there is also a Null logger.

This package "Logging", available from SqueakMap and in Universes, is

slightly higher level 'front end' api to these logging back ends.

best regards

Keith

===================
from the class comment

Convenient usage: 'annotated values'


self log x: 10 y: 20 z: 30.

To select a specific log severity level (i.e. not the temporary one
featured above).

self log info x: 10 y: 20 z: 30.

To log the current method's input parameters.

Rectangle-#corner: topLeftPoint extent: heightWidthPoint

self log debug this.

would be the same as

self log corner: topLeftPoint extent: heightWidthPoint.

To log the current methods variables:


self log debug vars instance.



------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Mon, 31 Dec 2007 18:46:15 +0000
From: Keith Hodges <keith_hodges <at> yahoo.co.uk
>
Subject: Re: [ANN] Logging api
To: The general-purpose Squeak developers list
        <squeak-dev <at> lists.squeakfoundation.org>
Message-ID: <
477938F7.9070700 <at> yahoo.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

Keith Hodges wrote:
> Hello all, and happy new year,
>
> There are three Logging packages for Squeak that I know of.

>
> 1. SimpleLog
> 2. Toothpick
> 3. LogEngine
> there is also a Null logger.
>
> This package "Logging", available from SqueakMap and in Universes, is
> slightly higher level 'front end' api to these logging back ends.

>
> best regards
>
> Keith
I forgot to mention the new news, that being support for Göran's
SimpleLog has been added recently.
Toothpick is also supported, though LogEngine does not have an adaptor

as yet.

best regards

Keith

p.s. if the authors of toothpick happen to read this, I still think some
additional work is needed for Toothpick to support logging to a file
reliably on windows.



------------------------------

Message: 6
Date: Mon, 31 Dec 2007 12:28:04 -0800 (PST)
From: Jerome Peace <peace_the_dreamer <at> yahoo.com>
Subject: AddMiorph causes VM coma?

To: "squeak-dev <at> lists.squeakfoundation.org"
        <squeak-dev <at> lists.squeakfoundation.org
>
Message-ID: <59446.16681.qm <at> web50303.mail.re2.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1

AddMiorph causes VM coma?

Hi Blake,

It looks like your son found a good one.*  Can he do
it again?
And can you explain how to reproduce the error?

I tried it and failed to get stopped. Which is not
surprising.

What I did was:

(In a fresh squeak 3.10  version 7159, opened with  a
mac classic vm 3.8.9beta7)

Dropped a .gif file on the image (which gave me a
sketch morph)

Opened a workspace (Worldmenu>open>workspace) and

from the menu in the title bar set
 create textual references to dropped morphs to true

then I dropped the sketch onto the workspace (which
created a textual reference to the morph in my case
sketch3255)

wrote, selected and did a "print it" on
'World addMorph: sketch3255' .

This caused me no problems.

I then deleted the sketch; reselected the phrase and
did it again.

Still no problems.


-----
What did your son do different? Can you supply a
report similar in detail to the above?
If you can show how to reproduce the problem then
someone may be able to help you track down the
trouble.


Yours in curiosity and service,

Jerome Peace

*My imaginary friend Puck says "A troublesome bug is
its own reward."
Puck is an essential part of my bug finding team.
His additude is that crashing the system is a good way

to improve it.

See:
http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/5915
Game of Mantis

and also

http://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?project=Macintosh&story=Make_a_Mess,_Clean_it_Up!.txt
for a neat Burell Smith story.





***
>Blake blake at 
kingdomrpg.com
>Mon Dec 31 02:47:50 UTC 2007
>
>Hello, all,
>
>       My son is working with morphs and has a sketchmorph
sublcass that he's
>adding to the World like this:

>
>World addMorph: aCity.
>
>       This causes Squeak to go away and never come back.
Alt+. does not work.
>When I debug, it seems to hang up in the CopyReplace
code of the AddMorph
>routine. I've put halts in his initialize code

thinking he's looping
>somehow but I sure can't see it. I can run the
CopyReplace code once, then
>the VM goes back to that code, and if it tries to run
it again, it hangs
>up. It's trying to replace with a start of 2 and a

stop of 1, but that
>appears to be a legimate "add".
>
>       I'm kind of stumped as to where to look.
>
>       ===Blake===
***




      ____________________________________________________________________________________

Never miss a thing.  Make Yahoo your home page.
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs


