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Amir Michail | 1 Nov 2007 02:25
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another killer app for scala

Hi,

I think it would be great for this:

http://www.techcrunch.com/2007/10/30/details-revealed-google-opensocial-to-be-common-apis-for-building-social-apps/

Maybe even to generate javascript in this context a la gwt.

Amir
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Michael Campbell | 1 Nov 2007 13:04
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Re: another killer app for scala

On Oct 31, 2007 9:25 PM, Amir Michail <amichail@...> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I think it would be great for this:
>
> http://www.techcrunch.com/2007/10/30/details-revealed-google-opensocial-to-be-common-apis-for-building-social-apps/
>
> Maybe even to generate javascript in this context a la gwt.

What's the "application" here?  Are you talking about Scala being
used, with that API to produce... what?    Social Networking is not an
application (though many sites have tried to make it so); it's a
feature /for/ an application.  (IMO, naturally)

--

-- 
Zawinski's Law: Every program attempts to expand until it can read
mail. Those programs which cannot so expand are replaced by ones which
can. -- Jamie Zawinski
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Normen Müller | 1 Nov 2007 13:47
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Re: newbie question


On Oct 29, 2007, at 7:34 PM, Bill Venners wrote:

> Hi Normen,
>
> On Oct 29, 2007, at 11:25 AM, Normen Müller wrote:
>
>> So, thank you all for helping me to get my first steps on the  
>> ground w/ Scala!  Now I feel much better and affirmed to keep on  
>> posting such ``newbie questions'' to this list.  It's true, this  
>> list responses quick and helpful!  And by the way, yes I know how  
>> it feels in the morning w/o coffee, that's more than a reasonable  
>> excuse ;-)
>>
> Speaking of first steps, I don't believe anyone pointed you to the  
> First Steps in Scala article:
>
> http://www.artima.com/scalazine/articles/steps.html

Nice page, thanks!

   /nm

>
> Thanks.
>
> Bill
>
>
>> Thank you all, now it's my turn to keep on learning Scala and
(Continue reading)

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David Pollak | 1 Nov 2007 14:37
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Re: another killer app for scala



On 11/1/07, Michael Campbell <michael.campbell-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote:
On Oct 31, 2007 9:25 PM, Amir Michail <amichail-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I think it would be great for this:
>
> http://www.techcrunch.com/2007/10/30/details-revealed-google-opensocial-to-be-common-apis-for-building-social-apps/
>
> Maybe even to generate javascript in this context a la gwt.


What's the "application" here?  Are you talking about Scala being
used, with that API to produce... what?    Social Networking is not an
application (though many sites have tried to make it so); it's a
feature /for/ an application.  (IMO, naturally)

Okay, I'm old.  I was around for the first "Killer App" (VisiCalc) I poo-pooed it as a fad (this was long before I sat down to eat some crow by writing a spreadsheet.)  My contention was that the UCSD pascal system for the Apple ][ was the real killer app.

I had more than 1 discussion with Steve Jobs and other folks at NeXT about what the killer app would be that would launch the NextStep platform.  We all knew it wasn't Mesa (the spreadsheet I wrote).  A bunch of folks thought it was Interface Builder (this was when PowerBuilder was driving a lot of Windows 3.1 sales) and others thought it was Mail (NextStep had a multi-media email applications that lives on in its almost original form on Mac OS X.)  There's never been a killer app for NextStep/OS X.

I did a series of presentations a year back on Domain Specific Languages.  On of my contentions was that a DSL drove the adoption of each major technology advance in personal computing:
- Apple ][ - VisiCalc (spreadsheets being a domain specific language for expressing a lot of stuff)
- DOS - 1-2-3
- Mac - PageMaker (a DSL, mainly graphical)
- Windows 3.1 - PowerBuilder (oddly enough, a DSL for writing CRUD applications)
- 32 Bit OSes (OS/2, Windows NT, Linux) - HTML

It kinda broke down with the 32 bit OSes.  It's pretty clear that the browser and the Internet drove a lot of adoption of 32 bit OSes (and the availability of true multi-media.)

I'm beginning to, instead, think that the killer app may have been a combination of interpersonal communication and a tool or tools to facilitate that.  VisiCalc and 1-2-3 became the language that people used to communicate complex financial relationships.  They used sneaker-net and over-head projectors to collaborate on those ideas.

PageMaker was a tool for creating communications.  They were generally multicast communications (magazines, newsletters).  But, PageMaker allowed an explosion of communications offerings (look at the number of magazines available 2 years before PageMaker and look at it 2 years after PageMaker.)

What HTML enabled was a default way for folks to create and broadcast content that was much cheaper than paper and much more accessible.  There was real, hardcore ability to create a home page and tell the world what-ever you wanted to tell them.  Intersect this with email and IM and you've got a communication and collaboration system that would have been unthinkable even by the pioneers of the Internet.

I tend to agree with Amir in the abstract that the next killer app will be built around community and communication (and I think that real-time collaboration will be a big part of this as well, but I've been saying that since I built the first collaborative spreadsheet back in 1997.)  The thing that social networks have done is aggregate a lot of users in one place.  Not having to remember yet another set of credentials is wicked important.  Being able to get someone else to use a tool/feature/thing without doing anything other than asking your Vampire to bite a pre-existing friend (and you've got a list) is a very low barrier to entry.

I whole-heartedly agree with Michael's contention that the framework and plumbing for building the communications, community, collaboration thing is not the killer app itself.  Killer apps are iPods.  You press play and music comes out of the headphones.  The killer app is something that has a graduated set of rewards for the graduated set of effort that the end user has to engage in.