------------------------------

Message: 7
Date: Mon, 31 Dec 2007 22:37:41 +0200

From: "Igor Stasenko" <siguctua <at> gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Squeak and composite desktop (beryl/compiz)
To: "The general-purpose Squeak developers list"

        <squeak-dev <at> lists.squeakfoundation.org>
Message-ID:
        <
4a5f5f320712311237pdb7cf3at79d6bcb898ac831f <at> mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8

On 30/12/2007, Hilaire Fernandes <hilaire <at> ofset.org> wrote:

> Igor Stasenko a écrit :
> > I'm just installed ubuntu, which using composite desktop enhancements.
> > Squeak can't draw itself correctly when running in such mode.
> > It looks like a semi-transparent window.

> > Does anybody knows how to fix that?
> >
> >
>
> If you switch Squeak display to 32bbp it will be much better and usable,
> although not exactly perfect.
>

I never coded for X server, so i don't know what can cause problems,

but i'm sure that proper fix should work regardless of display bpp.


--
Best regards,
Igor Stasenko AKA sig.

------------------------------

Message: 8
Date: Mon, 31 Dec 2007 21:55:04 +0100

From: "Philippe Marschall" <philippe.marschall <at> gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ANN] ICal occurrence API
To: "The general-purpose Squeak developers list"

        <squeak-dev <at> lists.squeakfoundation.org>
Message-ID:
        <
66666f210712311255s376380c5s6b43ddda260182c5 <at> mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8

2007/12/31, Alan L. Lovejoy <squeak-dev.sourcery <at> forum-mail.net
>:
>
>  Philippe Marschall wrote:
>  2007/12/30, Alan L. Lovejoy <architect <at> chronos-st.org>:
>
>
>  Jason,
>
> I spent the the last hour rooting around in the latest version of the

> iCalendar package from SqueakSource. I see lots of code for parsing and
> representing iCal recurrence rules,
>
>  Yes, for quite some time that was the only thing the package did
> because computing the occurrences is a bit tricky.

>
>
>
>  but can't find any code that
> actually attempts to generate the set of occurrences specified by the rules.
>
> Am I missing something?
>
>  If you load one of the later jbj versions you should get the code

> described by Jason, see the added tests in ICEventTests for example
> #testOccurencesWithExclusionDate.
>
> Cheers
> Philippe
>
>
>  I didn't see any "jbj" versions yesterday.  And today, both the "Versions"

> tab and the "Latest" tab report "No matching public versions available".
>
>  ???

Sorry I can not reproduce this. It shows me several jbj versions in
non-filtered and filtered [1] mode. In the latest tab I

see ICal-jbj.67.mcz.

[1] http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/8395/jbjversionsiv6.png

Cheers
Philippe



------------------------------

Message: 9
Date: Mon, 31 Dec 2007 14:31:03 -0800
From: Blake <blake <at> kingdomrpg.com>
Subject: Re: GridBag
To: "The general-purpose Squeak developers list"

        <squeak-dev <at> lists.squeakfoundation.org>
Message-ID: <op.t370t1ydzb486t <at> decoteau.plan10
>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes;
        charset=iso-8859-15

Thanks, Brian.

I notice it says several demos are included but I don't see any.

Dunno if you ever got much feedback but I'll tell you what we think once

we figure it out.<s>

        ===Blake===

On Mon, 31 Dec 2007 09:13:24 -0800, Brian Brown <rbb <at> techgame.net> wrote:

> You can take a look at this:

> http://www.squeaksource.com/GuidedLayout.html
>
> - Brian
>
> On Dec 29, 2007, at 3:22 PM, Blake wrote:
>

>> Hello, All:
>>
>>      I note that here:
>>
>> http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/282
>>
>>
>> a suggestion was made for a GridBagLayout (a way to fix columns and

>> rows). I don't actually see one in Squeak however.
>>
>>      Has anyone done this? Or is there another (good) way to constrain
>> layouts to a fixed number of columns and rows?

>>
>>      ===Blake===
>>
>




------------------------------

Message: 10
Date: Mon, 31 Dec 2007 16:06:42 -0700
From: Brian Brown <
rbb <at> techgame.net>
Subject: Re: GridBag
To: The general-purpose Squeak developers list
        <squeak-dev <at> lists.squeakfoundation.org>
Message-ID: <
583EB187-A076-42BB-8F39-4CF467CB5090 <at> techgame.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes

The demos are in some class side methods, IIRC :)


It's been a while, and I published it, but a different developer here
wrote it.

- Brian

On Dec 31, 2007, at 3:31 PM, Blake wrote:

> Thanks, Brian.
>
> I notice it says several demos are included but I don't see any.

>
> Dunno if you ever got much feedback but I'll tell you what we think
> once we figure it out.<s>
>
>       ===Blake===
>
> On Mon, 31 Dec 2007 09:13:24 -0800, Brian Brown <
rbb <at> techgame.net>
> wrote:
>
>> You can take a look at this: http://www.squeaksource.com/GuidedLayout.html

>>
>> - Brian
>>
>> On Dec 29, 2007, at 3:22 PM, Blake wrote:
>>
>>> Hello, All:
>>>
>>>     I note that here:
>>>
>>> 
http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/282
>>>
>>>
>>> a suggestion was made for a GridBagLayout (a way to fix columns and
>>> rows). I don't actually see one in Squeak however.

>>>
>>>     Has anyone done this? Or is there another (good) way to constrain
>>> layouts to a fixed number of columns and rows?
>>>
>>>     ===Blake===
>>>

>>
>
>
>



------------------------------

Message: 11
Date: Mon, 31 Dec 2007 15:24:22 -0800
From: Blake <blake <at> kingdomrpg.com
>
Subject: Re: GridBag
To: "The general-purpose Squeak developers list"
        <squeak-dev <at> lists.squeakfoundation.org>
Message-ID: <
op.t373awsizb486t <at> decoteau.plan10>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes;
        charset=iso-8859-15

Ah. There they are. Thanks!


On Mon, 31 Dec 2007 15:06:42 -0800, Brian Brown <rbb <at> techgame.net> wrote:

> The demos are in some class side methods, IIRC :)
>
> It's been a while, and I published it, but a different developer here

> wrote it.
>
> - Brian
>
> On Dec 31, 2007, at 3:31 PM, Blake wrote:
>
>> Thanks, Brian.
>>
>> I notice it says several demos are included but I don't see any.

>>
>> Dunno if you ever got much feedback but I'll tell you what we think
>> once we figure it out.<s>
>>
>>      ===Blake===
>>
>> On Mon, 31 Dec 2007 09:13:24 -0800, Brian Brown <
rbb <at> techgame.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> You can take a look at this:
>>> 
http://www.squeaksource.com/GuidedLayout.html
>>>
>>> - Brian
>>>
>>> On Dec 29, 2007, at 3:22 PM, Blake wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hello, All:
>>>>

>>>>    I note that here:
>>>>
>>>> http://wiki.squeak.org/squeak/282
>>>>
>>>>

>>>> a suggestion was made for a GridBagLayout (a way to fix columns and
>>>> rows). I don't actually see one in Squeak however.
>>>>
>>>>    Has anyone done this? Or is there another (good) way to constrain

>>>> layouts to a fixed number of columns and rows?
>>>>
>>>>    ===Blake===
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>




------------------------------

Message: 12
Date: Mon, 31 Dec 2007 23:01:30 -0800
From: Yoshiki Ohshima <yoshiki <at> vpri.org>
Subject: Re: [Vm-dev] Re: Unix VM path encodings

To: The general-purpose Squeak developers list
        <squeak-dev <at> lists.squeakfoundation.org>,        Squeak Virtual Machine
        Development Discussion  <
vm-dev <at> lists.squeakfoundation.org>
Message-ID: <u63yeuj05.wl%yoshiki <at> vpri.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII


  Andreas,

> Odd. Checking the latest OLPC image I have access to (etoys2.3-1867)
> there is nothing I can see that would deal properly in the image with
> non-ascii file names on Unix. LanguageEnvironment still returns "self

> currentPlatform class fileNameConverterClass" which won't use an UTF-8
> converter anywhere. So unless I'm missing something it probably
> shouldn't work on OLPC. Maybe try it with some "real" UTF-32 names?


  Ah, you are right.  the code wasn't the way I remember it should be.
Latin1Environment (which should be called WesternEuropeanEnvironment)
flieNameConverterClass should be a bit more elaborated (or just

returning UTF8TextConverter).