It's also unclear if Scala needs a killer app.  Martin and his team have been putting one foot in front of the other and making amazing progress recruiting people into the community.  Most folks who spend time with Java beyond writing code from 9-5 know that Scala exists (this is a radical change from 12 months ago.)  The Java world is looking around for something else and new and better.  Some folks have moved to Ruby/Rails.  Other folks are hoping Java 7 or Java 8 will solve the problems with Java.

My first thing in the morning 2 cents.

Thanks,

David
 

--
Zawinski's Law: Every program attempts to expand until it can read
mail. Those programs which cannot so expand are replaced by ones which
can. -- Jamie Zawinski



--
lift, the secure, simple, powerful web framework
http://liftweb.net
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Amir Michail | 1 Nov 2007 15:12
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Re: another killer app for scala

On 11/1/07, Michael Campbell <michael.campbell@...> wrote:
> On Oct 31, 2007 9:25 PM, Amir Michail <amichail@...> wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > I think it would be great for this:
> >
> > http://www.techcrunch.com/2007/10/30/details-revealed-google-opensocial-to-be-common-apis-for-building-social-apps/
> >
> > Maybe even to generate javascript in this context a la gwt.
>
>
> What's the "application" here?  Are you talking about Scala being
> used, with that API to produce... what?    Social Networking is not an
> application (though many sites have tried to make it so); it's a
> feature /for/ an application.  (IMO, naturally)
>

I'm using "killer app" in a loose sense of the term.   I'm sure you
know what I mean.

Amir

>
> --
> Zawinski's Law: Every program attempts to expand until it can read
> mail. Those programs which cannot so expand are replaced by ones which
> can. -- Jamie Zawinski
>
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Tiago Antao | 1 Nov 2007 15:20
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Drug modeling in Scala

Hi,

For anyone interested in following a modeling of malarial drug 
resistance in Scala, I have written about my initial drug model and the 
DSL that goes with it. It is available here:
http://tiago.org/ps/2007/11/01/modeling-drugs-in-scala/

--

-- 
tiagoantao@...
http://tiago.org/ps
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Amir Michail | 1 Nov 2007 15:33
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Re: another killer app for scala

On 11/1/07, David Pollak <feeder.of.the.bears@...> wrote:
> ...
>
> It's also unclear if Scala needs a killer app.  Martin and his team have
> been putting one foot in front of the other and making amazing progress
> recruiting people into the community.  Most folks who spend time with Java
> beyond writing code from 9-5 know that Scala exists (this is a radical
> change from 12 months ago.)  The Java world is looking around for something
> else and new and better.  Some folks have moved to Ruby/Rails.  Other folks
> are hoping Java 7 or Java 8 will solve the problems with Java.
>

There's something quite specific that can be done to promote Scala
more in web apps -- namely, getting it to work with gwt.

Amir

> My first thing in the morning 2 cents.
>
> Thanks,
>
> David
>
> > --
> > Zawinski's Law: Every program attempts to expand until it can read
> > mail. Those programs which cannot so expand are replaced by ones which
> > can. -- Jamie Zawinski
> >
>
>
>
> --
>  lift, the secure, simple, powerful web framework
> http://liftweb.net
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David Pollak | 1 Nov 2007 16:26
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Re: Drug modeling in Scala

Tiago,

Nice stuff.

I'd suggest a slight modification in syntax:

Compound create "Sulfadoxine"
Compound abbreviation "S"
Compound half_life 116 //hours
Compound bio_availability 408 //1mg to nanoM

Becomes:

Compound create "Sulfadoxine" --> abbreviation -> "S" --> half_life -> 116.hours --> bio_availability 408.whatever_units

I think it's possible to make this happen without parenthesis.

Also, you might want to look at lift's net.liftweb.util.Helpers.TimeSpan class. It allows you to say things like 116.hours or 2.weeks.later

Thanks,

David


On 11/1/07, Tiago Antao <tiagoantao-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org> wrote:
Hi,

For anyone interested in following a modeling of malarial drug
resistance in Scala, I have written about my initial drug model and the
DSL that goes with it. It is available here:
http://tiago.org/ps/2007/11/01/modeling-drugs-in-scala/


--
tiagoantao-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org
http://tiago.org/ps




--
lift, the secure, simple, powerful web framework
http://liftweb.net
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Tiago Antao | 1 Nov 2007 16:49
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Re: Drug modeling in Scala

David Pollak wrote:
> Also, you might want to look at lift's net.liftweb.util.Helpers.TimeSpan class.  It allows you to say
things like 116.hours or 2.weeks.later

You read my mind. I was actually going to ask for suggestions about this 
issue.

THANKS!

--

-- 
tiagoantao@...
http://tiago.org/ps
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Alex Cruise | 1 Nov 2007 18:22
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Re: Drug modeling in Scala

Tiago Antao wrote:
> For anyone interested in following a modeling of malarial drug 
> resistance in Scala, I have written about my initial drug model and 
> the DSL that goes with it. It is available here:
> http://tiago.org/ps/2007/11/01/modeling-drugs-in-scala/
Looks pretty interesting... With respect to your comments on operator 
precedence, one of my recent "a ha!" moments was when I discovered the 
way operator precedence and associativity are done in Haskell (grep 
"infix" http://www.haskell.org/onlinereport/standard-prelude.html).

Now for the obligatory n00b question... What would preclude Scala from 
opening up its operator precedence and associativity rules in this way?

-0xe1a
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