-- Yoshiki


------------------------------

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*****************************************

















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Michael van der Gulik
 | 
1 Jan 2008 21:52






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Re: Fireworks







On Jan 1, 2008 4:37 AM, Alexander Lazarevic' <Alexander <at> lazarevic.de> wrote:

Close to/After the beginning of 2008 it might be a good time for an
(ugly) but fun hack! ;)

The project can be loaded into a 3.9 image.


http://www.lazarevic.de/download/squeak/fireworks.002.pr

This should also work, but no guaranties...


http://squeakland.org/project.jsp?http://www.lazarevic.de/download/squeak/fireworks.002.pr







That's really cool!

Gulik. 








-- 

http://people.squeakfoundation.org/person/mikevdg
http://gulik.pbwiki.com/










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Jerome Peace
 | 
1 Jan 2008 22:13






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Favicon





etoys tutorial


etoys tutorial

Hi Kemal,

Seems to me you had a perfectly good expectation of
what to find in a "make your own etoy project". And
its good feedback to let people know how what it is
differs from the expectation.

A very good and interesting way to learn about making
etoys is to watch the 20 episodes of Squeaky tales at:
http://www.waveplace.com/movies/

Their creator, Timothy Falconer (
http://bigfractaltangle.com/aboutMe.jsp ) , has
promised more episodes in the near future.

Hth,

Yours in curiosity and service, --Jerome Peace

P.S. Etoys related questions might get more
informative answers if directed to the Squeakland
list. 

http://squeakland.org/pipermail/squeakland/
***
>kemal asad-syed kasadsyed at gmail.com 
>Tue Jan 1 19:08:11 UTC 2008 
>
>
>
>ok i guess i miss understood what *Make your own Etoy
meant.*
>i am still not able to see any tutorial in
>http://www.squeakland.org/whatis/tutorials.html
>*Make your own Etoy.
>i guess now this is just an empty work-space. to
practice but no tutorial.
>*i am looking on a tutorial on how to use a morph i
built into something
>like an Etoys. particularly i would like to know how
to make my own bricks
>so it shows in the miscellaneous category.
>how to make a flap where i could put all my morphs
for later use an
>instantiation a little like the suply flap but with
my own stuff.
>to be more clear i want to draw a car "suv".
>teach it to "roll over" show the "roll over" method
as a tile for the "suv"
>toys. create a flaps with all my "rebuilt cars".
>i feel quite lost with my current understanding of
squeak . is my design
>even feasible.
>thanks for any help. so far i have tried to track
down how the rectangle
>Morph was build but i haven't yet grasp the concepts
from the code .
>
>Kemal
***

      ____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better friend, newshound, and 
know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile.  Try it now. 
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Bert Freudenberg
 | 
1 Jan 2008 22:48






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Re: Fireworks


On Jan 1, 2008, at 21:52 , Michael van der Gulik wrote:

> On Jan 1, 2008 4:37 AM, Alexander Lazarevic'  
> <Alexander <at> lazarevic.de> wrote:
> Close to/After the beginning of 2008 it might be a good time for an
> (ugly) but fun hack! ;)
>
> The project can be loaded into a 3.9 image.
>
> http://www.lazarevic.de/download/squeak/fireworks.002.pr

Nice!

> This should also work, but no guaranties...
>
> http://squeakland.org/project.jsp?http://www.lazarevic.de/download/ 
> squeak/fireworks.002.pr

No, it does not, at least not with the Squeakland plugin image.

- Bert -







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Keith Hodges
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2 Jan 2008 03:52






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Wanted volunteers for 'image cleaning'


Dear All,

the 'LevelPlayingField' script process is working reasonably well now
and has been tested with the typical squeak images, from 3.7 onwards.
One or two folks have even incorporated LPF in their own
production/dev-image build scripts.

The LevelPlayingField script loads a basic set packages for preparing
images using Installer scripts, namely, Installer,  Launcher,
Monticello, and MonticelloConfigurations.

The next step is to offer some further optional scripts for preparing an
image for use. One of the options that I would like to provide, I have
called "Clean'. This would remove particular packages from the image. I
dont want to go overboard, but I would like to pick off some of the low
hanging fruit from the basic images.

I was wondering whether anyone already has some scripts that they use
for clearing out 'stuff'.

thanks in advance

Keith







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Keith Hodges
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2 Jan 2008 06:25






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Documentation options


I am looking to improve the options that we have available for in-image
documentation.

My first idea was to disable the compiler for methods of some classes,
overriding #compilerClass to return a slightly tweaked version of Null,
does this. However it only works for instance side methods.  Is it
possible to override #compilerClass for class side methods too. I assume
not, but I wonder if anyone knows for sure.

Secondly, my non-compiled non-smalltalk methods really trouble the
source code formatter. Can this be can be turned off on a per-class
basis too?

My second idea is a little more radical, but I think it could be useful.

I suggest giving the character $˚ a minor syntactical role, I fear the
floods of objections, but I will suggest the idea anyway, just in case
people have similar or useful alternatives to propose.

If the compiler only compiled code a) up to the first occurrence of $˚
if it is preceded by a CR, or b) up to and including a $˚ if followed by
a CR then the following would be possible...

A method such as this

myComplexMethod˚

explanation of complex method...

Shows up in the method browser next to the method it documents.

and a method such as this

myComplexMethod

^self

˚
Arbitrary documentation here....

===

I shall now duck and dodge the snowballs

Keith







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Keith Hodges
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2 Jan 2008 07:28






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Re: Documentation options


A slightly less radical solution which would offer the same benefit
would be if the compiler stopped parsing if it encountered six or so
comment quotes on a line like so. (perhaps this could be reduced to two)

""""""

I was asked what problem this is solving...

1. In particular I find it difficult to provide code snippets in method
comments which work via select and do-it. particularly if these code
snippets are themselves commented. I think that tutorial type
documentation would benefit from this facility.

1b. Also I have a habit of putting test code in comments at the bottom
of my methods, but again I can't comment or use quote characters in this
code.

2. In some circumstances it is useful to use methods to hold data,
however the restriction that that data be valid smalltalk code is a pain
in some situations... i.e. the scripts in the dev image script manager
are maintained and generated from methods. However they have to be
manually pre-processed into valid smalltalk code escaping quotes and so
forth.

3. This scheme allows packages to have their own script manager like
documentation as classes within existing browser tools.

Keith







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Amos
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2 Jan 2008 08:06






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Re: Documentation options


I guess what makes me reluctant to agree to the suggestions of having
more special characters with special syntactical meaning is that it
would only serve to complicate a language, one of whose most beautiful
aspects is its simplicity... I'm afraid it a) might become a slippery
slope for more of the same, and b) would make translation/portability
between different flavours of Smalltalk more difficult.

Just out of curiosity (not that I'd advocate this), would an
equivalent of the distinction between line comments and block
comments, e.g. in Java:

... some code ...
/* This is a block comment
   spanning multiple lines, including
   ... some more code ...
   // and even containing line comments
*/
... yet more code ...

give you what you're after?

Have you considered using other delimiters (such as curly brackets)
within comments to allow "double-click-and-do-it" execution?

Are you absolutely sure that class comments and protocols for "test
methods" won't do the job? In my experience, classes that are so
complex they need additional "documentation" should be broken down or,
if that's not at all possible, they should be thoroughly documented in
the class comment, with possible references in the methods (simply
"see class comment" should suffice). And class comments aren't parsed,
the code doesn't necessarily have to be valid, etc. Similarly,
consider breaking methods that absolutely need comments between lines
of code into smaller methods, so that you'll only need method comments
(even if those methods are only meant for testing/demonstration
purposes). But then, you probably knew people were going to suggest
that ;-)

Documentation for tutorials shouldn't necessarily all be in the code,
imho, there should be some accompanying medium like webpages or a PDF
or something (or a class comment?).

I realise this doesn't address all you were after, but maybe it'll at
least give you a few alternatives to consider =o)

On 1/2/08, Keith Hodges <keith_hodges <at> yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> A slightly less radical solution which would offer the same benefit
> would be if the compiler stopped parsing if it encountered six or so
> comment quotes on a line like so. (perhaps this could be reduced to two)
>
> """"""
>
> I was asked what problem this is solving...
>
> 1. In particular I find it difficult to provide code snippets in method
> comments which work via select and do-it. particularly if these code
> snippets are themselves commented. I think that tutorial type
> documentation would benefit from this facility.
>
> 1b. Also I have a habit of putting test code in comments at the bottom
> of my methods, but again I can't comment or use quote characters in this
> code.
>
> 2. In some circumstances it is useful to use methods to hold data,
> however the restriction that that data be valid smalltalk code is a pain
> in some situations... i.e. the scripts in the dev image script manager
> are maintained and generated from methods. However they have to be
> manually pre-processed into valid smalltalk code escaping quotes and so
> forth.
>
> 3. This scheme allows packages to have their own script manager like
> documentation as classes within existing browser tools.
>
> Keith
>
>
>







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